[sups]

I was in search of a diesel hatch (ABS must) with good back seat comfort as my wife and son will be driven a lot in the city by my driver. In that context had a short test drive of Liva GD+SP. I own a Getz 1.3L petrol. And driving Liva for 2 minutes tells me that Liva is much easier car to drive in city, in fact excellent drivability.

Unfortunately Liva diesel does not have a tacho. So the salesman offered me a test drive of Etios diesel (top variant). Surprisingly, I found it easier to drive than even the Liva due to the excellent gear shift it had. Liva diesel had a slight rubbery gear shift, but etios diesel gear shift was much better. So, a few questions to vid:

1) Does Liva diesel has inferior gear shift compared to Etios diesel?
2) Liva has a shorter wheel base. Does that lead to any inferior ride comfort (particularly in back seat) compared to Etios?
3) Salesman said there is no underbody coating done in Liva by default? Can somebody please confirm this?
4) Can toyota put gaskets at the doors at an extra cost?
5) The rear seats are thin. Is it possible to some cushion to it at some extra cost?

[amalji]

Originally Posted by sups

1) Does Liva diesel has inferior gear shift compared to Etios diesel?

Since, I own an Etios and my mother own a Liva, the gear shift did feel slightly different on the Liva. But, the shifts are good though.

Originally Posted by sups

2) Liva has a shorter wheel base. Does that lead to any inferior ride comfort (particularly in back seat) compared to Etios?

Yes, it does affect the ride quality. Longer wheelbase means better stability and comfort. Etios has best in class wheel base ( even longer than the Manza )

Originally Posted by sups

3) Salesman said there is no underbody coating done in Liva by default? Can somebody please confirm this?

If my memory is correct, Underbody sound dampening is done on both the diesel variants. But, I'll do a re-check on it when I go home next week.

Originally Posted by sups

4) Can toyota put gaskets at the doors at an extra cost?

Not for now. But, having used the car for around 10,000 kms, I can assure you that this design won't harm you at all.

Originally Posted by sups

5) The rear seats are thin. Is it possible to some cushion to it at some extra cost?

It can be done, if you contact upholestry people who do OEM fit. I guess, Karlsson is a good option. But, they are available only in Bangalore, I guess. They can even do good quality arm rests for the rear seat.

Stanley is another option. But, they might not allow too much of customization.

[Vid6639]

Originally Posted by sups

Unfortunately Liva diesel does not have a tacho. So the salesman offered me a test drive of Etios diesel (top variant). Surprisingly, I found it easier to drive than even the Liva due to the excellent gear shift it had. Liva diesel had a slight rubbery gear shift, but etios diesel gear shift was much better. So, a few questions to vid:

1) Does Liva diesel has inferior gear shift compared to Etios diesel?
2) Liva has a shorter wheel base. Does that lead to any inferior ride comfort (particularly in back seat) compared to Etios?
3) Salesman said there is no underbody coating done in Liva by default? Can somebody please confirm this?
4) Can toyota put gaskets at the doors at an extra cost?
5) The rear seats are thin. Is it possible to some cushion to it at some extra cost?

1. Actually both the Etios and Liva D have identical gear shifts. There's no change. Try seeing a new car in showroom. The TD car is most likely to have been abused causing the poor gear shifts. The Etios might have been less abused.

2. Ride comfort does not change for both since suspension setup is similar. What changes is the wheelbase as mentioned by amalji. The shorter wheelbase of the Liva makes a it easier in city but on the highway it feels a little less settled compared to the Etios. On highways the Etios will feel a bit more stable compared to the Liva. During my TD there was a difference but I attribute it to the different tyres. The Liva Gd with 14" 175's whereas Etios had 15" 185's.

3. 2012 models have underbody coating as well as different shade interiors (black new compared to grey old). Extra coating for better sound insulation can also be added.

4. YOu can't fit extra gaskets and you dont need them as there is no issue to water seepage. Only problem is dust accumulation in the door sides.

