[Cyrus43]

Rubbish!! The Thar with the soft top and the windows rolled down is perfectly OK and did not make me or dad sneeze or cough after all the hundreds of kms we have travelled in it. This is ridiculous man!! Who is asking you to take the soft top off and drive around??

[roy_libran]

^^^^^^^^^^
Either ways, in North Indian Weather, a Soft Top or No Top is NOT AN OPTION. Thar without the AC and HT included, from the manufacturer, would not be able to sell in any decent quantity, anywhere in North India!

[Samurai]

Cyrus, before you claim my experiences as rubbish and ridiculous, have you seen the roads between Bangalore and the coast? I am sure you have lot more Jeeping experience thanks to accompanying your dad, while I have been driving Jeeps only for 3 years now. But on what kind of roads?

The ghat roads between Bangalore and Udupi/Mangalore are so horrible, we have a 3000+ posts thread dedicated to this route. I have to take one of these roads to travel to every OTR event.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/route-...udupi-201.html

So please, before you go rubbishing others, understand there are worser roads than expressways. BTW, I am driving with the soft top on.

Edit: Ok, let's do a proper comparison. I took 10 hours to cover 410kms yesterday. Name the 10 hour drive you did in the Jeep, let's see what kind of roads you took.

[Cyrus43]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Cyrus, before you claim my experiences as rubbish and ridiculous, have you seen the roads between Bangalore and the coast? I am sure you have lot more Jeeping experience thanks to accompanying your dad, while I have been driving Jeeps only for 3 years now. But on what kind of roads?

The ghat roads between Bangalore and Udupi/Mangalore are so horrible, we have a 3000+ posts thread dedicated to this route. I have to take one of these roads to travel to every OTR event.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/route-...udupi-201.html

So please, before you go rubbishing others, understand there are worser roads than expressways. BTW, I am driving with the soft top on.

Edit: Ok, let's do a proper comparison. I took 10 hours to cover 410kms yesterday. Name the 10 hour drive you did in the Jeep, let's see what kind of roads you took.

unfortunately for you, I know exactly what roads you are talking about. I have travelled those roads before. In a fiat to boot. So please do not go on explaining me how good and bad the roads are. At least you did those roads in a jeep. Dad and me were in something much much more "ancient" and low....

Perhaps, you can just get doors for your jeep.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Thar is currently aimed at real men, men who can laugh at the face of dust, smoke and heat. I on the other hand, have been sneezing after the 410Kms drive yesterday in my doorless Jeep. I am still spitting dark sooty phlegm and extracting the same from my nose.

Real men laugh at dust and smoke, I sneeze! Wait, that can be my next signature.

Unless you are one of those real men described by auto magazines as real Jeepers, you'll need HT and AC.

Originally Posted by Cyrus43

Rubbish!! The Thar with the soft top and the windows rolled down is perfectly OK and did not make me or dad sneeze or cough after all the hundreds of kms we have travelled in it. This is ridiculous man!! Who is asking you to take the soft top off and drive around??

Originally Posted by Samurai

Cyrus, before you claim my experiences as rubbish and ridiculous, have you seen the roads between Bangalore and the coast? I am sure you have lot more Jeeping experience thanks to accompanying your dad, while I have been driving Jeeps only for 3 years now. But on what kind of roads?

The ghat roads between Bangalore and Udupi/Mangalore are so horrible, we have a 3000+ posts thread dedicated to this route. I have to take one of these roads to travel to every OTR event.

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/route-...udupi-201.html

So please, before you go rubbishing others, understand there are worser roads than expressways. BTW, I am driving with the soft top on.

Edit: Ok, let's do a proper comparison. I took 10 hours to cover 410kms yesterday. Name the 10 hour drive you did in the Jeep, let's see what kind of roads you took.

Hey Cyrus, take it easy pal...
My native is Udupi, same place where Samurai comes from and I guarantee you that there wouldnt be one reason for me not to agree to what he has quoted below coz I have gone through the same experience but I always keep it quiet calling it the "Jeep thing"!!! That means my opinion is rubbish too for you along with the several others that are in agreement with me huh?

The roads are bad. It is dusty. It is winding with quite a bit of ghat to cover. It will be difficult in a vehicle which doesnt have too much protection against elements. So??? Do I hate Thar? No. Its a constraint with any vehicle that doesnt have a closed cabin, thats it. Something that people like me will have to live with unless acted upon. Period.

