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Old 24th June 2024, 15:46   #40666
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by BSASLR View Post
In Continuation with the above post on Risk Assessment:

Would not our minds start to develop what psychiatrist term as "Vicarious Traumatization" or Secondary Traumatization?

This can make our minds overcautious to potential danger, even in situations of minimal risk, thus leading to anxiety.

This will impair our existing abilities an may contribute to a error.

Those regular on this thread any tips how you assess risk types yet avoid exposure to potential anxiety? How do you personally find a balance
I concur with your view.

I have become extremely cautious to potential danger, though not leading to anxiety (most of the time).

I ride 2 wheelers always (Local and highways) and that adds to the element of risk.

In city traffic, while riding, I do become anxious when a heavy vehicle (bus or large truck) is right behind me. Over years (since decades) I have developed this habit of glancing at the RVMs very often (like once every 10 seconds). I also have Blind spot mirrors on all my vehicles and keep an eye on them too (especially when overtaking another vehicle)

So, with this habit of constantly glancing at the RVM (without having to move the head, I position myself such that I move my eyes only to glance the RVM. So there's no other physical movement such as turning the head). I am always aware of the vehicles behind me at any given point of time.

As I have a complete picture of the vehicles behind me, when ever there's a truck/bus behind me, I tend to get a bit anxious. I am aware that the brakes of many buses /trucks are not as robust/accurate as with the cars/2 wheelers and add to that the high seating position of the drivers could make us, the 2 wheelers less visible too in the larger frame of things.

I tend to allow the bus/truck to pass or I will overtake a couple of other slow-moving 2 wheelers just to put some other vehicles between me and the heavy vehicle.

In city, I don't overtake a bus / truck in heavy traffic as I have seen often someone scurrying across the road in front of slow moving heavy vehicle or some vehicles joining the road from across the lane.

Due to my habit of glancing the RVM and blind spot mirror at regular quick intervals, I believe I do have a 360 deg perspective of what's happening around me.

When overtaking I keep an eye on the front tyre of the other vehicle to see it's directional orientation (useful while overtaking a truck/bus), so I know if that bus/truck could possibly cross my path. As long as their front tyres are pointing straight, I am fine.

Having seen hundreds of accident videos on this thread, I know that I can take all the precautions in the world and still something can go wrong.

I am a stoic and I go by the philosophy that there are things in our control (such as our thoughts, behaviour, attitude, action) and there are things outside of our control, that's happening around us, say the weather, politics, someone else's behaviour, attitude and/or action to name a few). So, no matter how much we try, no matter how upset we get, or frustrated we become, we cannot change the things outside the reach of our control.

So, we take precautions, we stay alert, ride safely, we are considerate to other road users and still something can go wrong and tragedy might strike us. That's not in our hands. We just have to accept it as the card delt to us by destiny.

Note: @Brumby, You have put across the whole broad spectrum of RA in a very comprehensive manner. Well written, Sir.

Last edited by ashkamath : 24th June 2024 at 15:59.
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Old 24th June 2024, 15:46   #40667
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by ashkamath View Post
Shouldn't the slow moving cars not be on the fast lane?
- Enough information is not available to ascertain that whether other vehicles are moving slow or Scorpio is moving fast WRT allowed speed limit
- Baleno and the car with camera are in overtaking manoeuvre as per speed difference between them and Aura in middle lane. Hence they have the right to occupy right most lane
- Lane discipline followed by other cars before and after accident is remarkable.

Last edited by KarthikK : 24th June 2024 at 15:49.
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Old 24th June 2024, 16:10   #40668
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by krrisdrive View Post
- Enough information is not available to ascertain that whether other vehicles are moving slow or Scorpio is moving fast WRT allowed speed limit
- Baleno and the car with camera are in overtaking manoeuvre as per speed difference between them and Aura in middle lane. Hence they have the right to occupy right most lane
- Lane discipline followed by other cars before and after accident is remarkable.
Yes. That seems a plausible explanation. The 2 cars in fast lane could be in the process of overtaking the slower car in middle lane.
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Old 24th June 2024, 17:16   #40669
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BSASLR View Post
In Continuation with the above post on Risk Assessment:

If a person who goes through 25% of the Videos collected on this thread to assess possibilities of accident risk

Would not our minds start to develop what psychiatrist term as "Vicarious Traumatization" or Secondary Traumatization?

This can make our minds overcautious to potential danger, even in situations of minimal risk, thus leading to anxiety which is the beginning towards PTSD (not saying that these Videos will cause PTSD)

This will impair our existing abilities an may contribute to a error.

