[Samurai]

Originally Posted by mallumowgli

IIRC it was Sam who explained to us ordinary folks, the difference between marriage and wedding early on in this thread. But I also remember that you have also posted the same thing earlier also. But Sam comes first

You mean this : http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shifti...ml#post1184650

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by AVR

I am not sure if I agree with you.

I think its not just about "I don't know". I hear the "not so sure" quite often in my dealings and I think its just a very polite and conversational way of disagreement instead of an outright refusal and at times to seek more clarification. Also, I think this term directly maps to the grey-zone of conversation and knowledge exchange where everything may not be black and white.

I don't think it is any more polite than "I don't think so," or "I don't agree."

But it is when the intention is to say, "I don't know," but somehow the speaker/writer can't quite manage those words, that I find it just wrong. I read it as "might be," but that is not what is being said.

Marriage/wedding... Oh yes, I remember Sam on that now

[mallumowgli]

Originally Posted by Samurai

You mean this : http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/shifti...ml#post1184650

I was hurriedly searching for older posts to validate my point and you beat me to it!! Well Sam can mean both the great Yeti or 'Sam'urai!!

Moving on, talking about the English in the mainstream news channels - reporters always use phrases 'at this point in time' 'going forward' instead of using just 'now' or 'in future' respectively. My doubt is whether there is any specific usage guidelines for such phrases or are they just fads?

Another quite new phenomenon in the west seems to be the usage of 'already'. Already was always used in the past or past perfect tense. Nowadays people are using it everywhere, like 'Do it already', 'Wake up already'!

[carboy]

Originally Posted by mallumowgli

Another quite new phenomenon in the west seems to be the usage of 'already'. Already was always used in the past or past perfect tense. Nowadays people are using it everywhere, like 'Do it already', 'Wake up already'!

Not new. I have heard this usage in the US even around 10 years back. I doubt if it's used anywhere outside of the US.

[vnabhi]

'Co-passenger' is used often in Indian parlance. So is the term 'over-speeding' in place of 'speeding'.In the west, one gets tickets for 'speeding', which means one was going over the speed limit.

'Over' seems to have been added in India because we are very fond of adding emphasis to our statements. Eg.' She is my one and only, devoted wife', 'she is my most affectionate aunt', 'my everlasting, best friend', etc. Given a chance, we could even invent terms like 'bestest friend'

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by mallumowgli

Moving on, talking about the English in the mainstream news channels - reporters always use phrases 'at this point in time' 'going forward' instead of using just 'now' or 'in future' respectively. My doubt is whether there is any specific usage guidelines for such phrases or are they just fads?

They are just fads, inventions of American managers and marketing people. Sadly, however, they have become fixtures in the language and, going forward, we're stuck with them!

Another quite new phenomenon in the west seems to be the usage of 'already'. ... ... ... like 'Do it already', 'Wake up already'!

Originally Posted by carboy

Not new. I have heard this usage in the US even around 10 years back. I doubt if it's used anywhere outside of the US.

I think it is Jewish/Yiddish in origin

Originally Posted by vnabhi

'Co-passenger' is used often in Indian parlance...

Yes, but that doesn't make it right! A mistake by an American does not make it American English, and the same is true for Indian English, or, of course, British English.

So is the term 'over-speeding' in place of 'speeding'.In the west, one gets tickets for 'speeding', which means one was going over the speed limit.

It's that wrong-association thing again. Over the speed limit turns into Over-speeding

'Over' seems to have been added in India because we are very fond of adding emphasis to our statements. Eg.' She is my one and only, devoted wife', 'she is my most affectionate aunt', 'my everlasting, best friend', etc. Given a chance, we could even invent terms like 'bestest friend'

A lot of that is there in British English too.

[AVR]

Well if you are not the driver but a passenger, wouldn't the other passengers be your Co-passengers?

[Samurai]

Let's not forget co-brother. When I first used it with an American, he was seeing stars. He argued back, isn't any brother a co-brother. I made a hasty retreat since I knew I was on shaky grounds.

There is a co-brother-in-law too, I wonder how that is used.

[vnabhi]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Let's not forget co-brother. When I first used it with an American, he was seeing stars. He argued back, isn't any brother a co-brother. I made a hasty retreat since I knew I was on shaky grounds.

There is a co-brother-in-law too, I wonder how that is used.

There you go! I am now getting into my roots of Anthropology Honours, my degree course.

We use what is known as 'descriptive' terminology to denote kins, whereas western societies use 'classificatory' terminology. By descriptive, we try to describe the exact relationship, such as maternal uncle, paternal aunt, cousin sister, co son-in-law, etc, most of which will sound outlandish to westerners. Traditionally this usage partly stems from the custom of marrying within the lineage, such as cross-cousins, maternal uncle, etc. Therefore our terms denote the exact relationship, so that there is no confusion.

On the other hand, western societies classify relatives as cousin (no suffix of brother or sister), uncle, aunt, etc. Only on probing do they say it is a male or female cousin, maternal uncle, etc.

So the best way to get around is to follow the principal of 'when in Rome, do as the Romans do'. So don't feel shy of saying cousin brother, co-passenger or for that matter anything that fits into the local parlance of the place you are in. Only remember to refresh/update your RAM when you move to another society.

[carboy]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Let's not forget co-brother.

What exactly is co-brother - I have never heard this term in my life?

[Thad E Ginathom]

Therefore our terms denote the exact relationship, so that there is no confusion.

Sadly, not always the case. How many times have you been introduced to a "sister," who turns out to be Mother-in-law's second cousin?

Originally Posted by AVR

Well if you are not the driver but a passenger, wouldn't the other passengers be your Co-passengers?

Only if they are there to assist you with your passengering

[CARDEEP]

Originally Posted by carboy

What exactly is co-brother - I have never heard this term in my life?

Co-Brother is one who is married to the sister of your wife.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Sadly, not always the case. How many times have you been introduced to a "sister," who turns out to be Mother-in-law's second cousin?

Yeah, that is true. I have met too many people who call their cousin as brother or sister. Only if I ask "How many siblings do you have?", they start backtracking with "he is actually my uncle's son".

[vnabhi]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Sadly, not always the case. How many times have you been introduced to a "sister," who turns out to be Mother-in-law's second cousin?

Haven't heard that term being used to denote such a person---perhaps that is specific to some areas.

Originally Posted by Samurai

Yeah, that is true. I have met too many people who call their cousin as brother or sister. Only if I ask "How many siblings do you have?", they start backtracking with "he is actually my uncle's son".

Yes, I have seen this expression. Even grand-father is used to refer to grandpa's brother. But most of such 'sisters' or 'brothers' could be parallel cousins, while cross-cousins would still be referred to as 'cousin brother' or 'cousin sister'. This is because in some societies, marriage with a cross-cousin is permitted,though never with a parallel cousin.

[Thad E Ginathom]

I mean, generally, "sister" can denote any relationship whatsoever ...and, of course, aunties and uncles don't have to be related at all