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Originally Posted by shortbread

On the topic of the UK navy, there's news going around that the UK is looking to retire early their Albion class amphibious ships due to staff and budget shortages. These ships have atleast 10-15 years of life in them. Considering the Indian Navy is looking to plug its amphibious capability, wont these ships be an ideal stop gap measure. Among the three forces the Indian navy has been the most pragmatic, I hope they look into the possibilities.

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/shap...oogle_vignette

This reminds me of when the RN flogged it's erstwhile LPD, HMS Ocean to the Brazilians. That was another capability I'm sure we've had stuck in a tender for yonks now. If the Brits are serious about culling these amphibs then I don't see why not in terms of making a bid for them. The Tories are pretty much on the way out and they're selling the family jewellery so might as well capitalise. That being said I feel there's a reticence towards any second hand kit from our side, even if it's fairly low mileage capital ships. I can't see them changing hands to India, fortuitous though it may be to get a pair of them too! I'm sure they'd fit right in, in terms of the whole Andamans scope of operations.

Coming back to the Brits, think I saw rumour that one of their frigates or similar such surface combatants are also on the chopping block early due to fiscal and manning constraints. Losing the amphibs will make the Royal Marines redundant in their foundational role unless they pad out any USMC Task Group because who are we kidding, when is the UK going to stage any amphibious operation by itself? Their diminished but rationalised posture Should be policing the North Sea against Russian incursion/misadventure and alleviating NATO workload in the Mediterranean, that's it. It's a hard pill to take clearly for the older members of the admiralty.

[shortbread]

Originally Posted by ads11

This reminds me of when the RN flogged it's erstwhile LPD, HMS Ocean to the Brazilians. That was another capability I'm sure we've had stuck in a tender for yonks now. If the Brits are serious about culling these amphibs then I don't see why not in terms of making a bid for them. The Tories are pretty much on the way out and they're selling the family jewellery so might as well capitalise. That being said I feel there's a reticence towards any second hand kit from our side, even if it's fairly low mileage capital ships.

Had this been the army or the air force I would have agreed. But the Navy has been more pragmatic with it's approach and historically procured used vessels from Russia, US, UK etc... whenever it provided a more practical solution to maintaining fleet requirements.

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Originally Posted by shortbread

Had this been the army or the air force I would have agreed. But the Navy has been more pragmatic with it's approach and historically procured used vessels from Russia, US, UK etc... whenever it provided a more practical solution to maintaining fleet requirements.

I feel like this might've been true in the past but other than the re-lease on the Chakra SSN I can't think of any used assets the IN has got in the last decade? At least not any that immediately comes to mind.

The LPD/LHD requirement has been in place well over a decade now with seemingly no movement. I wonder if having these two ships fall in our lap finally triggers acting on that need. Would be better still if we could not only buy the ships but license the design perhaps to make domestically built follow on classes (given the prudent history of the IN of having an in house design bureau)? Because last I heard the plan was to partner with an external OEM to draw up an Indian-ised version of something like the Mistral or San Juan class (admittedly those are a different kind of ship). Anyway all this is a lovely thought experiment. I've not seen any movement from India when it comes to acquiring any of these early retirement military assets from the UK.

[dragracer567]

With neighbours like these .........

By now, most of us would've been aware of the schism between Maldives and India, laid bare during a diplomatic spat.

Now, Maldives is a country that's really dependent on India for its national, food and economic security - a lot like Nepal or Bhutan. But unlike these countries, it is a relatively prosperous country with a GDP per capita of 16,000 USD - about 6 times that of India and more than China though this number is heavily distorted due to a tiny population and overreliance on tourism. India has helped them multiple times - infamously airlifting commandos to thwart a coup and emergency response when there was a drinking water crisis. Further, financial assistance provided to the Maldives runs into billions - for a country with a population less than a locality in Delhi.

