[Poitive]

Verna (Fluidic) Test Drive (1.6 SX Diesel)


The Sales Guy’s eyes popped out !!!!!
He was in the TD car with me, a kilometer away from the showroom and all I asked was a longer Test Drive!

Getting approvals from a ‘Sarkari department’ seemed simpler than getting a longer TD on the Verna (there at least we know what works!). After a million calls, before the TD started and then to get a 15 minutes wait on the road for a longer one, I finally was on the approx. 10km TD. But well, at-least I got a descent drive, when some people are complaining of getting one at all, or being shown sign boards of the 6 months waiting. BTW, I was told that the waiting is 4-6 months. That they are saying 6 months, but hope and expect that it would get delivered in 4.

Starting the TD

The doors opened wide. Ingress into the driver’s seat was easy. The seat seemed quite comfortable for my large 6’frame. It was amongst the newer seats which go around your body to an extent. Usually such seats are more comfortable for a major (read people with average body sizes) part of users. For others, they are usually worse than the flatter seats. But for such a seat it was rather comfortable. After spending some time in the car, it felt less easy to be with. Less conducive to changing one’s position over longer drives. Even the rear seats felt more comfortable to start with than they did later.


The dash was pleasing. Modern, without being in one’s face. Not protruding towards you in a big way, not overly ‘designed’, nor too basic (like the Optra). I liked it a lot. The upper half of the greyish dotted material was not of top notch quality, but still quite good. The finish of the lower beige part was excellent. One thing that I really appreciated that, one’s left leg could sit very comfortably against the central console. It adds a lot to my comfort and it being poorly designed is a major put off for me in many cars.

Had seen the car from the outside a few times before. Love it from the back. Quite good from the side and I never really liked it much from the front. Those impressions didn’t change.

The Secret is out!

Why is this car doing so well? Besides the gadgets and looks the other predominant reason for me was how it was to drive – for the average driver, the experience would be as close to a Petrol as one could get on Diesel car. The average ‘Ajay’ who is used to a petrol and looks to a diesel for economy with a minimal change in driving style should be very satisfied.

Now for the rest of the drive

There was almost no lag felt. About as quiet as a petrol (the car was warmed up before I entered it). Comparable, or maybe even a tad better than the Optra. The power delivery was very linear and smooth. We went through some crowded roads. I was driving this for the first time, but it immediately felt comfortable. As if one knew the car. No stress at all. Moving further we got onto some pretty open roads. Time to floor. Again, felt very much like a petrol! It easily climbed to high speeds. Effortless. Smooth. Plain.

As stated by several people, the steering felt extremely light. Pretty much like a game. No feedback at all. Ideal for most drivers in the city. Not for anyone who gets even somewhat close to trying the car’s limits. In most cars, I feel that over time one gets to know the car enough to manage with lesser feedback and still feel confident. With this one I was very unsure if one ever would.

On higher speeds I felt a bit uneasy. It didn’t feel as planted as I would have liked it to be. It wasn’t scary, but wasn’t confidence inspiring either. Would much rather be in an Linea or an Optra for high speed confidence. The high speed ride could hardly be checked as most of the roads were very smooth. On lower speeds the ride felt only moderate. Not bad at all, but nowhere even close to the Optra (which may sell at a lesser price, but really is from a higher segment).

The brakes though effective didn’t have bite. They didn’t make me feel too secure, despite being all four disks. But that may only be a perception based on a few minutes with the car. Spending time with it and getting to know it better, I expect, would change that perception.

All this while I was on the driver’s seat. The cabin had a feel good factor, though the fabric could have been better and wasn’t to my liking. Leather/PU would look a lot better IMO. It was a simple car to drive around. Didn't need frequent gear changes, unlike the 1.3MJD's. The rear camera though glitzy, had limited use in the daytime for someone like me. I would much rather bank on the regular 3 mirrors. It would have use for objects lower down (potholes, stones etc) though. I must aad here that the Side View Mirrors were excellent. Well shaped and with the right curvature to give a suitable field of view. Very impressed with those.