5. Custom made seat covers with extra cushioning can be added on. That said the rear seats are pretty comfy.

[sups]

Originally Posted by Vid6639

2. Ride comfort does not change for both since suspension setup is similar. What changes is the wheelbase as mentioned by amalji. The shorter wheelbase of the Liva makes a it easier in city but on the highway it feels a little less settled compared to the Etios.

Thanks a lot Amalji & Vid for your very useful responses.

Liva GD even without safety pack has ABS and costs 6.36L on road in Pune. If I need ABS in Etios, I have go for SP. And Etios GD+SP costs about 7.93L in Pune. The difference is a huge 1.6L, of course I get airbags, little extra legroom, slightly better ride and bigger boot. It seems I will settle for Liva GD based on the cost factor. Ofcourse, Figo test drive is remaining.

By the way, Vid since you own Figo, how to you rate the back seat ride of Figo compared to Liva/Etios in city?

[Vid6639]

Originally Posted by sups

By the way, Vid since you own Figo, how to you rate the back seat ride of Figo compared to Liva/Etios in city?

Sorry sups, I haven't sat in the back seat of the Liva and I have never ever sat in the back seat of my Figo as well.

From a driving perspective, the ride comfort is better in the Liva whereas the handling is better in the Figo. The Liva is a tad softer than the Figo which gives it better comfort over bad roads.

[lamborghini]

Originally Posted by sups

By the way, Vid since you own Figo, how to you rate the back seat ride of Figo compared to Liva/Etios in city?

Sorry to butt in, but personally, I feel that the back seat ride of the Figo is better - at speed. Having owned a Fiesta earlier, when we got the Liva, I was not a big fan of its ride. While it was great at city speeds, I found the Fiestas to be much better at higher speeds, where the Liva's suspension used to bounce a little bit more than I liked. It unnerved me while driving, and I am sure the passengers wouldn't like it - though it is apparently better than other hatchbacks.
However, when it comes down to space, the Liva trumps the Figo!

[amalji]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

Sorry to butt in, but personally, I feel that the back seat ride of the Figo is better - at speed. Having owned a Fiesta earlier, when we got the Liva, I was not a big fan of its ride. While it was great at city speeds, I found the Fiestas to be much better at higher speeds, where the Liva's suspension used to bounce a little bit more than I liked. It unnerved me while driving, and I am sure the passengers wouldn't like it - though it is apparently better than other hatchbacks.
However, when it comes down to space, the Liva trumps the Figo!

I too feel that figo's rear seat comfort is better than the liva. Liva offers better peppiness, drivability and ground clearance though.

[sups]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

Sorry to butt in, but personally, I feel that the back seat ride of the Figo is better - at speed. Having owned a Fiesta earlier, when we got the Liva, I was not a big fan of its ride. While it was great at city speeds, I found the Fiestas to be much better at higher speeds, where the Liva's suspension used to bounce a little bit more than I liked. It unnerved me while driving, and I am sure the passengers wouldn't like it - though it is apparently better than other hatchbacks.
However, when it comes down to space, the Liva trumps the Figo!

Thanks a ton. For me backs seat comfort is very important as my wife and son will be driven a lot in this car. But the travelling will be in the city only. I am going to check out figo this week. If figo rear suspension is better while travelling at less than 60 km/hr, then I will go for it. Figo is also cheaper, top end titanium coming to about 6.57L on road in Pune. Having said that I have become a fan of liva/etios steering. Its soooo nice in the city.

[lamborghini]

Originally Posted by amalji

I too feel that figo's rear seat comfort is better than the liva. Liva offers better peppiness, drivability and ground clearance though.

More legroom, and better FE as well!
Plus the engine should be more reliable, but our Fiesta is still going strong at 90+Kkms without any major engine troubles (a few minors ones were there)! Just switched over to synthetic oil in the middle, so at the moment, I'm quite pleased with Ford! Built tougher than a Toyota!

Originally Posted by sups

Thanks a ton. For me backs seat comfort is very important as my wife and son will be driven a lot in this car. But the travelling will be in the city only. I am going to check out figo this week. If figo rear suspension is better while travelling at less than 60 km/hr, then I will go for it. Figo is also cheaper, top end titanium coming to about 6.57L on road in Pune. Having said that I have become a fan of liva/etios steering. Its soooo nice in the city.

