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Old 8th March 2010, 17:51   #1036
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OT

HT/AT/MT doesn't matter on pure sand- what matters is profile height of the tire, tire pressure and the driver. One has to compact sand and sail on it rather than dig into it. Sand grip just does that!
Sorry i forgot to add power here. Engine power and rev ability coupled with light chassis and suitable tires can perform well on sand dunes.

Back on topic- As to what i insisted, foreign market relies on customization! Are Audi Q7's/Q5' popular in OTR scene there? Why? Because there isn't much you can do with these vehicles. When you think of an OTR vehicle what comes to your mind?-

Land rover defender or freelander?
Jeep wrangler or Jeep compass?
Suzuki Jimny or Grand vitara?
Toyota LC70 or RAV 4?

Guess why have they become such an Icon? Because people can take it stock and modify them! This is true to market abroad! These are the vehicles which leave last impression and not the current cutie pies!

Solid axle both front & rear provides immense scope for tyre upgrades. Considering THar sells at 13000 Euros and Jeep sell at about 22,000 euros for the base version. Now if a man buys a Mahindra and if he could upgrade imagine what kind of a lethal machine Thar could have been!! I would say an opportunity lost!

Just see this Video-






@ headers- I just realized i addressed the qualities of your machine:-). Don't be so happy! you know Thar will outperform your vehicle in 2wd!

Last edited by vinod_nookala : 8th March 2010 at 18:10.
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Old 8th March 2010, 17:56   #1037
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Originally Posted by ex670c View Post
In case you have missed it, the IFS setup has reduce the Ramp Over Angle of the Thar to 15 Degrees, where as a stock MM540 with 6.00X16 was 27 Degrees.
..

PS - What if the CV Joint Rubber Boot gets ripped while driving off-road, in the middle of nowhere i.e mid way to Leh? What will happen to the Rzeppa Joint then? Or is it Benedix-Weiss Joint?
The half axle will make noise and run until a point where it drops off!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinod_nookala View Post
HT/AT/MT doesn't matter on pure sand- what matters is profile height of the tire, tire pressure and the driver. One has to compact sand and sail on it rather than dig into it. Sand grip just does that!
@VN my friend: How we love to disagree on this point. The next time you are going to use your HT baldies to climb out of a water crossing onto a small sand wall in 1st attempt

Then we can continue the discussion.

NDMS is great on a CJ3B and a 540 on sand until one has to climb steep dunes over 20ft or so. NDMS is one of the best tyres offroad.
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Old 8th March 2010, 17:57   #1038
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Sorry i forgot to add power here. Engine power and rev ability coupled with light chassis and suitable tires can perform well on sand dunes.
That was QUICK and SMART VN: You've seen it ain't you:
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Old 8th March 2010, 18:05   #1039
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So Arka / Headers / VN:

What kind of tyres do we want in our wish-list Thar? I'm definitely sure its not the one that Mahindra intends to provide as OEM
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Old 8th March 2010, 18:13   #1040
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Originally Posted by MileCruncher View Post
So Arka / Headers / VN:

What kind of tyres do we want in our wish-list Thar? I'm definitely sure its not the one that Mahindra intends to provide as OEM
Hi Anirudha,

For a Solid Axle MM550 Mud-Terrains
1) 235/85/16
2) 245/75/16
3) 255/85/16

or 32-9.5-15 or 32-9.5-16 Simex Jungle Trekker

For the Thar JKBrute 4x4 or those Duranza/Potenza kind of tyres.

Regards,

Arka
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Old 9th March 2010, 02:59   #1041
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Originally Posted by ex670c View Post
Hi Anirudha,

For a Solid Axle MM550 Mud-Terrains
1) 235/85/16
2) 245/75/16
3) 255/85/16

or 32-9.5-15 or 32-9.5-16 Simex Jungle Trekker

For the Thar JKBrute 4x4 or those Duranza/Potenza kind of tyres.

Regards,

Arka
Do they come in pastels?

Arka, for a lot of people the Thar will be enough. Their idea of off-roading is more like a country picnic. Take the family, some food, a huge I.C.E unit and a portable TV and go look at nature.

I am not saying they are right....I am saying there may be a market for this. An entrepreneur must stay open to the possibilities. Hopefully more will come out of M&M.
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Old 9th March 2010, 12:42   #1042
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How costly would be a mod job converting from IFS to floating axles?
Or it won't be possible (based on chassis)?
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Old 9th March 2010, 13:52   #1043
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@ headers- I just realized i addressed the qualities of your machine:-). Don't be so happy! you know Thar will outperform your vehicle in 2wd!
You bet .

BTW, when is your vehicle coming? The ........
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Old 9th March 2010, 14:05   #1044
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Do they come in pastels?

Arka, for a lot of people the Thar will be enough. Their idea of off-roading is more like a country picnic. Take the family, some food, a huge I.C.E unit and a portable TV and go look at nature.

I am not saying they are right....I am saying there may be a market for this. An entrepreneur must stay open to the possibilities. Hopefully more will come out of M&M.
DD i agree with you. Our kind of usage, like finding deepest possible ditches dropping our vehicles and then bringing them out or choosing the toughest possible way out of a place isnt done by most 4x4 users.

To them jungle tracks, poorly laid estate roads, some odd dry river bed crossing and water splashing at high speeds, snow driving is what is off roading!