About 3 kms before the showroom, I moved to the rear seat. The under thigh support, as mentioned by many wasn’t good, but it didn’t bother me too much. There was sufficient headroom too. The feet could go between the front seat easily. The legroom was quite good as well. Could seat one 6’ person behind another with just about acceptable comfort. No complaints on these fronts.

What was extremely bothersome in the rear seat was the feeling that one was in a prison cell. The seat of the Indian model is lower (hence more headroom and lesser under-thigh support). Consequently one is sitting lower with the tall front seats blocking all view even for a 6’ guy. The windows started pretty high and were tapered off from the top (coupe like styling). It gave a feeling of being walled in and being quite disconnected with one’s surroundings. While it might suit a few, who want to sit and work in the rear seat with minimal distraction, I guess most would be unhappy. If I was to be chauffer driven (or have others in the family drive me) and I was to sit in the rear seat, I would not touch this car with a barge pole.

As the Sales guys in front yapped away on phone and drive upto 3 digit figures, I felt extremely uncomfortable with the ride. I felt like I was on some ride in an amusement park – going all over the place. I would not really be comfortable above 80kmph or so in the rear seat. But that figure would change a lot from person to person; also with more time with the car. A slight brake to maneuver the car while on a slightly curved road almost had my heart in my mouth.

It is amazing how the cabin experience can change so much from front to rear. Also the ride experience.

Closing thoughts

All in all, for a lot of people it would be a wonderful car. If one is not much into driving hard and taking a car close to it’s limits, and wants a city commuter with relatively sedate highway drives this may be the car.

For anyone enthusiastic and looking for more from one’s car, or for someone who is to spend time on the rear bench – make sure you drive it long enough before taking the plunge – proceed with caution.

Note: Have exaggerated the odd thing in the write-up above (amusement part, prison cell etc.) just to make it for better reading. No offence meant to anyone, especially people who like this car. I have only tried to share my thoughts and experience with this car in an honest and balanced way.

[Torquedo]

Originally Posted by Poitive

The Secret is out!

Why is this car doing so well? Besides the gadgets and looks the other predominant reason for me was how it was to drive – for the average driver, the experience would be as close to a Petrol as one could get on Diesel car. The average ‘Ajay’ who is used to a petrol and looks to a diesel for economy with a minimal change in driving style should be very satisfied.

Now for the rest of the drive

There was almost no lag felt. About as quiet as a petrol (the car was warmed up before I entered it). Comparable, or maybe even a tad better than the Optra. The power delivery was very linear and smooth. We went through some crowded roads. I was driving this for the first time, but it immediately felt comfortable. As if one knew the car. No stress at all. Moving further we got onto some pretty open roads. Time to floor. Again, felt very much like a petrol! It easily climbed to high speeds. Effortless. Smooth. Plain.

Thanks for the comprehensive insight on the ANHV, Poitive.

I had a question, if you may help me (might be others as well) on those, request you kindly keep my point on the hindsight while comparing the ANHV with the Optra.

Did you feel the turbo kicking in, as in the pin down feeling that you get in the Optra post the 2K RPM mark?

Performance wise how do you compare the Optra with the ANHV.

Build quality in comparison with the Optra.

Looking forward to your response, mate !!

[Satya79]

Originally Posted by Poitive

Verna (Fluidic) Test Drive (1.6 SX Diesel)


What was extremely bothersome in the rear seat was the feeling that one was in a prison cell. The seat of the Indian model is lower (hence more headroom and lesser under-thigh support). Consequently one is sitting lower with the tall front seats blocking all view even for a 6’ guy. The windows started pretty high and were tapered off from the top (coupe like styling). It gave a feeling of being walled in and being quite disconnected with one’s surroundings. While it might suit a few, who want to sit and work in the rear seat with minimal distraction, I guess most would be unhappy. If I was to be chauffer driven (or have others in the family drive me) and I was to sit in the rear seat, I would not touch this car with a barge pole.

