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Originally Posted by Untouchables09 Hey, Hello?
a 12 Lacs rupee premium C+ segment car not having as small thing as Fog Lamps?
a 9-10 Lac rupee premium C Seg car not having ACC, a proper CD Player, Fog Lamps, Alloys? The guy who is buying 9-10-12 Lac rupee worth premium car definitely deserves such regular equipments as a given. Period. |
I don't think anyone disagrees with the fact that the ANHC needs some more gizmos. However, to most, including me, the best piece of equipment that a car can have is the engine. The ANHC not only has the most powerful, but also the most fuel efficient. The market seems to think that the ANHC lacks less (in equipment) than the Linea does in other areas (performance, fit & finish, after sales quality, trust factor in the brand, resale etc.).
Last but not the least, its easier to fit alloys & fogs in an ANHC than it is to improve the performance of the Linea, or get that kind of outright reliability (ZERO niggles after 7 years in my OHC, says a lot wot?), resale value (difference of atleast 1.5+ lakhs if current trends are anything to go by), interior fit & finish or the trust factor in a brand (invaluable, don't you think?).
Your "Hey, Hello?" expression can also be extended for the Linea:
Interior fit & finish of a Tata?
Niggles of a Tata?
After-sales service of a Tata (literally!)?
A 0 - 100 that will be left for dead by a 4.5 lakh rupee hatchback?
Fuel efficiency of an SUV?
Rear seat headroom of a coupe?
Resale value of a Daewoo?
The point : Lets be reasonable here and accept each car for what it is. There's really no point in driving any car down.
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Originally Posted by RX135 Well, if you look at Spark and GP's segments each, you'll note that 4000 of Spark is roughly same market share as 1500 of GP. |
RX, you & I both know that the market doesn't doubt GM / Chevy as much as they do Fiat. You'll hear a question mark around Fiat a lot more than you will on GM, an equally hit brand IMO. The market share comment is irrelevant as I am giving an example of a brand that is still shaky, yet manages to sell. The fact is, the Spark still manages to sell 4,000 cars despite the companys shaky reputation in the recent past. Read = 4,000 put their money on a GM product. Look up the 12 lakh Cruze testdrive threads. No one is worried about putting their money on a GM.
Not to forget, the Punto is down from the 1700 - 1800 launch level to 1500. Expected of a new launch (while the Chevy is selling 4000 cars after several years of introduction). Note, this is at a time when the overall segment has grown.
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Leave out 0-100 figures and suddenly, there isn't anything so much exciting about the car, which claims to be far superior than others to demand 1.5Lakh premium.
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In addition to the performance, which matters a heck of a lot to us enthusiasts, the ANHC also:
- Absolute lack of niggles and stupendous long term reliability. My OHC has zero niggles compared to brand new Lineas.
- Has better after-sales than Tata-Fiat can hope to manage. Atleast in the near future.
- All-roundedness. Excels in some areas, mid-pack in some and last only in equipment. I'd rather have a 10 second 0 - 100 car than a substantially slower car with more equipment, thank you.
- Way better resale. The price differential is more than made up in the resale alone.
- Better fuel efficiency.
- Way better overall fit & finish. No messed up ergonomics either (e.g. a cramped footwell) or parts going loose within weeks of ownership/.
- Way better NVH. The ANHCs engine is far more refined, and doesn't really make the noise that the Linea's does.
- Far easier to pilot in the City.
- Trust in the brand. And why not? Honda has NOT goofed up in the last 10 years as Fiat has. I say, Fiat has gotten what it deserved to.
Take a look at this extremely objective comparo:
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- Performance : City > SX4 > Verna > Linea
- Fuel efficiency : City > SX4 > Linea > Verna
- Ride quality : Linea > City > Verna > SX4
- Handling : Linea > SX4 > City > Verna
- Interior space : City > Verna > SX4 > Linea
- Looks : Linea > City > SX4 > Verna (purely my opinion)
- Overall Fit / Finish : City > Verna > SX4 > Linea
- Features : Linea > SX4 > City > Verna
- Brand (for those whom it matters to) : City > SX4 > Verna > Linea
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It can't beat Linea in looks, handling or ride.
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Looks are subjective, ride & handling entirely agreed.
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If City has better fit n finish, Linea is solidly built like just any other Fiat.
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Agreed. But modern Hondas & Toyotas aren't really fragile as the OHC was. Those wafer-thin flimsy days are gone.
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All these are quite important but non-quantifiable factors, which do not get published on specs sheets for comparison.
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They don't for sure. But where do the market priorities lie? Its pretty evident from the sales figures isn't it?
At the end of the day, a good product is one that gives the market what it really wants.
The non-quantifiable factors of a Honda City are the exact reason that I'm still holding on, and look forward to driving, a 7 year old example. Despite not having an budgetary restrictions to upgrade. She works day in and day out with ZERO complain. And you know that I don't baby my cars, she is driven hard.
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To put things in perspective, outgoing City, i.e. NHC, was consistently doing numbers exceeding 4000 and at times, touching 6000 occasionally.
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Incorrect information & perspective. Jan - Dec 2007 NHC sales : 36,855 or an average of 3,071 cars per month. Jan - Oct NHC 2008 (sales stopped this month) : 29,801 cars or 2,980 cars a month. The ONLY time the NHC went over 6,000 cars in the last 3 years was in March 2008, a feat that the ANHC matched in March 2009.
Fact is, despite a higher seller price, the ANHC has matched the NHCs success (contrary to my own predictions). This, despite having more competition too.
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As far as Pune goes, I can definitely see more Lineas compared to AHNCs
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Unfortunately, the market doesn't run on how many cars we spot, and we do have access to hard numbers. For the record, I'm spotting a phenomenal number of ANHCs in Mumbai.
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Altis has silently displaced Civic.
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Without doubt. But you will also understand the market situation where the Altis has a base version which is very popular with cabs / hotels, the Civic doesn't. And the Civic has a 9 lakh rupee sibling that the Altis doesn't. There is substantial product overlap between the City and the Civic.