Many don't see this as a sport. For some trans versing those remote areas is a way of living for some it is an yearly getaway point with family.

Sometimes i just imagine myself being relocated to vizag my home town. The next immediate question is what do i do with my hardy 4x4 here? There is no 4wd community there. At the most i can drive on beach and probably explore mountain ranges of Araku for which Thar would be more than sufficient.


@Headers- Which vehicle? Dont float roumers

Last edited by vinod_nookala : 9th March 2010 at 14:07.
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Old 9th March 2010, 14:11   #1045
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You bet .

BTW, when is your vehicle coming? The ........
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Originally Posted by vinod_nookala View Post
DD i agree with you. ..

The next immediate question is what do i do with my hardy 4x4 here? At the most i can drive on beach and probably explore mountain ranges of Araku for which Thar would be more than sufficient.
VN: Your hardy 4x4 - dont worry we'll find buyers for that..after all its got solid axles ..

BTW, I heard you mention that THAR is sufficient for you - I agree 100%
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Old 9th March 2010, 14:18   #1046
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Default Solid Axle

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
How costly would be a mod job converting from IFS to floating axles?
Or it won't be possible (based on chassis)?
1) For IFS to Solid Axle
1-1.2Lakhs if New parts are used.

Leaf Springs
Leaf Spring Hangers
Leaf Spring Perch/Saddle
Leaf Spring Plate
Leaf Spring U Clamps
Shackles
Shackle Bolts

57" Live Solid Steering Axle
Track Link & Drag Link
Steering Box
Steering Rod/Linkage


The MRCBT/Hydraulic Assisted steering setup will be tricky.

2) For SFRA to FFRA
40-60K if new parts are used.

Regards,

Arka
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Old 9th March 2010, 14:23   #1047
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Default Pete's Box

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Originally Posted by DirtyDan View Post
Do they come in pastels?

Arka, for a lot of people the Thar will be enough. Their idea of off-roading is more like a country picnic. Take the family, some food, a huge I.C.E unit and a portable TV and go look at nature.

I am not saying they are right....I am saying there may be a market for this. An entrepreneur must stay open to the possibilities. Hopefully more will come out of M&M.
Hi DD,

You forgot to add the Petes Box, its the first mod on the to do list for the AWB.

Its a Scorpio cross-dressing as an MM540, what if people expect OTR capability of the bat?

Hopefully we will get Pastel Shades and Soothing Dual Colour interiors from M&M.

Regards,

Arka

Last edited by ex670c : 9th March 2010 at 14:25.
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Old 9th March 2010, 15:40   #1048
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Hi Arka,

1. Can there be a Thar which would suffice the following two requirements:
a. Hard Core off-roader
b. A family car for long drives (with a cruise speed of say around 100-120 kmph since Indian roads are now getting only better).

2. Is my first question valid?

These questions are on behalf of those guys who can afford to have one car and have the best of both: sheer adrenaline rush and marital status intact (what I here mean is that it should behave as a car for the family for a daily ride as well).

- Tejas


Quote:
Originally Posted by ex670c View Post
Hi DD,

You forgot to add the Petes Box, its the first mod on the to do list for the AWB.

Its a Scorpio cross-dressing as an MM540, what if people expect OTR capability of the bat?

Hopefully we will get Pastel Shades and Soothing Dual Colour interiors from M&M.

Regards,

Arka
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Old 9th March 2010, 15:44   #1049
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Originally Posted by vinod_nookala View Post
Sorry i forgot to add power here. Engine power and rev ability coupled with light chassis and suitable tires can perform well on sand dunes.

Back on topic- As to what i insisted, foreign market relies on customization! Are Audi Q7's/Q5' popular in OTR scene there? Why? Because there isn't much you can do with these vehicles. When you think of an OTR vehicle what comes to your mind?-

Land rover defender or freelander?
Jeep wrangler or Jeep compass?
Suzuki Jimny or Grand vitara?
Toyota LC70 or RAV 4?

Guess why have they become such an Icon? Because people can take it stock and modify them! This is true to market abroad! These are the vehicles which leave last impression and not the current cutie pies!

Solid axle both front & rear provides immense scope for tyre upgrades. Considering THar sells at 13000 Euros and Jeep sell at about 22,000 euros for the base version. Now if a man buys a Mahindra and if he could upgrade imagine what kind of a lethal machine Thar could have been!! I would say an opportunity lost!

i think even after the launch of much awaited THAR, offroad mud pluggers will still be buying ex-army 550s and converting them as per their needs and requirments.

this will be done mostly by people who cant afford to buy a 6L+ THAR just to satisfy their offroad 4WD desires but still want a capable 4WD vehicle (2nd vehicle) for themselves to indulge in offroad activities!

look at Harjeev's Ranger, he was selling it at 3L fully restored!

and im sure an ex-army restoration doesnt cost more then 3-4L at the best!

now the price factor will play a very big role in THAR proving its VFM with the stuff it will come equipped as a 4WD vehicle!
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Old 9th March 2010, 17:27   #1050
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Originally Posted by Parm View Post
this will be done mostly by people who cant afford to buy a 6L+ THAR just to satisfy their offroad 4WD desires but still want a capable 4WD vehicle (2nd vehicle) for themselves to indulge in offroad activities!
Parm, the question is not just on whether one can afford to buy a Thar or not. The question is whether Thar would satisfy those offroad 4wd desires or not. Price is not the only factor!
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