As the Sales guys in front yapped away on phone and drive upto 3 digit figures, I felt extremely uncomfortable with the ride. I felt like I was on some ride in an amusement park – going all over the place. I would not really be comfortable above 80kmph or so in the rear seat. But that figure would change a lot from person to person; also with more time with the car. A slight brake to maneuver the car while on a slightly curved road almost had my heart in my mouth.

It is amazing how the cabin experience can change so much from front to rear. Also the ride experience.

Thanks for the detailed review Poitive. Congrats on the long TD.
I got to test drive the Verna Diesel last Saturday; which was a pleasant surprise since I had dropped in to the showroom with no appointment and zero hopes for a CRDi TD.
I managed to stay between 80-100 kmph for a short while. My wife was in the rear seat and boy, she wasn't too happy. The road was slightly undulating and she was not comfortable at all with the wallowy ride in the back.
From the driver's perspective, the cabin pampers you. Super silent engine, it does not sound coarse even when you rev it.
The steering has an irritating springy feel to it, especially at dead center and is super light at speed. Needs getting used to, I think.
We had a back to back TD with the Honda City and the Honda does seem more firm and sure footed at speed. The cabin at the back is also airy. That would account for the unhappiness with the rear seats of the Verna.

Since you have test driven both the Vento and the Verna, what are your thoughts on engine performance and handling between the two?

Thanks.

[Poitive]

Originally Posted by Torquedo

Did you feel the turbo kicking in, as in the pin down feeling that you get in the Optra post the 2K RPM mark?

No way! This is a lot more linear. Even though it is reported to have turbolag, I could not really feel it (as you already know, turbolag usually doesn't bother me due to my driving style). So no surge/pinned-down-feeling either.

Performance wise how do you compare the Optra with the ANHV.

Optra, a lot more fun to drive. For many, it may need a bit of getting used to.

Verna, easy to drive but no where near as much fun for me personally. Others' experiences may vary.

Optra should do better in a drag and surely in high speed handling. Also likely to be better in low and moderate speeds.

Build quality in comparison with the Optra.

Optra felt a lot more solid, though I didn't focus too much on this aspect.

Hope that helps mate

Originally Posted by Satya79

Thanks for the detailed review Poitive. Congrats on the long TD.

Welcome mate. Will respond in detail tomorrow. And yes, I think a congrats for this TD is in order .

[rock22]

Hello Poitive, thanks for the great reviews and the wonderful comparison of Vento / Linea / Manza / SX4 / Verna. You have touched some very relevant, yet sometimes overlooked issues, like the rear seat ride comfort... very well presented !

I'm also on the lookout for a mid size sedan in the 8L bracket, but my inclination is more towards petrol as my driving would be 600-700 km per month (max), that too maily city driving, and I don't want to spend that 1lac extra for the deisel. But I surely do want a driver's car, with low end torque for easy overtaking and that occasional grunt ! But the problem is, no option available now would offer everything I want Of course, in my price range one has to compromise

Any suggestions, friends ?

[radiokidb]

Originally Posted by rock22

I'm also on the lookout for a mid size sedan in the 8L bracket, but my inclination is more towards petrol as my driving would be 600-700 km per month (max), that too maily city driving, and I don't want to spend that 1lac extra for the deisel. But I surely do want a driver's car, with low end torque for easy overtaking and that occasional grunt ! But the problem is, no option available now would offer everything I want Of course, in my price range one has to compromise

Any suggestions, friends ?

Ford Fiesta Classic Petrol

[vb-saan]

Originally Posted by rock22

I'm also on the lookout for a mid size sedan in the 8L bracket, but my inclination is more towards petrol as my driving would be 600-700 km per month (max), that too maily city driving, and I don't want to spend that 1lac extra for the deisel. But I surely do want a driver's car, with low end torque for easy overtaking and that occasional grunt ! But the problem is, no option available now would offer everything I want Of course, in my price range one has to compromise

Any suggestions, friends ?