Anyway, the current administration has decided that India is a bully and the reason for all evils and has asked India to withdraw its troops who funnily enough are posted there to maintain and pilot the Dornier aircraft that was donated to Maldives. Recently, a child died because the president refused to give permission to use the aircraft for airlifting the child for a medical emergency.

Now, Maldives (like Sri Lanka before them) has permitted what is ostensibly a Chinese spy ship - the Xiang Yang Hong 03 to dock in Maldives likely to spy on Indian missile tests. Sri Lanka has refused permission this time for the ship to dock. Funny how the current President doesn't want foreign military assets on his soil unless it's from his backers. As the saying goes, with neighbours like these .............

[shortbread]

Originally Posted by dragracer567

.

Anyway, the current administration has decided that India is a bully and the reason for all evils and has asked India to withdraw its troops who funnily enough are posted there to maintain and pilot the Dornier aircraft that was donated to Maldives. Recently, a child died because the president refused to give permission to use the aircraft for airlifting the child for a medical emergency.

Now, Maldives (like Sri Lanka before them) has permitted what is ostensibly a Chinese spy ship - the Xiang Yang Hong 03 to dock in Maldives likely to spy on Indian missile tests. Sri Lanka has refused permission this time for the ship to dock. Funny how the current President doesn't want foreign military assets on his soil unless it's from his backers. As the saying goes, with neighbours like these .............

One thing the Indian administration knows to play better than the chinese is democracy. With time it has been successful in getting favourable regimes into power in the immediate neighbourhood and 'watch' the downfall of the unfavourable ones.

[skanchan95]

Indian Navy rescues 19 Pakistani nationals from Somali pirates

In less than 36 hours, INS Sumitra (P59), a Saryu class Patrol vessel, has rescued 2 hijacked fishing vessels!!!

INS Sumitra Carries out 2nd Successful Anti Piracy Ops – Rescuing 19 Crew members and Vessel from Somali Pirates

Posted On: 30 JAN 2024 9:34AM by PIB Delhi

Indian Naval Ship Sumitra, having thwarted the Piracy attempt on FV Iman, has carried out yet another successful anti-piracy operation off the East Coast of Somalia, rescuing Fishing Vessel Al Naeemi and her Crew (19 Pakistani Nationals) from 11 Somali Pirates.

INS Sumitra, Indian Navy’s indigenous Offshore Patrol Vessel had been deployed for Anti-Piracy and Maritime Security Operations East of Somalia and Gulf of Aden. The warship on PM 28 Jan 24 had responded to a distress message regarding hijacking of an Iranian flagged Fishing Vessel (FV) Iman, which had been boarded by pirates & the crew taken as hostages. The FV was intercepted by INS Sumitra and following the SOPs and coercive posturing the vessel and her Crew (17 Iranian Nationals) were safely rescued in the early hours of 29 Jan 24. FV Iman was sanitised and released for onward transit.

Subsequently, INS Sumitra was again pressed into action, to locate and intercept another Iranian flagged fishing vessel Al Naeemi, which had been boarded by pirates and her Crew (19 Pakistani Nationals) taken hostage. Responding swiftly to the developing situation Sumitra intercepted the FV on PM 29 Jan 24 and through coercive posturing and effective deployment of her integral helo and boats compelled the safe release of the crew and the vessel. The ship also undertook confirmatory boarding to sanitise and also to check on the well-being of the crew who were held captive by the Somali pirates.

INS Sumitra, over the course of less than 36 hours, through swift, persistent and relentless efforts has rescued two hijacked Fishing Vessels along with 36 Crew (17 Iranian and 19 Pakistani) in Southern Arabian Sea approximately 850 nm West of Kochi, and prevented misuse of these Fishing Vessels as Mother Ships for further acts of Piracy on Merchant Vessels.

The Indian Navy has once again proved its commitment in the region to act against all maritime threats in order to ensure safety of all mariners and vessels at sea.

