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Old 5th March 2018, 11:24   #16
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz spotted testing with some updates

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Originally Posted by Carma2017 View Post
That is factually incorrect. The M15 engine does service in China and for exports of Maruti like gasoline S-Cross. The engine for Ciaz is K15 series from the acclaimed K-Series line up. The M series is not really known for fuel efficiency as was the case in SX4. The K- Series on the other hand is all about reduction of losses and improving efficiency.
All the reports claimed M15. I was wondering if it's M15, Why Maruti is taking so much time to get it . No news of K15 anywhere , is this Suzuki global engine or specific to Indian market?
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Old 5th March 2018, 15:11   #17
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

I personally think that this is a welcome change. Most of the higher end Marutis aren't adequately powered in comparison to their comparison. Case in point, Ciaz vs Verna/City. The power output of the Ciaz, City, Vento and Rapid are at another level altogether.

It's time Maruti stops milking the cow (1.3 DDIS and 1.4 petrol) and tries to create another star lineup.
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Old 5th March 2018, 16:42   #18
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

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Originally Posted by Dr.Naren View Post
Maruti Suzuki has clearly been paying heed to feedback and the decision to move to more powerful engines seems to be directly in consequence of that.


To me it appears more like Maruti’s response to the “change or perish” situation. With Verna, City, Rapid, Vento and the upcoming Yaris, all equipped with 1.5L plus sized engines pumping out 100+ horses, the engineers at MSIL clearly understood that the honeymoon period of the Ciaz is almost over. Ciaz is now under a threat of getting irrelevant to the market (much more than ever before), if not updated in time.

Coming to the question of MSIL paying heed to the feedback from its customers, there are several areas such as, flimsy body panels, rattles, etc., which MSIL have been cleverly overlooking since ages.
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Old 5th March 2018, 18:17   #19
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

It is a welcoming change of mindset from Maruti Suzuki R&D, especially after so many years of hue and cry from us

But based on the Suzuki's I have driven here, the M15 is a 110Bhp engine and am not a fan of it. I rather would prefer the lively K14 (140PS) and hope it is it. Or as per carma, if it is a new k15 series Engines, hope it is better than the M15
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Old 5th March 2018, 18:17   #20
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

Undoubtedly, Ciaz is one of the most fuel efficient sedans in India. I doubt the consumers(outside of Team-Bhp) who actually visit MS are expecting anything beyond a very good FE, and a strong resale value, to which the Ciaz caters perfectly. The 1.4L petrol engine in the Ciaz outshines some petrol hatchbacks from Maruti's own stable w.r.t FE.

MSIL would rather launch the new and powerful engines with the S-cross which is more aspired by the enthusiasts, unlike the Ciaz.
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Old 5th March 2018, 18:29   #21
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

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Originally Posted by King_pin09 View Post
To me it appears more like Maruti’s response to the “change or perish” situation. With Verna, City, Rapid, Vento and the upcoming Yaris, all equipped with 1.5L plus sized engines pumping out 100+ horses, the engineers at MSIL clearly understood that the honeymoon period of the Ciaz is almost over.
Maruti Suzuki's Ciaz beats Honda's City even in Feb-18 sales, so it is not the question of its honeymoon being over.
For the 1.5 engines it is more so getting ready for meeting the upcoming norms in 2020.
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Old 5th March 2018, 22:18   #22
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz spotted testing with some updates

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Originally Posted by Dr.Naren View Post
Petrol engine is not all new. It is downsized M16. Diesel is all new engine. Maruti has been working on it since couple of years. Maruti sources are saying that the engine is impressive with very good drivability.
Is it that easy to downsize an engine? Why did they not consider the M15A instead?

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Originally Posted by arunphilip View Post
Moreover, given the sedan segment they're targeting these engines at (and the competition they're going up against), the performance and quality targets will be high indeed.

For any newly designed engine (or similar system like gearbox), there is always a chance that something slips through the cracks; that is the reason we see manufacturers having recalls.

For that matter, even for a tried and trusted engine, all you'd need is a bad batch of parts (e.g. ball bearings that crack in half the design life), to cause a problem.

That said, a naturally aspirated petrol engine is generally quite straightforward and simple, so there's not too much that can go wrong. At most, the tuning of the engine maps might require tweaking over time.
Exactly, target will be quite high!

I understand that part failures happen, but that's different from design failure. When we look at Honda, we appreciate their engines. Can Maruti replicate such a success?

If so, what was stopping Maruti to develop it for so long?
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Old 5th March 2018, 23:35   #23
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz spotted testing with some updates

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Originally Posted by bansal.sushant View Post
Is it that easy to downsize an engine?
Many manufacturers have done it for Indian market.