Option 1) Wait for the New Fiesta pricing. It maybe in your budget.
Option 2) Fiesta Classic
Option 3) If you can give up the boot, why not the Honda Jazz?

[Poitive]

Originally Posted by rock22

I'm also on the lookout for a mid size sedan in the 8L bracket, but my inclination is more towards petrol as my driving would be 600-700 km per month (max), that too maily city driving, and I don't want to spend that 1lac extra for the deisel.

Thanks for the appreciation mate

Not sure whether you mean 8L ex-showroom or OTR. Beside the Fiesta Classic (which I think has a pretty tight cabin), you should also consider the New Fiesta which should be out in a few weeks. It's base could be priced at 7L/8L for Petrol/Diesel Ex-Showroom Delhi going by this post . It be what you are looking for. It also has ABS and Airbags in the bast model as well.

Also consider the Honda City. It is a car with many merits, though not an ideal drivers car. Surely worth a TD. With it's lowered price, it should be within range. Honda engines are also supposed to last forever and are known to be hassle free. It is a very well rounded car (though not to my taste).

[Poitive]

Originally Posted by Satya79

The steering has an irritating springy feel to it, especially at dead center and is super light at speed. Needs getting used to, I think.
We had a back to back TD with the Honda City and the Honda does seem more firm and sure footed at speed. The cabin at the back is also airy. That would account for the unhappiness with the rear seats of the Verna.

Our views on the Verna seem to match quite a lot. About the steering, I remember thinking while driving it, that this may be one steering that one may NOT get used to ever after a lot of use. I mean, to push the car hard. For everyday city driving, it may be extremely welcome by many.

Originally Posted by Satya79

Since you have test driven both the Vento and the Verna, what are your thoughts on engine performance and handling between the two?

Though both are talked of as Jack of all trades, to me these cars were very different. Please bear in mind that my opinions are based on only a few minutes with the car (the TDs)

The Verna was a very smooth easy to be with vehicle for normal sedate driving. The engine was effortless and plain. Was said on this thread (or the Spacious Diesel Sedan thread) that it lacks character. About the handling, a lot has been said in the writeup above.

The Vento was not as easy to drive, but easy enough. May only take a few days to feel about as comfortable. Vento was nowhere near as smooth as the Verna, especially when revved hard. However it had a fun factor to it. Can't put it too well in words, but it was surely more enjoyable to drive. Was not as plain an experience as the Verna. Handling was in a TOTALLY different league. Way way ahead of the Verna. It felt rather crisp and was confidence inspiring (pls note, that I didn't sit in the rear seat of the Vento, IIRC - it has been a few months now). Liked how one could swerve the car at highish speeds to overtake and feel very confident about it.

The cabin of the Vento wasn't to my taste and it's difficult ingress/egress and headroom put it out of the list for me. Otherwise it was a good car. Very enjoyable to drive, with lesser gear changes than the 1.3MJD's and less coarse than them too. If you like the cabin, you may enjoy the car a lot. Much more of a driver's car than the Verna.

Hope this helps.

Pssst - If you haven't driven the Optra Diesel yet, make sure you do - It IS a lovely car (lots of talk on this thread , in case you missed it).

[rock22]

Originally Posted by vb-san

Option 1) Wait for the New Fiesta pricing. It maybe in your budget.
Option 2) Fiesta Classic
Option 3) If you can give up the boot, why not the Honda Jazz?

Hello vb-san and radiokidb... Thanks for replying to my query !

I have TD the Fiesta (now classic)... and the only problem with that car is the interior space, otherwise it is a great vehicle, from engine point of view, handling as well as the great looks. And as we already have a Wagon-R, my wife would not agree for a car without a boot now

I'll wait to TD the new Fiesta now... Thanks once again !

