[praveen_v]

Originally Posted by rajneeesh

Sure do Mpower but what irks me is that some people have carried out a villification campaign agains MSIL. They may well have had some bad experiences but is it correct to generalise the problems and paint the paricular model in black is not done. We should have an objective discussion on the pro's and cons

I dont think anyone is carrying out any campaign against MSIL, and there is nothing to gain by doing so. Everyone have their opinion and are sharing it with others. It is up to the reader to take/leave the opinion of others, it's an opinion after all. Opinion varies person to person and a pro for me might be a con in your view.

When people invest so much money, it is only natural to feel disappointed if they dont find it to match their expectations. And most important of all people want these messages to reach maruti, and want them to do something about it.

[pgsagar]

[quote=praveen_v;837116]

And people still say, "It's a HONDA. It cannot go wrong!!"

I am tired of the way some guys stick out for Honda badge blindly. It's a good product which no one denies. But not as great as it has been made out to be by some Honda fanatics. Ironically, these fanatics are mostly NHC owners. OHC, Civic and Accord owners appear much more mature and sensible.

Go to any Honda service centre and you will find several Honda cars awaiting various repairs. Those cars don't go there to sign visitors' book. So my point is, Honda cars break down, too. This myth of " You can never go wrong with a Honda" is too far-fetched.

People go soft on Honda complains, too. A guy I know has had lots of issues with his OHC but for some strange reason he would sweep that under carpet. The same guys also owns a beat-up Indica for running errands, ferrying guests and this poor Indica is virtually raped by one and all. It has held up pretty tight so far but if any small thing goes wrong with it, he kinda shouts from rooftops about Tata quality. I don't know why some of us Indians keep this Honda / Toyota flag flying so high.

Auto magazines are the cheerleaders of this jambooree. Anything from Honda, Toyota, Skoda is a WOWWWWW!!!!!! They roll at the new car's feet ( er...wheels ) and do lot of song and dance about it. Also for them newer is always better, no matter how crappy it looks.

[vkochar]

@pgsagar - You have a few points there which I agree on.

Even I feel TATA is criticised a bit too much and when it comes to these Big Brands we tend to go a bit soft.

Our Car Magazines are all ga-ga over Maruti I feel. I was reading the SX4 long term report in an old ACI I found in my office today and the guy could not stop praising the SX4 though he did say it was a big time fuel guzzler but that's about it.

[diabloo]

NHC is tried & tested product around the world. The owners in India have first hand experience and they share their honest opinion. They are not born make profits for Honda . All they need is a very good car - Light on pocket, Pleasure to drive, No Failures, No Annoyance. NHC offers that .

Originally Posted by pgsagar

It's a good product which no one denies. But not as great as it has been made out to be by some Honda fanatics. Ironically, these fanatics are mostly NHC owners.

[ankit.jhamb]

i think FE is one area where SX4 needs improvement.

OT::BTW i hope the baleno was a much better product with respect to fuel efficiency.

[Mpower]

Originally Posted by VBV

Its also about statistical representation. As I've mentioned in my post : http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...tml#post836112

I really doubt if any Internet forum can do a proper statistical representation.

VBV

We have JD power if you want statistics. Someone care to dig out JD power numbers please.

[manikjeet]

From the day one we have got NHC's their has been no problem at all and i can say because we have 13 of them

and all are maintained at the A>S>S
and one of them had a roll over accident and one head on collision and it to runs like a dream

all return a decent of fe of 12 km/l to 15km/l

and max spend on a regular service is around 1000 bucks

and not a single one has any problem

all i can say I love nhc

[spadival]

Originally Posted by diabloo

NHC is tried & tested product around the world.

erm.. Since when did Thailand, Philipines, Pakistan, India and Malaysia constitue "Around the world" ?? Please be a bit more realistic and admit that the NHC market is limited to South Asia unlike other products from the Honda stable.

pgsagar is right. Even I feel NHC fan boys are the loudest and they actually give a bad name to the Honda brand. I think there should be a self imposed limit on gross exaggeration and fawning over the NHC !!

