Team-BHP - Mahindra Scorpio : Issues & Solutions

Quote:

Originally Posted by HIGHNOON (Post 2665323)

Hi , Your friend ought to look for bolero parts at a place called 'Gupta Automobiles' better known as Dhotiwala. its located opposite a restaurant called 'Deluxe ' in kurla ( w) , mumbai which is close to junction of Bandra kurla complex and Agra road. Its also near taximen's colony or a big office complex of EQUINOX.
This guy keeps mahindra parts , specializes in them , and specially for the mpvs, muvs- the boleros, armada campers , maxitrucks and such. Keep original stuff.

Thanks, that is very useful info - any contact details of the Gupta Automobiles?
He got his parts near that in a place called Jan Seva, whose details are as follows:

Jan Seva Auto Agency
A-51, CST Rd, Kismat Nagar, Kurla West Mumbai 70 H.O Phone 25033971 Mobile 9892071970 Ashfaque

My friend said:
"As you turn right at Kurla(W) Signal under the bridge from Ghatkopar side, head towards Kalina on the CST Rd till the bridge landing. At the landing make a U turn and stop at the shop just at the turn.
Guy is a smart salesman and everything that he shows is purportedly brand new including the rusty oil seal that he gave me!. His invoice shows that he sells spares for everything that M&M manufactures including scorpio and Zylo though the company claims that no spares of Scorpio and Zylo are sold in the open market."

So, it is time for Hariya to enter this thread.

He now stands at approximately 70k on the odo (Sept 2007 SLX CRDe) and while all his systems are just doing fine, his top speed and FE have been an area of continous concern for the past 10k kms.

He does not go beyond 140kmph come what may and does not give me more than 11-11.2 kmpl on the highway at speeds of 100-110 kmph while he d easily go on to 160 kmph and give me 12.5-12.7 kmpl at speeds of 100-110 kmph.

Almost everything has been checked. Diesel lines, air filter, diesel filter, tappets, brakes, tire pressure, alignment, different fuel stations, ECU error codes, EGR functioning, the list is endless.

So, after due consideration, I have decided to get his injectors cleaned at an authorised BOSCH injector service center at Blore.

Can someone please recommend me the best place at Blore for such a job?

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath (Post 2666943)

Try changing fuel filters.
Does it make any difference if you use premium diesel - try using it for next 3 fillings and see if there is any difference?

Quote:

Originally Posted by hvkumar (Post 2666957)

Try changing fuel filters.
Does it make any difference if you use premium diesel - try using it for next 3 fillings and see if there is any difference?

The diesel filter is brand new and yes, thank you for reminding, if I use System-D or premium fuel, the FE goes up by almost a kilometer but top speed does not change. Also, when I come back to normal fuel, he is thirsty again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath (Post 2666943)

Hi

IMHO the performance which you have stated is quite ok. The FE you are getting at the speeds sounds ok. Opening of injectors wont help much.

Regards

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRDIsamir (Post 2667820)

Hi

IMHO the performance which you have stated is quite ok. The FE you are getting at the speeds sounds ok. Opening of injectors wont help much.

Regards

Hi Samir,

Not very long ago, he would easily go to 160 kmph flat out and deliver around 12.5 kmpl at 100-110kmph. What has changed?
Since you are a knowledgeable CRDI person, it would be great to have your inputs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath (Post 2666943)

From the symptoms, it seems that the engine combustion efficiency has reduced, resulting in lower top speed and increase in fuel consumption.
Further checks that may yeald some insight :
. Clutch slippage
. Individual Cylinder pressure
. Fuel delivery to the cylinders - clogged or damaged injector tips
. Bearings in the power train - wheels, differentials etc. This is relatively easy to check - check rolling resistance by coasting in neutral. Feel the wheels - if hot then bearings/brake is binding

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aroy (Post 2667838)

Further checks that may yeald some insight :
. Clutch slippage
. Individual Cylinder pressure
. Fuel delivery to the cylinders - clogged or damaged injector tips
. Bearings in the power train - wheels, differentials etc. This is relatively easy to check - check rolling resistance by coasting in neutral. Feel the wheels - if hot then bearings/brake is binding

Clutch has been checked, working fine.

How can fuel delivery be checked?

How can individual cylinder pressure be checked?

Vehicle coasts freely in neutral without any resistance. Wheels/tires do not overheat.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath (Post 2667823)

Hello

What is the condition of the Turbo charger ? Does the pipe from the turbo through the Intercooler has oil. ? Try diriving the vehicle on a road which has a wall close by the road. If you hear a hissing sound as you accelerate then there is a possiblity that the intercooler pipe is cut somewhere thereby reducing the amount of air that is fed to the engine. This can also lead to loss of performance. If you find oil in the Intercooler pipe check for the play in the turbo shaft.

Does the vehicle emit thick black smoke ?