[dragracer567]

Originally Posted by skanchan95

Indian Navy rescues 19 Pakistani nationals from Somali pirates

In less than 36 hours, INS Sumitra (P59), a Saryu class Patrol vessel, has rescued 2 hijacked fishing vessels!!!
Attachment 2566937

I'm a bit perplexed by the Somali pirates joining the action because most of the international deployments were to project ships against the Houthis. Are the Somali pirates just taking advantage of a difficult situation?

[skanchan95]

Originally Posted by dragracer567

Are the Somali pirates just taking advantage of a difficult situation?

Quite possibly as the piracy related incidents had become nearly zero prior to the Houthis "declaring war" on International shipping. Previously, some Yemenis were also caught in piracy related incidents alongside the Somalis. Won't be surprised if the Houthis have egged on the Somali pirates to take advantage of the situation.

The Somali pirates are well aware that all Western Navy ships which were earlier deployed on anti-piracy patrols have their focus mainly towards Houthi controlled areas in Yemen to detect incoming missiles and to provide assistance to merchants ships that get hit.

While ships from Navies like the PLAN or the Pakistani Navy are there just to mark their presence in the area, they seem to do nothing else. It should be a matter of embarrassment to the Pakistani Navy that the Indian Navy responded with force and rescued Pakistani fishermen from Somali pirates.

[V.Narayan]

INS Sandhayak, a survey ship, to be commissioned at Visakhapatnam on February 3rd

India will commission its latest survey vessel, the INS Sandhayak (Y-3025) on 3 February 2024, adding to India’s capability for full scale hydrographic surveys of the seabed in ports and harbours, as well as navigational channels, in environments ranging from narrow channels to the deep seas. INS Sandhayak is the lead ship of a new class of 4 survey vessels. Today with oil drilling and prospects of seabed mining and risks of our enemies (read China) planting listening or other devices in our shallows next to our ports the role of a survey ship acquires new meaning.

In addition to its survey capability, which has an important role in seabed warfare, as a secondary role she functions as a hospital ship, civil disaster relief ship and troop transport ship during defence and emergency operations.

INS Sandhayak shares its name with a predecessor ship, decommissioned on 4 June 2021.

The ship is 110 metres in length, has a full load displacement of 3400 tons and has a top speed of 18 knots. It has a range of over 6500 nautical miles (12,000 kms) at its survey speed of 14 knots. She is fitted with an array of sonars and other hydrographic equipment to map the seabed, currents, including ROVs(Remotely Operated Vehicles) and AUVs (autonomous Underwater Vehicles). She carries a medium helicopter to aid survey work.

Quirky Fact: Where Survey ships go the IN has always had at any time over the last 150+ years one ship named INS Investigator. As a matter of tradition even after independence in 1947 we have continued this practice.

[V.Narayan]

Milan 2024 Naval Exercise, Visakhapatnam

https://www.in-milan.in/IntroductiontoMILAN.aspx

Later this month the IN will host 50 countries, at Visakhapatnam, in a 10-day naval exercise-cum-symposium. Included in this will be a 4-day at sea joint exercise of ships and aircraft. Milan is held every alternate year. When it started in the mid-1990s, four foreign navies participated - Singapore, Indonesia, Sri Lanka and Thailand. I recall reading about it then in the news and thought this was a Bay of Bengal exercise. Never thought it would sprout to be so big. Today almost every country of the Indian Ocean Region and Asia-Pacific and a few from Europe/North America will participate. I wish we had Taiwan on the list. Good to see Canada on the list despite our differences with a certain Mon. Trudeau.

Glad the IN is focusing on real things like this rather than the distractions of so called Indianizing uniforms and nomenclature of ranks.


Invitees. 50 expected to send their staff and ships


Both carriers will participate. Dear MoD, time those Rafales came in.

[dragracer567]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Milan 2024 Naval Exercise, Visakhapatnam

What amazes me about such multilateral exercises is the fact that while we have invited countries who are friendly to us (which includes every country except Pakistan, China & to some extent Turkey), many of the participants are notable foes amongst themselves. For example, we have ships from the Western bloc (Australia, Japan, France & US) and then there is the anti-Western bloc represented by Iran and Russia. So, would there be some form of EW or snooping between these groups? Are there some measures that India would have to take to keep these groups apart and such activities?