[ankit.jhamb]

Originally Posted by GTO

Yup, sent directly to certain key personnel. Somehow, no auto manufacturer ever replies back to me. Something tells me that all of them are mighty pissed off

OT::try sending it from different email ids..May be they will reply once they see somebody new complaining

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by ankit.jhamb

i think FE is one area where SX4 needs improvement.
OT::BTW i hope the baleno was a much better product with respect to fuel efficiency.

See, the problem is that we want everything in a car, and there is no car which has everything and can please everyone.

Before the SX4 came out, we criticised MUL for the puny tyres in their cars (eg. BalenoLxi had 165/80/R13), the build quality (their cars weighed lesser compared to peers), the low GC (Baleno scraping badly-built-humps with more than 4 people on board), not enough power (Baleno detuned to 91bhp from earlier 94bhp). And most of these were attributed to MUL's gameplan of targetting better FE.

And when MUL addressed all of these concerns (16" tyres which cars in even a segment above don't have, better build quality leading to a kerb weight of 1200kg, the best GC in its class, 102bhp of power etc) with the SX4, we now want FE also. It does not work that way.

The Baleno with a weight of 975kg, 91bhp, puny tyres etc gives me 12kmpl in Chennai with 100% a/c. Now, if you add 200kgs to the car, increase the power by some 10bhp and slip on wider tyres and still expect it to give 12kmpl, then that is practically impossible. You get some, you loose some. And this is true for every car.

You want FE ? Then go for something like the NHC - lightweight, low on power which is just about enough for puttering around the city and jsut about adequate for the normal highway user.

P.S.: I am not saying that they trawled our forum, looked at our concerns, went to the drawing board and came up with the SX4 as an answer to our prayers.

[ankit.jhamb]

totally agree with you on this supremebaleno.

12 kmpl with ac is not a bad.
i know that there is no single product which will have all the features.
There will be problems in NHC for some(lightweight etc) and in SX4 for some(fe,weight,build quality etc).
but cant we have a single car which fulfill all the requirements. i know that this discussion is going somewhere else.but still i think we should continue.

[Rash001]

Hi i am now having my 2nd Maruti Car, and it is a swift vdi. My comments on this issue, is yes Maruti is the VFM car in the country, but to achieve this they are taking cost cutting a tad too much. Their engines and gear boxes are great. Rest is where the cost cutting gets in. To start with,
very thin gauge steel is being used.
stock tyres are smaller in most variants
Plastic quality is down. They use clips in most places to hold things, these clips weaken over time, resulting in rattles.

They are market leaders and the way the dzire is being booked, they will still continue to behave in the same old manner. They dont have a reason to correct their mistakes, for we seem to have got used to them and have been accepting them. One thing is fore sure, if i am going to buy a car which is above 6 lakhs, it will not be a Maruthi.. They are good for only smaller , practical cars.

[suman]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

The Baleno with a weight of 975kg, 91bhp, puny tyres etc gives me 12kmpl in Chennai with 100% a/c. Now, if you add 200kgs to the car, increase the power by some 10bhp and slip on wider tyres and still expect it to give 12kmpl, then that is practically impossible. You get some, you loose some. And this is true for every car.

You want FE ? Then go for something like the NHC

Wow, well said SB. I'm really happy to see that your outlook appears to have changed drastically. There was a time when the forum would castigate a Ford Fiesta 1.6 with 101 bhp for "low" FE even if it gave in excess of 10.5-11 kmpl in city conditions. And time & again, the Baleno & the NHC were the benchmarks for comparison.

I'm really glad to see the opinions are changing, even if it is only to justify a product from the Maruti stable

[vnabhi]

Originally Posted by suman

Wow, well said SB. I'm really happy to see that your outlook appears to have changed drastically. There was a time when the forum would castigate a Ford Fiesta 1.6 with 101 bhp for "low" FE even if it gave in excess of 10.5-11 kmpl in city conditions. And time & again, the Baleno & the NHC were the benchmarks for comparison.

I'm really glad to see the opinions are changing, even if it is only to justify a product from the Maruti stable

Well said, Suman. I also appreciate SB's point of view. I totally agree with pgsagar's view of auto mags going gaga over some manufacturer's products.

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by GTO

Yup, sent directly to certain key personnel. Somehow, no auto manufacturer ever replies back to me. Something tells me that all of them are mighty pissed off

Ha ha rather. if they acknowledge then thats more damaging for them