Try cleaning the sylencer along with the CAT CON. Again this may cause obstruction in the exhaust.

A very important point is the return pipe line from the FIP to the fuel tank. If this is clogged then it creates a back pressure inside the FIP which reduces the performance.

If you open upthe injectors the technician should check for the back leakage at full load. If the back leakage is more then the specified value then there is a possiblity of loss of performance. Also important parameter is the prestroke delivery. But I really wont suggest you to get to Injectors unless you are very sure that you have covered all the other various issues

Regards

Samir

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRDIsamir (Post 2667855)

What is the condition of the Turbo charger ? Does the pipe from the turbo through the Intercooler has oil. ? Try diriving the vehicle on a road which has a wall close by the road. If you hear a hissing sound as you accelerate then there is a possiblity that the intercooler pipe is cut somewhere thereby reducing the amount of air that is fed to the engine. This can also lead to loss of performance. If you find oil in the Intercooler pipe check for the play in the turbo shaft.

Does the vehicle emit thick black smoke ?

Try cleaning the sylencer along with the CAT CON. Again this may cause obstruction in the exhaust.

A very important point is the return pipe line from the FIP to the fuel tank. If this is clogged then it creates a back pressure inside the FIP which reduces the performance.

If you open upthe injectors the technician should check for the back leakage at full load. If the back leakage is more then the specified value then there is a possiblity of loss of performance. Also important parameter is the prestroke delivery. But I really wont suggest you to get to Injectors unless you are very sure that you have covered all the other various issues

I have checked the intercooler pipe and there is no leak, at least visible to the naked eye and no hissing sound as well though I will double check tomorrow.

There is absolutely no smoke at all being emitted from the vehicle.

How can I check the return pipe line?

How can I clean the silencer and the CAT CON?

I will get to the injectors only after I check the above points raised by you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath (Post 2667981)

How can I check the return pipe line?

You may see the pipe bulging more or traces of minor leaks. I had problems with the return pipe line, but since mine is the non-crde engine that resulted in back pressure affecting the fuel pump leaking. Once the pipe was replaced, that also stopped. However, I never found any significant reduction in FE or power because of this problem.

As a long-term maintenance measure, I would suggest you replace both the fuel feed pipes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath (Post 2667981)

One more a very basic thing I would like to suggest. Though this may sound as silly but many times it happens. Have you made up your Scorpio with new carpet, put in new rubber mats or the plastic hairy mats ? This sometimes restricts the accelerator pedal travel. Even this happensfor a few mm you are bound to loose your top speed. From the description of yours you are not having any issues about pick up of your vehicle. You are not getting the top speed. Try it.

Regards

Samir

Quote:

Originally Posted by hvkumar (Post 2668032)

As a long-term maintenance measure, I would suggest you replace both the fuel feed pipes.

This, I plan to do this Tuesday.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CRDIsamir (Post 2670554)

Have you made up your Scorpio with new carpet, put in new rubber mats or the plastic hairy mats ?

Thanks Samir and Kumar.

One thing that I noticed today when I had taken Hariya for his first wash after coming back from Lucknow. I hadn't driven him since then.

On the orange hose that goes downward from the tc, I had noticed slight traces of smoke (black hazy lines) on the pipe a few months ago. The traces however, did not increase or decrease.

Today, I noticed that the pipe had oil and consequently dust on it. Oil was not dripping and the pipe was not fully covered with dust but yes, it felt oily and dusty to touch. I m posting a few pics of the same if they help clarify the situation.

What is your take on this? Could this be one of the reasons? I still see no loss of pick up, black smoke or any other outwardly symptoms.

Quote:

Originally Posted by n.devdath (Post 2670578)

This, I plan to do this Tuesday.

Thanks Samir and Kumar.

One thing that I noticed today when I had taken Hariya for his first wash after coming back from Lucknow. I hadn't driven him since then.

On the orange hose that goes downward from the tc, I had noticed slight traces of smoke (black hazy lines) on the pipe a few months ago. The traces however, did not increase or decrease.

Today, I noticed that the pipe had oil and consequently dust on it. Oil was not dripping and the pipe was not fully covered with dust but yes, it felt oily and dusty to touch. I m posting a few pics of the same if they help clarify the situation.

What is your take on this? Could this be one of the reasons? I still see no loss of pick up, black smoke or any other outwardly symptoms.

One more thing you can try out.Hve you cleaned the Air Mass Sensor ?
This sensor is located just after the air cleaner on the intake pipe of the Turbo. Remmoe the sensor and clean it with kerosene or Diesel Blow air into it and refit the sensor. This also my previous advice look up if there is any obstruction between the accelerator lever like carpet or rubber mating. Because you have clearly mentioned that the pick up is ok.

The oil coming out through the pipe is ok nothing to worry abput. Just make sure that the pipe especially in the second pic which tends to tear apart leaking air pressure to the inlet of the engine.