[rock22]

Originally Posted by Poitive

Thanks for the appreciation mate

Not sure whether you mean 8L ex-showroom or OTR. Beside the Fiesta Classic (which I think has a pretty tight cabin), you should also consider the New Fiesta which should be out in a few weeks. It's base could be priced at 7L/8L for Petrol/Diesel Ex-Showroom Delhi going by this post . It be what you are looking for. It also has ABS and Airbags in the bast model as well.

Also consider the Honda City. It is a car with many merits, though not an ideal drivers car. Surely worth a TD. With it's lowered price, it should be within range. Honda engines are also supposed to last forever and are known to be hassle free. It is a very well rounded car (though not to my taste).

Thanks for that quick reply mate !

As for my budget, I can exted it to 9L OTR... and if New Ford Fiesta is priced right, higher petrol version may also be within my reach. I have already gone through Rehaan's very comprehensive review of the NFF. The "not so good" comments about the 1.5 petrol have definitely dampened my spirits of getting a good drivers car, but I have reserved judgement till I do a TD myself... hoping it suits me.

I have also test driven the Honda City and its definitely a good car overall... only that it has lost that "new car charm" of the NFF or the ANHV. Verna was also in my TD list, but after your excellent TD review, especially the info pertaining to the rear seat, I'm not very keen now... add to it the funny front grill design !

So, with not many choices left, I'm waiting to TD the NFF

[Poitive]

Originally Posted by rock22

I don't want to spend that 1lac extra for the deisel. But I surely do want a driver's car, with low end torque for easy overtaking and that occasional grunt

Originally Posted by rock22

As for my budget, I can exted it to 9L OTR
--------------------
I have already gone through Rehaan's very comprehensive review of the NFF. The "not so good" comments about the 1.5 petrol have definitely dampened my spirits of getting a good drivers car, but I have reserved judgement till I do a TD myself
---------------------
I have also test driven the Honda City and its definitely a good car overall... only that it has lost that "new car charm" of the NFF or the ANHV.

Now I realize my suggestion may sound funny and for those who have been following the Spacious Diesel Sedan thread may make me seem obsessive.

For a moment, forget the fuel type used (with your running, it hardly makes a difference).Think if you can live with an old launch, if it offers you more than enough in return.

What if you get oodles of torque (300+Nm), ample power (120+bhp), ergonomically designed sofa like sitting at the back and front, enough space at the back to seat 3 in comfort, a wheelbase equal to the Altis (and more than the Laura), enough headroom, cheap service (a 3yr/45k service maintenance plan at 28k), the car going effortlessly upto 80-90kmph on second gear, that amazing feeling of being pinned back on your seat when you get an open stretch of road, at about 9L OTR? (after discounts the LS model is at about that price in Delhi)

Yes, it is again the Optra Diesel that I am talking about yet again!

Even though your requirements don't meet those of a classic Optra buyer, it would be a worthwhile TD.

Do keep in mind that with it's engine, reported turbo lag (I didn't really feel it and it supposedly is better in BS4 models) you would often need to be running a a lower gear. Use the first when you would usually use the second and so on.

It has an independent suspension which is tuned to be soft, and it is not the sharpest car to drive, but it does feel predictable and given it's soft suspension, it is a very good handler, especially at high speeds. It has a very plush ride. Good NVH insulation - hardly feels like a diesel after it has warmed up. (you can find a lot of info in the Spacious Diesel Sedans thread).

Verna was also in my TD list, but after your excellent TD review, especially the info pertaining to the rear seat, I'm not very keen now... add to it the funny front grill design !

My humble suggestion to you and others would be to NOT rule or decide cars based on others' TD (or even other experiences). People experience cars differently. A lot of people complain of turbolag, but it rarely bothers me. On the Spacious Diesel Sedans thread, a member (bansal) was so unhappy with the turbolag of the Optra that he has decided against it, whereas SLK who recently bought it was totally at ease with it. The Verna too is supposed to have it, when I hardly felt it. I think it is to do with when we change gears. Like many, I never look at the meters to change them. For me it comes from the feel and sound of the car.

There are many happy and proud owners of the Verna too. Check the "bringing home the Fluidic" thread.