It's not just India, every country hosting such events has to deal with this predicament - for example, during a recent Russian Naval Parade, remember seeing a photo of INS Tabar and PNS Zulfiqar parked right next to each other.

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by dragracer567

What amazes me about such multilateral exercises is the fact that while we have invited countries who are friendly to us (which includes every country except Pakistan, China & to some extent Turkey), many of the participants are notable foes amongst themselves. For example, we have ships from the Western bloc (Australia, Japan, France & US) and then there is the anti-Western bloc represented by Iran and Russia. So, would there be some form of EW or snooping between these groups? Are there some measures that India would have to take to keep these groups apart and such activities?

It's not just India, every country hosting such events has to deal with this predicament - for example, during a recent Russian Naval Parade, remember seeing a photo of INS Tabar and PNS Zulfiqar parked right next to each other.

Snooping obviously and quietly is the job of every naval person and force :-). It is for the one being snooped upon to lock their doors. A ship can switch off all electronics while in harbour except radio link with the port. A ship could indulge in emitting false signals to fool PNS Zulfiqar {and others in her position} to give an incorrect picture for the opponent to mull over.

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Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Glad the IN is focusing on real things like this rather than the distractions of so called Indianizing uniforms and nomenclature of ranks.

Hear hear!!

Both carriers will participate.

Interesting - have both been fielded simultaneously in an exercise before? It'll be interesting I'm sure for many of the participants with Vikramaditya providing a proxy for the Liaoning(/Shandong too?) I reckon.

Originally Posted by dragracer567

What amazes me about such multilateral exercises is the fact that while we have invited countries who are friendly to us (which includes every country except Pakistan, China & to some extent Turkey), many of the participants are notable foes amongst themselves. For example, we have ships from the Western bloc (Australia, Japan, France & US) and then there is the anti-Western bloc represented by Iran and Russia.

I wonder if the IN planners get some assistance here from the diplomatic corps from the Foreign Ministry for eg - I imagine especially for such enormous multinational exercises they can't be going ahead without involvement from career bureaucrats.

[V.Narayan]

INS Jatayu | Navy commissions base in Minicoy Islands off India's Western seaboard

https://swarajyamag.com/defence/ins-...st-to-maldives
https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/world...8fe19a06&ei=50

This new base is to serve as a staging point/ refueling & support base for patrol around the Maldives and the Southern half of our Western seaboard. It is expected to in the near future feature an air strip capable of operating the P-8I and the MQ-9B MALE drone.

Maldives under its current administration of Mohd. Miuzzu has concluded, two days ago, a military pact with China and we should expect more nosey Chinese maritime intruders from Maldives in the near future. In a way we are now in a cold war with China. We have berthing & fueling rights in Vietnam, we are selling Brahmos anti-ship missiles to Philippines and they are snuggling into Maldives, not to mention Gwadar and Djibouti.

[dragracer567]

Found this video on X (formerly Twitter) that seems to show INS Tushil - the new batch of Talwar class undergoing sea-trials in Russia

For the initiated, India has been operating six different Talwar class frigates since 2003 bought in two different batches with upgrades in the new batch. Recently, India ordered four more units - 2 of which were supposed to be made in India and would apparently be different enough to be a new class - the Triput class. The deliveries were delayed due to the Russian invasion of Ukraine with resources being diverted to the war effort while the turbines powering these vessels are Ukrainian which complicated the situation further. The recent batches were supposed to have VLS launchers unlike the previous though it's not clear in this video. This is a ship proven in India service including some deployments in the recent Red Sea crisis though the heavy-hitting destroyers stood at the front lines. Concurrently, the Nilgiri class vessels should start coming in as well - steadily increasing the Navy's numbers till the next gen Project 18 destroyers come in.

Screengrab courtesy - @alpha_defense (X - formerly Twitter)