Those regular on this thread any tips how you assess risk types yet avoid exposure to potential anxiety? How do you personally find a balance
On the other hand, I feel this thread is a “reality check” of what can happen if things go wrong. Causing anxiety might sound like an extreme reaction to this thread. I remember this thread every time I go fast and try to keep my speed and control in check. There are always factors way out of your control and I hope nobody reading this thread is ever featured here - but I am 100% sure that this thread truly makes many of us more aware and responsible drivers. After all as they say, Driving is a privilege and not a Right. Lets enjoy the privilege the right way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashkamath View Post
Shouldn't the slow moving cars not be on the fast lane?
Agreed but you have to adapt to the “rules” or the lack of them of the land you are staying and driving in. Lane discipline is non-existent in India.

While I was driving across Europe, the most difficult thing to overcome in my mind was not the “left hand drive” orientation ; it was the fact that a long truck/trailer would NEVER come in the fast lane. While overtaking these trucks in the fast lane I always used to slow down thinking “what if” - but they did not and it took me time to get accustomed to this.

In India in any state, on any road lane discipline (and lane makers) is non existent (though I must say, i was pleasantly surprised to see it being followed in the Underpass tunnel of the newly built Coastal Road in South Mumbai - but I also know it’s not likely to be that way for long).

The Scorpio owner was most likely well aware of this fact and he probably overestimated his vehicle’s handling capacity; a high centre of gravity and the vehicle being so “light” at this speed, there was always a risk of toppling with sudden directional changes.

Last edited by Axe77 : 26th June 2024 at 07:11. Reason: Merging back to back posts. Please use Quote+ feature to reply to multiple posts.
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Old 24th June 2024, 18:09   #40670
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by chaitanyakrish View Post
Drivers should be aware of their vehicle's limitations.
Present tense
Driver "Is" aware now.

PS - Perfect example of Elk Test (failed)
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Old 25th June 2024, 08:31   #40671
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos



This is a case of stupidity. A bunch of attention seeking young people have taken those two jeeps deep into waters to have a good reel for their social media which turned out to be a social problem. Retrieved with the help of locals using a tractor.
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Old 25th June 2024, 09:00   #40672
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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This is a case of stupidity. A bunch of attention seeking young people have taken those two jeeps deep into waters to have a good reel for their social media which turned out to be a social problem.
Sheer stupidity. This happens often in Goa too.

There's only one beach in India that's drivable for vehicles and it is Muzhappilangad beach near Kannur in Kerala. It's a 4 Km long hard packed sand beach and driving along the beach is officially permitted.

Other than the above beach, I doubt if there is any other beach in India that's drivable..In any case, no beach authority allows the vehicle to be driven in the sea itself. That's totally dumb and stupid.

I am sure, the under section / half of the vehicles once they get submerged in salt water, that's not good news for the metal..They have unknowingly and severely diminished the life of the vehicle as corrosion sets in rapidly from now on.

All in all, a stupid and losing proposition for some insta reels and likes. Sometimes, people lose life in the process of getting their reels ( recently the girl who drove reverse and rolled down a cliff) and other times, it's a death knell to their vehicle.
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Old 25th June 2024, 09:04   #40673
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by chaitanyakrish View Post
Whoa! I only realized it was a Scorpio after reading the title. I had mistaken it for a Wagon R until then.
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Old 26th June 2024, 07:16   #40674
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashkamath View Post
Shouldn't the slow moving cars not be on the fast lane?
Agree.

Quote:
Suppose, If the car is at high speed (say at the road speed limit. Tops), then perhaps could they continue on the right,/ speed / overtaking lane?
Absolutely not. What you wrote in the extract below remains the correctly protocol. Right lane is strictly for overtaking and you vacate it once you’re done overtaking, regardless if your cruising speed is the top speed on that highway.
Quote:
The right lane is essentially an overtaking lane. Once you over take, you return to the mid lane and continue.
Of course this doesn’t take away the fact that the Scorpio was still at fault for pulling off that manoeuvre in the way he did it. People really must understand the dynamic limitations of their vehicles - specially when driving tall, high CG SUVs.
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Old 26th June 2024, 09:51   #40675
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by Gennex View Post

This is a case of stupidity.
This thread really makes me miss the lockdown part of the Covid-19 pandemic! The roads are filled with vehicles that've become speeding and stray bullets; Stupidity of the young boys (in particular) makes one wonder on the glorious failure of schools & parenting.

Yet, we somehow seem to survive and chug along!
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Old 26th June 2024, 09:59   #40676
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by Axe77 View Post
Agree.