Take it easy, I repeat.

[Cyrus43]

Lol, you repeat?? Really. And as I said, THE SOFT TOP IS PERFECTLY WEATHER PROOF!! Why dont you guys understand that it isnt just cloth that is hanging from some string tied down with clothes clips! I know how bad the roads are. I know perfectly well!! As I said, Who is asking you to remove the soft top and the doors and drive around? Keep the top on and the windows open and it is perfectly fine. Why is it that people are hell bent on trying to invent non existent flaws with the THAR??

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Cyrus43

And as I said, THE SOFT TOP IS PERFECTLY WEATHER PROOF!! Why dont you guys understand that it isnt just cloth that is hanging from some string tied down with clothes clips! I know how bad the roads are. I know perfectly well!! As I said, Who is asking you to remove the soft top and the doors and drive around? Keep the top on and the windows open and it is perfectly fine. Why is it that people are hell bent on trying to invent non existent flaws with the THAR??

Nobody said Thar's soft top has holes or isnt weather resistant (No, its not weather proof as you mentioned in the current context), but it has its limitations, yes, profoundly. The limitations can be overcome through a hardtop feature for people who may be a bit more sensitive to the elements than yourself. Please realize that before expressing your unbiased viewpoint.

[navpreet318]

About the Soft top.

I have been told that this soft top is not your regular top provide by mahindra for years.It is from a vendor in pune who also supplies internationally.So what i have been told is that this is actually way way better than anything in india right now.

I am actually going to wait and see if the soft top is good enough.

On another note to make this a daily driver One needs a Hard top no doubt to make the Jeep lockable.

Now i have been told by the customization team that there is actually a Hard top design which is made to order.It is double walled and has a good liner as well.It has Glass on three sides and a rear hatch type door as well.So basically its a copy of the italian hard top design.This Info have been provided by Mr. Nanda himself.

So now my Question to mahindra is that why don't you offer the Hard top as a ready made dealer accessory.All Thars are similar so the question of custom making it is out of question.Right.And there is another argument that it is prohibitively Expensive.Right, so if you make it in large volumes then the cost of manufacturing will go down.

So why not offer it just as the A/C is available as a dealer fitted accessory.

Also to all those who have been crying about the warranty here it is: Dealer Fitted AC does not void the warranty.Any customization from mahindra does not void warranty.And there is a 6 month Warranty on all the customized parts on the jeep as well.

EDIT:There is a travel thread in the travel section where a guy from bangalore i think has gone to Leh in a soft top jeep with rain and snow and his wife along.Why don't we ask him about travelling in a soft top.I bet non of you can compare with him about driving with a soft top.

[SubuS]

Hey wolf - what are the weather limitations of a soft top? I thought a power enough AC can keep the cabin cool - am I wrong?

[pjbiju]

Originally Posted by SubuS

Hey wolf - what are the weather limitations of a soft top? I thought a power enough AC can keep the cabin cool - am I wrong?

Yes. A good and powerful AC will keep the cabin cool with a good quality soft top.

@Cyrus
The main issue here is that the soft top will not effectively stop the dust/smoke etc. from entering the cabin. Think of the hot summer days when you are in a traffic jam. It also does not offer any kind of safety (for various occasions when safety would be important). The soft top (or topless) would have been perfect for non-city use, but not so for city use. And this concern is more of an issue for people who want to use it as their main vehicle. Not everyone can afford 2 or 3 vehicles. This can become the only vehicle for someone, if the A/C and HT issues are addressed. Why not go the whole way?

[drifter]

Hardtop and AC is definitely a requirement. One can be as macho as one likes and rough it out without AC. But really, a company can not expect to sell in good numbers without these basic creature comforts.

Have driven the Thar, was impressed by the performance. It is a far cry from the older Jeeps. Sets new benchmarks. But these benchmarks could have been placed higher. Charge the people more money, but get some more of the basics right. You've got it with the engine and the 4WD.

People can say what they want, the IFS' limited travel means you do tend to lose traction more than usual. Also I'm not sure about the ruggedness of the entire setup. I've driven the Scorpio 4WD and have seen the front suspension get damaged quite regularly. The exact same abuse was taken in stride by the accompanying Mahindra Legend with leaf springs up front. I accept the IFS has made this Jeep far more civilised and that is definitely a good thing.