Even with regards to the Vento, the reviews say that it has ample headroom, where as I could not even sit straight in the rear seat with my 6'. I even tried out another (IPL edition) Vento after seeing those videos posted my a member, but it was the same for me.

So I'll just repeat - use others' experiences to guide you to an extent. To keep in mind what you would like to check in the few minutes of a TD, but do not base your decision on what others experienced in a TD.

Hope this helps mate.

[Satya79]

Thanks for the quick reply. It does clear some points about both vehicles.
My outstation travels involves fair amounts of ghat sections and the Verna may be a handful here.
Would you believe that I have not been able to TD the Vento yet! The dealer never seems to have one available. Its been 3 months of futile effort and with the insane waiting period that they so proudly claim, it just does not seem worth the effort.

Originally Posted by Poitive

Pssst - If you haven't driven the Optra Diesel yet, make sure you do - It IS a lovely car (lots of talk on this thread , in case you missed it).

I just saw the Chevrolet website for the prices. If I am not wrong, the Optra Magnum used to be around Rs 12l OTR, Mumbai. Its come down by quite a bit! Maybe I will give it a shot too.

Thanks again.

[Poitive]

Originally Posted by Satya79

Thanks for the quick reply. It does clear some points about both vehicles.
My outstation travels involves fair amounts of ghat sections and the Verna may be a handful here.
Would you believe that I have not been able to TD the Vento yet! The dealer never seems to have one available. Its been 3 months of futile effort and with the insane waiting period that they so proudly claim, it just does not seem worth the effort.
===========
I just saw the Chevrolet website for the prices. If I am not wrong, the Optra Magnum used to be around Rs 12l OTR, Mumbai. Its come down by quite a bit! Maybe I will give it a shot too.

Thanks again.

You are welcome mate

Largely based on TDs, two vehicles I would NOT want to be in, on the ghats/hills are the 'Fluidic' Verna (due to it's handling) and the SX4 (for it's A pillar design and consequently sideways visibility issues). I expect one would enjoy the Vento for ghats.

Given you are in Mumbai, it is surprising that a Vento TD is difficult, post the 'Fluidic effect'. Most of my TD's have been done by giving a call to the showroom about half an hour to an hour before turning up at the showroom. It usually works out, as it is minimal effort and planning for them. If the vehicle is available, they would not have an issue with you testing it. I had two TDs of the Vento. One wasn't worth mentioning, as it was raining a lot and it was a very short TD and it was a walk in. If you are OK with the cabin of the Vento, don't give up on it.

AFAIK, Optra diesel used to have 3 models till a while back. Max, which was the cheapest was discontinued. The one above is LS, which is available at about 9L OTR in Delhi after all discounts. LT is about 1L extra. It anyway is a wonderful car and at these prices is a steal.

All the best for your hunt, and do keep us posted with your thoughts, deliberations and final choice.

[rock22]

Originally Posted by Poitive

Now I realize my suggestion may sound funny and for those who have been following the Spacious Diesel Sedan thread may make me seem obsessive.

For a moment, forget the fuel type used (with your running, it hardly makes a difference).Think if you can live with an old launch, if it offers you more than enough in return.

--------------------------------------

Yes, it is again the Optra Diesel that I am talking about yet again!

Even though your requirements don't meet those of a classic Optra buyer, it would be a worthwhile TD.

--------------------------------------

My humble suggestion to you and others would be to NOT rule or decide cars based on others' TD

--------------------------------------

Hope this helps mate.

Thank you so very much for your very good suggestions !

So if you think so highly of the Optra diesel, I think it would be a good idea to drop in at the Chevy showroom in Dehradun on my next visit.

I have already test driven the Honda city, Fiesta classic and the Vento. (Vento rear seat we found a bit uncomfortable, especially for the third passenger in the middle. And I found the steering not to my liking... so have given up on this one.)

Now three more TDs to go...
1. New Ford Fiesta
2. Verna Fluidic
3. And of course... Optra

Thanks once again... Cheers !