Right lane is strictly for overtaking and you vacate it once you’re done overtaking, regardless if your cruising speed is the top speed on that highway.
I am confused a bit. Most Indian highways have sign boards with same speed for all lanes and allocating 2 rightmost lanes for LMV and left most for HMV. So how to execute an overtaking in this scenario?

I understand that what you have mentioned is executed properly by both road designers and users internationally. But in India, I think there is a disconnect some where.
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Old 26th June 2024, 10:05   #40677
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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I am confused a bit. Most Indian highways have sign boards with same speed for all lanes and allocating 2 rightmost lanes for LMV and left most for HMV. So how to execute an overtaking in this scenario?
The right most lane is for overtaking only - you will see many expressways sign mark it so as well by painting it on the road. LMVs generally ought to occupy the middle lane, moving to the right most lane to overtake and falling back to the middle lane after completing the manoeuvre. I am assuming trucks only to overtake a slower truck can come on to middle lane but otherwise (in a perfect world) ought to restrict themselves to the leftmost lane.

Not sure I can add anything further to this.
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Old 26th June 2024, 10:37   #40678
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashkamath View Post
Shouldn't the slow moving cars not be on the fast lane?

If the slow moving cars were moving on the left or middle lane would the Scorpio N not met with that accident? It's visible that the Scorpio was rolling as it overtook the car in the middle lane and the driver corrected and re-corrected only to hit the concrete barrier.
Yes one should not hog the "right-er" lanes when the "left-er" lanes are vacant. which means that in a multi-lane highway your default position should be on the left most lane. But there is some discretion because if we take this rule to the extreme it will seriously hinder traffic flow.

1. Consider the situation where the highway is nearly full and you happen to be in the right lane. In such situations just because you are not overtaking (the entire traffic is at roughly the same speed) it does not mean one should move over to the left lane.

2. What if there is a slip road merging in front of you. You can continue to be in the right lane till the traffic from the slip road has stabilised.

3. In any case if all vehicles decide to be in the left most lane, that is a rather wasteful use of the highway.

What one should not do is stay put in the right lane and not catch up with the vehicle in the left lane (i.e. no intention to overtake but just hog the right lane) particularly when the left lane is vacant. That is not nice. But you can see here that unlike other violations (like say wrong side driving) hogging cannot be really quantified. So from the clip alone one cannot really say whether they have been hogging the lane (although it looks like it is the case)

I hope that takes care of the "other cars" in the video. Now let us look at the Scorpio. Clearly he was too fast for his lane (all lanes ?). And he did an undertake (overtaking from the left). Now as such one should avoid undertakes as much as possible. However, just like the "stay to the left rule" it is some times unavoidable. Say there is heavy traffic in both the lanes and it so happens that the left lane is faster. Clearly stopping the car just because you are overtaking the traffic in the right lane does not make sense

But the Scorpio did something worse, he overtook from the left and then barged into the right lane (and lost control). Even if he had not lost control, this is not a good move and is really dangerous move in multi-lane highway. The car moving right into a higher lane should do so making sure that

1. There is no car in the right lane that is catching up on it
2. There are no cars in the higher lanes attempting to move into the right lane (e.g you should not move from lane 1 to lane 2 if there is someone close by in lane 3 who could
potentially move into lane 2 and collide with you). The higher visibility to your right means that there is higher responsibility on the car moving from 1 to 2 than that of 3 to 2.

So to conclude Scorpio is clearly at fault for multiple reasons -- poor lane discipline being the least of his problems. The other cars probably could have done better but one cannot be sure from a short clip like this. They should not be hogging the right lanes but as I said this "hogging" is a qualitative thing not a quantitative thing.

Last edited by electric_eel : 26th June 2024 at 10:40.
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Old 26th June 2024, 10:42   #40679
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by Sam.k View Post
More the reason why we need this along the shoulders to alert such drivers. This will also prevent overtaking from the hard shoulders to some extent
Thankfully, many of our highways have such patches - not by design, but by degradation
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Old 26th June 2024, 11:26   #40680
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Re: Accidents in India | Pics & Videos

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Originally Posted by electric_eel View Post
which means that in a multi-lane highway your default position should be on the left most lane.
Driving on left lane has its own challenges like incorrectly parked vehicles etc and we need to manage it by maintaining safe following distance and be at speed that allows us to stop within the road we can see.

Examples :

This is on Mysuru Expressway.

Accidents in India | Pics & Videos-20240626_111852.jpg

This is on Chitradurga Highway.

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