[mannubhai]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

Just heard that one person has been arrested for a facebook post asking people to participate in the demonstrations. Section 66 and its author must go NOW.

Totally agree.

Along side, There are so many pics floating in FB and twitter claiming to be of that girl, her mom etc etc. These are fake, but at the same time of someone else.

Latest is of a mom weeping on her daughters dead body.

The guys who publish this, for what ever intention it is, is invading on the privacy of someone else. They should be made answerable to this.

[rohitgaur]

Friends

The Govt has organized a Committee and there is an Ad in the Newspaper asking for your opinion on mail for Crime against Women
The Ad is below , Pls do write a mail to justice.verma@nic.in and be a part of a decision



MODS , PLS PUT THIS ON THE HOMEPAGE TO ENSURE PARTICIPATION FROM THIS WHO ARE INTERESTED



Rgds
Rohit

[Enigmatic]

Death Penalty is just not enough. Tomorrow some other mentally demented fellow would go on to commit a similar heinous crime and he need not worry because all we can do at the max is hang him to death.

And to those who are passing the buck, its time to wake up and smell the coffee. Many say its the corrupt politicians, some say its the faulty policies and still others say its the bureaucrats but infact its our faults that such incidents happen in the first place. Let me ask how many of us actually go out and vote?? And then all we do after returning home is abuse the corrupt government. Im sorry people but its our fault that these incidents happen in the first place. It is us who choose a calm and sedate life rather than opting for politics and making a change.

Its time for us to rise and act, but that does not mean holding protests and candle marches at each and every corner of the city. The brutal truth is that no body cares, give it 3 or 4 months max and see what changes have those marches made . And more so even if there are changes the implementation will always be lacking.

Unless and untill we decide to enter the system and change it the future will be as bleak as it is now.

Its a sad state of affairs.

[phamilyman]

This is irrelevant, honestly. We have enough laws, but neither implementation, nor prosecution. What does another law mean when it too will no change the status quo?

Does anyone in delhi remember the number of traffic policemen that suddenly materialized during the commonwealth games and traffic moved like magic with unbelievable discipline during those days? Since then, those many cops have never been spotted on delhi roads.

PS: I read in the Pioneer that the bus was not caught with detective work, but because of the hafta diary of the area traffic police. That says volumes about us!

[raghu.t.k]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

This is irrelevant, honestly. We have enough laws, but neither implementation, nor prosecution. What does another law mean when it too will no change the status quo?

....

I agree on the above. Unless we reform the police and the judiciary, they would not really help the victims. The stats released by the press state that only 1% (not sure if the number is right, but talking of the quantum) of the accused are prosecuted in these cases. The second major impact is inteference from the politicians both for their families and their supporters!!

[Guite]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

Does anyone in delhi remember the number of traffic policemen that suddenly materialized during the commonwealth games and traffic moved like magic with unbelievable discipline during those days? Since then, those many cops have never been spotted on delhi roads.

Well said phamilyman. While all these protests are going on about the bus gang rape, we still read about rapes happening around, and police harassment of victim still continues. Nothing much have changed on the ground: nothing deters the rapists, police still find faults with the victims, so does politicians.

I bet the Delhi 181 helpline will become another farce. Please prove me wrong. Please.

[lapsi]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

This is irrelevant, honestly. We have enough laws, but neither implementation, nor prosecution. What does another law mean when it too will no change the status quo?

Absolutely. This is merely an effort by the Govt. to release the pressure building against it.

One important point that appears to be missed out in the discussions on the Delhi crime is that this is merely a symptom of a deep rooted disease. If universal education had been enforced since Independence, everyone would have been educated, our population would not have been so high and things would have been manageable. But the rulers chose to keep the masses illiterate for their own benefit and this is the result.

And they want to continue fooling the people by calling for suggestions. So many suggestions will be received that it will take years to go through them, but their purpose for calling the suggestions would have been achieved. The situation would have been diffused.

I am sure people are smart enough not to fall for this and continue to keep the pressure on the Government. If they cannot form Laws and enforce security of the people, they have no business staying in power.

[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by lapsi

Absolutely. This is merely an effort by the Govt. to release the pressure building against it.

One important point that appears to be missed out in the discussions on the Delhi crime is that this is merely a symptom of a deep rooted disease. If universal education had been enforced since Independence, everyone would have been educated, our population would not have been so high and things would have been manageable. But the rulers chose to keep the masses illiterate for their own benefit and this is the result.

Partly agree.

Many of our country who work in the middle east are barely educated laborers. Yet, there Indian diaspora don't cause any mischief - because of fear of the law. Heck, they even put couples in jail for extra marital affairs and deport them!!

[Brabus E V12]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

Partly agree.

Many of our country who work in the middle east are barely educated laborers. Yet, there Indian diaspora don't cause any mischief - because of fear of the law. Heck, they even put couples in jail for extra marital affairs and deport them!!

Completely agree. You can see how the Indian diaspora behave so decently in the middle east as they know the consequences of misbehaviour WILL be severe. Unfortunately that is what we need in India. In order to keep the majority of us Indians in check, there needs to be a stick which comes flying out as soon as someone steps out of line or misbehaves. Otherwise such despicable behaviour will continue as it has been since this incident. What's even more shocking is that the politicians themselves are making stupid, hollow and spineless statements including our official and unofficial Prime Ministers. There needs to be a fear of the law for the right reason. At present the only fear of law is for the law abiding citizens.

[msdivy]

Originally Posted by rohitgaur

Pls do write a mail to justice.verma@nic.in and be a part of a decision

Leave the purpose apart, I feel this email mechanism is futile exercise. If 10,000 write their views, who will read those mails? More practical plans are required.