Okay enough rambling. There are flaws, but it is still a decent product. People should learn to accept the criticism and not rubbish the opinions of others.

[navpreet318]

Well the AC is available with the dealer as a after delivery fitment.And it does not harm the warranty either.

Now i have been told by Mr. Nanda that Mahindra customization is infact offering a Hard Top.It has glass on three side and a hatch type rear door.It is double walled and has a head liner as well.So its well built.Its pretty expensive right now.
But if the Company offers it as a ready made dealer accessory just like the AC then the costs can be brought down.

And if we can actually see it in front of our own eyes then we can actually appreciate its cost as well.Right now putting down this much money without seeing the hard top is really not done.

Also there is a 6 month warranty on the customized parts.So all is well.
Mahindra needs to get all its highly paid minds together and put together a package which is good VFM deal for the customer.

Say propose a 200 group buy deal on the Thar website with a great deal on the Thar with AC and Hard top fitted as accessories after the delivery of the Jeep as the jeep is homologated without the HT and AC.

Now that would be a good deal.
We can all register there on the website and your respective dealers can then contact us and take necessary steps to take the deal forward.

What Say?

By the way Behram Ji please ask your marketing to be as passionate about their work as you and we could have a absolutely dominating winner in our hands.

[AWD]

A Jeep with a Soft-top & no A.C. is alright provided that it comes at a price of ~ 4 L. Above this figure, expectations start increasing & basic levels of comfort/convenience are expected.
For Mahindra, providing a Bolero 4x4 seems to be an easier & more acceptable option, provided the price tag is not more than 50k from the Thar. This vehicle if launched, could get a thumbs up from consumers.

As for macho/non-macho debate, Mahindra engineers should traverse the lengths & breadths of the Country to know the climatic conditions prevailing in the land. Our Country witnesses extreme climates, taking a Soft-top to Himalayas won't be wise option & similarly taking it to Thar(desert) wont be. Apart from this the ever rising theft cases in the Country further tilts the balance in favor of HT.

If Mahindra really wanted to draw some feedback from the board, they should pay heed to Tsk's thread & offer 4x4 options in base variants of Bolero/Scorpio.

[Cyrus43]

Originally Posted by drifter

Hardtop and AC is definitely a requirement. One can be as macho as one likes and rough it out without AC. But really, a company can not expect to sell in good numbers without these basic creature comforts.

Have driven the Thar, was impressed by the performance. It is a far cry from the older Jeeps. Sets new benchmarks. But these benchmarks could have been placed higher. Charge the people more money, but get some more of the basics right. You've got it with the engine and the 4WD.

People can say what they want, the IFS' limited travel means you do tend to lose traction more than usual. Also I'm not sure about the ruggedness of the entire setup. I've driven the Scorpio 4WD and have seen the front suspension get damaged quite regularly. The exact same abuse was taken in stride by the accompanying Mahindra Legend with leaf springs up front. I accept the IFS has made this Jeep far more civilised and that is definitely a good thing.

Okay enough rambling. There are flaws, but it is still a decent product. People should learn to accept the criticism and not rubbish the opinions of others.

Arre manish, as we discussed the other day, it is not about not accepting criticism baba. If the team did not want to hear criticisms, they would not have been active on the forum would they?? The thing I do not see fit is that what is OK and has been OK for ages and ages is now suddenly unacceptable somehow. Yes, I agree there are flaws, but then it is impossible ot make a perfect vehicle. I agree that it needs a AC and a HT for general public and the fit and finish on the interior should be better. But then wat is the point in buying an open top Jeep of you are going to shut it?? Woudnt such a person be better off in a bolero storm?? Just my two cents, you know I have immense respect for you man.

[navpreet318]

Cyrus what I need and am demanding is a Removable Hard Top.Most of india is not pleasant for more than a month, let alone the year round.So for the rest of the year with the harsh climate I need the Hard Top.and also to park it in the market and walk away carefree i need the hard top.I need a REMOVABLE Hard Top.

The one that is being offered by mahindra is good no doubt but is prohibitively expensive!Thats why the option of making it a regular production offering or a group buy offering to make it cheaper would be a great deal for people like who want to enjoy it daily.

Say a lakh for the Hard top would be a great price.I have been quoted 40k for the AC.so 1.4 lakhs for AC and Hard top with warranty intact would be absolutely amazing for a person like me.