[Gildarts]

Typical Indian scenerio - 'Be stupid. Break rules. Lose life or limb. Then claim compensation and try to extort money and benefits from the other party or government'. Anniversary of Amristar Dussera train tragedy is nearing. Gill = Loco driver. Nothing's gonna change in this country as long as discipline is not inculcated into our minds from a young age and people understand the need to obey rules.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by Neil Roy

It is all very easy to say that necessary approvals were not accorded or obtained. In our country, to get the paper work done is a herculean task in itself indicative of a bigger malaise. IF we are to take any random hospital or school or even govt buildings in our country there will be at least two or three basic "approvals" which are not in order. ... ... ...

Yes, well said and point taken.

[RaviK]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

..Some of us have helped to reduce this language here on Team-BHP. On the one hand, we may be grammar Nazis, but, on the other, it is the thinking that it is important ..

In a world increasingly leaning towards binary traits, nuance is not often appreciated. When sensation is required, you need extreme terminology. Folks looking at details, analyzing the sequences/patterns, trying to find root cause/plausibility/inputs to determine a logical outcome of an event/phenomenon are outcasts in this binary world order

The automotive reporting too, has been infected by this trend to an extent. As others have pointed out in earlier posts (on Zirakpur accident), the emphasis is on creating some sensation, to implicate the Volvo (i.e. big car, rich brat), other details on the victim, his car, exact circumstances of accident are secondary items, nuances that need not be paid that much attention !!

[bigron]

So this is how it works in India.

Locals have been killed. Someone needs to be blamed to pacify the local populace and the political pressure. Cause of death is of no importance right now.

It is also not of much consequence at this stage if the permissions were sought/ rules followed/ barricades installed and marshals present.

Police had to register a FIR to set the system in motion. The locals along with their leaders would have gathered and created pressure. Plus there would have been state pressure to 'do something about it'.

Coming to culpability, largely there is no case against him or the organizers BUT he and the organizers can be booked for 304A Death by negligence. However, they should be able to have it quashed from the HC eventually. I am saying this with the understanding that all permissions were sought and rules followed and they have evidence of the same.
If they have no permission than they can definitely be booked for 304 culpable homicide. And as I have read in preceding posts, it seems he has been already booked for it. He must be looking at immediate bail.

I read some where that the CM office has denied giving any sanctions/permissions for the same. Not good for him or the organizers.

Best bet is to take bail, let the heat die out and then approach the local leaders and police and try having it compromised.
He should not let the organizers single himself out.

[airbus]

Rally deaths: Govt says no permission given for Barmer car rally

The Rajasthan chief minister’s office on Sunday said that no permission was given for the Barmer car rally during which three persons were killed on Saturday.

Chief minister Ashok Gehlot took cognisance of the deaths on Sunday evening and district collector Himanshu Gupta and SP Shiv Raj Meena were issued Awaiting Posting Orders (APO). The Divisional Commissioner was directed to present a report to the Home Department within seven days.

“No permission was given to the rally, neither security arrangements were made for the rally,” the CMO said in a statement.

If this is true, then organizers need to be held accountable.

[Ricky_63]

Originally Posted by airbus

Rally deaths: Govt says no permission given for Barmer car rally

If this is true, then organizers need to be held accountable.

A car rally can only be held after clearances from relevant authorities. It's impossible that the permissions were not in place.

The statement made by the CM (if he did) is just appeasement! Period

[iamwhatiam]

Originally Posted by superbad

I only have empathy for the deceased lady & the child, zero for the man riding the motorcycle. Had organizers not taken adequate precautions, other villagers would've also entered (by force/mistake) into the rally area. Why only this individual? It's because of his idiocy coupled with the natural tendency of most two wheeler riders to casually flout rules. His was good riddance, but feel bad for his wife & child, & rest of his surviving family.
Might as well add that the compensation demanded by them is Rs 2 crore + government job. Which smacks of sheer greed & typical money exhorting tactics. The fellow riding the bike would've never earned that much in his entire life (other than by selling ancestral lands or something), I doubt he had an insurance policy worth even 5 % of the amount. The police also need to check his driving license & bike insurance. He was breaking rules just by having 3 seated on the bike, that too without helmets. Our country is better off without such idiots.
Poor Gaurav & his co driver. You've got to feel sorry for them.

As a long-time reader, a recent joinee, and an enthusiastic car-scene follower, I certainly didn't anticipate that this will be my first post in this fantastic forum. I've thought long and hard about this, however, the tone-deafness of this particular post rankled me enough to write this.

It is not OK to be so easily critical of the dead. And it's especially not OK to criticize their family for demanding compensation and calling it 'extortion'. What would you prefer they do? Silently accept their fate and move on from the deaths of three of their family members, and suffer emotionally and physically for the rest of their lives?

Having said that, it looks like Gaurav is an unfortunate victim of this situation. Hopefully, he's able to get the required help to move on from this incident and re-focus on his career.

[bblost]

Its such a sad and completely avoidable tragedy.

A Mahindra event I participated back in 2017:

Originally Posted by bblost

This was the scariest part of the event. Nothing is worse than coming up at full speed only to see a bunch of idiots standing with their smart phones trying to record a video.
The organizers kept asking them to move but they kept breaking ranks with no regard for their own safety.
Attachment 1613657
Attachment 1613658

These bystanders just don't listen. Everyone kept shouting at them to move away and give space. But they would inevitably come back right into the path of a vehicle climbing up.