[NetfreakBombay]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

This is irrelevant, honestly. We have enough laws, but neither implementation, nor prosecution. What does another law mean when it too will no change the status quo?

If not a new law, increase in quantum of punishment is definitely required. 7 years is too low for such brutality. I think there is a case for adding death penalty for "rarest of rare" cases.

With that, there will have to be safeguards against cases like this:

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/pr...-years/1026981

And legal professionals involved in this committee are required to suggest such changes.

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay

If not a new law, increase in quantum of punishment is definitely required. 7 years is too low for such brutality. I think there is a case for adding death penalty for "rarest of rare" cases.

.

Like in the US they get sentences of 140 years and so on...
And on the subject of rape what about chaps like that Shiney fellow who jumped his hired help? Should he not be penalized?

[lapsi]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

... because of fear of the law...

Agree with you.

The big picture in India is like this:

If some one wants to fight for what is right, or correct an injustice that is done to him, it will take years. After he has been victimized by someone, he will be victimized by the lawyers and after that by the system. Years will go by; he will lose lots of money and most definitely he will lose his peace of mind, but he will not get justice and he will not be able to correct the wrong done to him. If you do not believe me, please ask Harish who had the misfortune of having his Skoda repaired with duplicate parts and had his car seized.

There are no consequences for wrong doing in India. And guess why it is this way. Because the politicians want it this way. They do not want to be accountable for their actions. They do not want to be held responsible. They can do anything and get away with it. They are not bothered by what people do as long as they get to loot the country. The people may go to hell for all they care. And that is why we do not have tough implementation of Laws in our country.

At the same time, you have stated how easy it is for people to fall in line as soon as they know that they will have to face the consequences of their actions.

The problem is political. If the rulers were law abiding citizens, we would have seen the same in the people. There is a saying in Sanskrit: "Jatha Raja, Tatha praja".

[darklord]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

This is irrelevant, honestly. We have enough laws, but neither implementation, nor prosecution. What does another law mean when it too will no change the status quo?

Originally Posted by lapsi

The big picture in India is like this:

If some one wants to fight for what is right, or correct an injustice that is done to him, it will take years. After he has been victimized by someone, he will be victimized by the lawyers and after that by the system. Years will go by; he will lose lots of money and most definitely he will lose his peace of mind, but he will not get justice and he will not be able to correct the wrong done to him. If you do not believe me, please ask Harish who had the misfortune of having his Skoda repaired with duplicate parts and had his car seized.

Agree with both of you 100%. The police and the justice systems have to be introduced to the business end of a bulldozer and then rebuilt foundation up. More laws will mean nothing if the courts is going to take a couple of decades to reach a final verdict.

Nowadays, most of us take basics like computers for granted. Well, think again. Our courts have just "discovered" computers:
3.2 cr cases pending in HCs, lower courts

Onus on judiciary

Frankly, I am not surprised when I read news like this:
http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/pl...rrested-311875
http://www.jharkhandstatenews.com/vi.../#.UOJ7h66ICSo
Well, I am, but only because people are yet to take law onto their own hands in a much larger scale. Keep the policing and judiciary unchanged, even that won't be too far away.

[antz.bin]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

This is irrelevant, honestly. We have enough laws, but neither implementation, nor prosecution. What does another law mean when it too will no change the status quo?

I am sorry because this might seem off-topic or politicized but it is not.

This person:
http://rahulmehta.com/

Stayed the night of 30th December at my place and I learnt a lot about his struggle, which, IMO, deserves much more media coverage than the candle marches and protests happening at Jantar Mantar. A two hour chat with Mr. Rahul Mehta has made me a convert so please take the time to go through the topics which you feel are relevant to the causes you support yourself.


In this scenario, this law makes a lot of sense..

http://rahulmehta.com/a_proc_list.pol.htm

The police is responsible for maintaining law and order and if they cannot do so, the Police Commissioner must be accountable.

When a small time goonda gets away with a petty crime like eve teasing, without a fitting punishment as per the existing laws, it the fault of
1. The citizen, who failed to report the crime and decided to bear it instead
2. The Constable at the police station, who refused to write the complain when he was refused bribe
3. The Police Commissioner, who was indifferent about his staff's incompetence
4. The Judicial system, which delayed the punishment so much that the complainant just stopped pursuing his/her case

There is an entire chain of people who must be held accountable for their inefficiencies.

This aforementioned goonda then has his confidence boosted that he won't be punished no matter what he does and then goes ahead and commits those heinous, unthinkable crimes which then need candle marches and processions.

The laws of the land are strict enough and nobody would want to end up in jail for 7 years, for doing something which can be bought for a few hundred rupees (sorry for being crude here).

What we need is not death penalty, but the prompt punishment for petty crimes which in turn lead to such incidents if left unpunished. A simple 6 month jail term for eve teasing is enough deterrent for someone and his entire mohalla/colony/society neighbors to never attempt such a thing in the future. A 1000 such arrests and punishments in a week would be deterrent enough to cleanse the entire NCR (I am sure more than 1000 eve teasing incidents (reported/unreported) happen all over NCR in any given week).

Edit:
P.S.: An Indian labourer moving to the middle east stays good because he knows that he will be punished if he falters. The people in India do these unthinkable crimes because they know they won't be. The severity of punishment is immaterial here.

P.P.S. : There were at least 15 rape/attempted rape cases reported from Delhi, Haryana and Uttar Pradesh, on the 7.30 PM bulletin of Aaj Tak Tez yesterday, all of which happened *after* the Damini incident. Thats when someone labelled the channel 'Rape TV' and changed the channel.