The liva steering is actually quite nice in the city! However, the Figo's steering is very good from an enthusiasts point of view.
What you will like about Ford suspensions in general, over a Toyota is that, even though they may not mask small bumps as well, at decent speeds, they will mask the bigger ones much better than a Toyota. So be prepared for that, and do check it out. Or maybe its just me preferring a stiff suspension car and ride, over the softer ones.

Either ways, this is going a little OT, so it might be best to continue in another thread meant more for the purpose of the Liva/Figo. What say? Will get better responses as well!

[sups]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

What you will like about Ford suspensions in general, over a Toyota is that, even though they may not mask small bumps as well, at decent speeds, they will mask the bigger ones much better than a Toyota. So be prepared for that, and do check it out. Or maybe its just me preferring a stiff suspension car and ride, over the softer ones.

Either ways, this is going a little OT, so it might be best to continue in another thread meant more for the purpose of the Liva/Figo. What say? Will get better responses as well!

Yes, fully agree. This discussion should have gone to the Liva/Figo thread . Totally forgot.

Your point on Liva/Figo suspension is very well explained. I will check it out during my test drive. Afterall we cannot get everything in one package.

[thoma]

One of my friend who owns a Liva D has reported that he consistently gets 20+ kmpl overall. Is this really matching with the experience of the Liva owners on our forum? I saw one person reporting 20 something at http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ml#post2649103

If that is the case, do we have a new competitor for the Micra/Indica/Beat/Swift in terms of FE amongst hatchbacks?

[amalji]

Originally Posted by thoma

One of my friend who owns a Liva D has reported that he consistently gets 20+ kmpl overall. Is this really matching with the experience of the Liva owners on our forum? I saw one person reporting 20 something at http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ml#post2649103

If that is the case, do we have a new competitor for the Micra/Indica/Beat/Swift in terms of FE amongst hatchbacks?

The ARAI mileage for Liva is 23.59 kmpl which is higher than Micra and Swift. In real life, you can expect around 20kmpl with consistent speeds in the range of 100 kmph @ 5th gear on highways.

PS: My mother owns a Liva Diesel

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by thoma

One of my friend who owns a Liva D has reported that he consistently gets 20+ kmpl overall. Is this really matching with the experience of the Liva owners on our forum?

Originally Posted by amalji

..In real life, you can expect around 20kmpl with consistent speeds in the range of 100 kmph @ 5th gear on highways.

If the car is NOT fully loaded, then driving in 5th for most of the time @ 100 kmph WITH A/C can get you a mileage more than the ARAI FE! I have noticed this with all cars I have driven on highways which includes a Wagon R Lxi, Swift D, Linea D, Punto D etc. With these conditions, I believe Liva can easily return a 23 kmpl on highways @ 100 kmph!

[amalji]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

If the car is NOT fully loaded, then driving in 5th for most of the time @ 100 kmph WITH A/C can get you a mileage more than the ARAI FE! I have noticed this with all cars I have driven on highways which includes a Wagon R Lxi, Swift D, Linea D, Punto D etc. With these conditions, I believe Liva can easily return a 23 kmpl on highways @ 100 kmph!

I should have mentioned that I drive mostly in Kerala highways where 'consistent cruising' includes occasional braking and accelerations as well. Add to that, the city traffic every 60 kms or so.

[thoma]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

If the car is NOT fully loaded, then driving in 5th for most of the time @ 100 kmph WITH A/C can get you a mileage more than the ARAI FE! I have noticed this with all cars I have driven on highways which includes a Wagon R Lxi, Swift D, Linea D, Punto D etc.

A bit off-topic, but since I am keen in finding out the most fuel efficient diesel hatch on road, under practical / normal driving conditions, I'll continue. I am wondering why the Beat diesel, being the FE king among diesels, alone is an exception to this! Nobody has claimed, at least in out forum, anywhere near to the Beat's ARAI figures of 25.XX. At the same time, as per reports available on the forum, the Liva, Micra, Swift, Figo all have exceeded the ARAI figures, on sedate drives.