I almost needed a change of pants when I flew up the hill and saw these guys with their damn cellphones recording a video.

[landcruiser123]

I was expecing this from Gelhot. With events on a national scale with many big individuals and corporates involved, I'm willing to bet that the organizers did their due diligence. There must have been some lapse in the government machinery. But it is very easy and convenient for the government to blame the organizers.

^This is what I meant in my previous post. I'm not against motorsports, tennis, cricket, space exploration etc

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

Motorsport racing in a country where thousands starve everyday? I'm sure this incident will not go well with the public.

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

I think I know what you mean: a society in which people expect everything to be provided and done for them. Well, that's true of some, but with a small or a big 'S'...

Don't you remember one prominent figure who promised INR 72k a year for the poor on the election campaign?

Respected Sir, as a senior member you know better than me that India is 2 countries in one. We've got a reasonably well-off middle class in the urban cities and extremely poor villagers. The former needs an entrepreneurial mindset to survive the competition, but the latter still relies on the state for a lot of things. The majority of India are poor- that is the unfortunate truth.

[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by bblost

Its such a sad and completely avoidable tragedy.

A Mahindra event I participated back in 2017:


These bystanders just don't listen. Everyone kept shouting at them to move away and give space. But they would inevitably come back right into the path of a vehicle climbing up.

I almost needed a change of pants when I flew up the hill and saw these guys with their damn cellphones recording a video.

At the risk of being labeled callous - seeing your photos, I am surprised Indian motorsport managed to be fatality free all these years was inspite of our Indian instincts!


It seems the law of averages caught up, unfortunately taking Indian motorsport's finest down with it. What a crying shame.


That said, I think we are underestimating the villagers here - they are NOT fools. Anyone who has seen such rallies would know who was at fault even if they would eventually close ranks and demand for stiff compensation.


This is in that sense no different from a train hitting someone crossing the tracks - no villager blames the train for hitting a pedestrian that messed up their crossing and came plumb in the path of the train. But here, the high profile of the event makes it fair game for all sorts of politics to be played or rich vs poor narratives to be created.

[bigron]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

This is in that sense no different from a train hitting someone crossing the tracks - no villager blames the train for hitting a pedestrian that messed up their crossing and came plumb in the path of the train. But here, the high profile of the event makes it fair game for all sorts of politics to be played or rich vs poor narratives to be created.

It is different when a train mows down a person walking on a track at a time and place where he should not have. In railways compensation is granted based on the concept of 'untoward incident'. Walking on a train path at a place that is not manned knowing that a train might come does not constitute 'untoward incident'.

Secondly, it is illegal to walk on the train tracks and amounts to trespassing, S147 Railways act.

Without going into details, compensation under railways in a tricky subject but is different compared to a death that occurs at a private event on government land.

[Pkumarblore]

Originally Posted by Samba

A very tragic incident indeed.

Really do not know who will be blamed now- Gaurav Gill or the marshal/organizer's. I do not find any fault of Gaurav Gill. The marshal's should have been stricter.

I do not expect the villagers to understand the risks involved in motor-sports, so the organizers have to take care of it.

As I read in the newspaper in Bangalore, it was mentioned that the organizers did not have the requisite permission to conduct the rally. If that's true, then the organizers shall be held responsible. And I also thought, all the drivers involved are professionals rallying in different parts of the worlds, and Gaurav Gill is a popular name. So I guess they or their managers' do a basic check on permissions obtained before participating. But its sad indeed. 3 lives lost due to ignorance and negligence.

[premjit]

Very sad to see this. Loss of lives is clearly not acceptable and surely Gaurav cannot be blamed for this. He is a sportsperson competing on a field of play. Its up to the organizers to provide a safe environment to spectators as well as competitors. However, at times, the lack of reason on part of individuals galls me to no end. I am a marathon runner and even in big cordoned off events, have seen vehicles drive onto the running track. Lack of any sense on personal safety is the prime cause.

[rajvardhanraje]

In my opinion the blame lies on both parties, the victims for ignoring the warnings and the organizers for not obtaining all required permissions.

Victims: Considering what all we have read till now, they were given ample warnings but they defied them and went on the track anyway. It is indeed a daunting task to make the locals comply to the rules in such scenarios. I believe this is something they could have avoided. Plus riding on the track triple seat with no helmets also further adds to the risk.

Organizers: It is not practically possible to put up barricades throughout the track. Dissuading the locals and keeping them away is also not easy. The most they can do is warn them multiple times but controlling each and every person trying to enter the track is not feasible. Now coming to the permissions. If they did not obtain the required ones from the local authorities, they are also to blame.

Drivers: I definitely feel sad for them. They have been booked for offences with no fault of theirs and have to face the brunt. The permissions part is something that the organizer has to take care of. Avoiding the victims at such high speeds is not possible.

The local politicos are bound to support the locals in such incidents. This event is surely going to affect motor sports going ahead.

[Thad E Ginathom]

I don't suppose it counts in Indian law, although its essence may have been adopted, but there is a famous case in English civil (tort) law which says that if a person goes to a dangerous place, they have no grounds for complaint of they get hurt.

Even in simple common sense, it makes, errr, sense.