VW 1.6 TDI to 1.5 TDI
Honda 1.6 IDTEC to 1.5 IDTEC
Ford 1.6 TDCI to 1.5 TDCI

Suzuki is using downsized M16, i.e M15 in few Asian markets.
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Old 6th March 2018, 02:45   #24
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Default Re: Maruti Ciaz spotted testing with some updates

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Originally Posted by bansal.sushant View Post
Is it that easy to downsize an engine? Why did they not consider the M15A instead?

Exactly, target will be quite high!

I understand that part failures happen, but that's different from design failure. When we look at Honda, we appreciate their engines. Can Maruti replicate such a success?

If so, what was stopping Maruti to develop it for so long?
Don't think a new petrol engine from Suzuki is ever going to be a concern. They have a pedigree similar to Honda's, in terms of petrol motors. I can't think of a bad and unreliable Suzuki petrol engine...ever. Underpowered for it's application, sure (looking at you MG410 & 1000 and maybe even the Ciaz petrol). So I don't really see anything going wrong in that regard, the petrol engine should be reliable and - if it's a K series motor - quite competent too.

The diesel though is a different thing altogether. Those are completely uncharted waters for Maruti Suzuki. That one we will have to see, cause diesel engines aren't the most friendly projects either - heck even Honda took time to get right ( they still haven't, in my opinion).

Last edited by suhaas307 : 12th June 2018 at 08:27. Reason: Trimming quoted post for improved readability
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Old 6th March 2018, 09:34   #25
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

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Originally Posted by King_pin09 View Post
To me it appears more like Maruti’s response to the “change or perish” situation. With Verna, City, Rapid, Vento and the upcoming Yaris, all equipped with 1.5L plus sized engines pumping out 100+ horses, the engineers at MSIL clearly understood that the honeymoon period of the Ciaz is almost over. Ciaz is now under a threat of getting irrelevant to the market (much more than ever before), if not updated in time.
Ciaz has its own USP in terms of pricing, VFM, comfort and ASS. Although it surely lacks the power when compared to competition, many buyers don't really care for power figures much, especially when you know Indian roads don't allow you to make much of the 'available power' anyway. I don't really think Ciaz was in high risk, but it's great to have updates, always!
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Old 8th March 2018, 07:28   #26
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

Source: https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/te...s-2521415.html

Maruti is yet to decide between its own new 1.5L diesel engine and Fiat's offer of a 1.5L engine! If this is the case and they decide to use the Fiat engine, the launch may get delayed further as the testing has to happen again, imo.

Last edited by romeomidhun : 8th March 2018 at 07:30.
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Old 8th March 2018, 15:18   #27
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by romeomidhun View Post
Source: https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/te...s-2521415.html

Maruti is yet to decide between its own new 1.5L diesel engine and Fiat's offer of a 1.5L engine! If this is the case and they decide to use the Fiat engine, the launch may get delayed further as the testing has to happen again, imo.
If they choose to equip new Ciaz with Fiat 1.6/1.5 engine, a rigorous road test might not be required.

Whatever it may be, it's a welcome news because Fiat engines are reliable and in particular 1.6 is powerful and refined. I wish they use 1.6 and not the re-tuned 1.5, a reduced power/torque version.

It seems Fiat is desperate here and thus Maruti may strike a good deal.

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Old 8th March 2018, 17:53   #28
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

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Originally Posted by Keralite View Post
If they choose to equip new Ciaz with Fiat 1.6/1.5 engine, a rigorous road test might not be required.

Whatever it may be, it's a welcome news because Fiat engines are reliable and in particular 1.6 is powerful and refined. I wish they use 1.6 and not the re-tuned 1.5, a reduced power/torque version.

It seems Fiat is desperate here and thus Maruti may strike a good deal.

I doubt they will use the 1.6 liter engine because that would mean that any excise benefits which would be enjoyed by a 1.5 liter engine based vehicle would become inapplicable. It will probably be a detuned version of the 1.6 liter Multijet if at all a Fiat sourced rather than an in-house engine is used.
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Old 8th March 2018, 18:03   #29
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

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Originally Posted by arindambasu13 View Post
I doubt they will use the 1.6 liter engine because that would mean that any excise benefits which would be enjoyed by a 1.5 liter engine based vehicle would become inapplicable. It will probably be a detuned version of the 1.6 liter Multijet if at all a Fiat sourced rather than an in-house engine is used.
The excise duty benefits only apply if the car is also sub 4 metres in length. I dont know the length of the Ciaz but doubt it would be less than 4m. Hence that would not be a decision factor here.
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Old 9th March 2018, 13:16   #30
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Default re: The Maruti Ciaz Facelift. EDIT: Now launched at ₹ 8.19 lakhs

It's a welcome change, I drive a Petrol Ciaz. The car does it hold itself pretty decently till 110-120 kmph on highways. It do struggle a little for spirited overtaking though.
With a little bit more power on tap, Ciaz could be a true all rounder. Even now the power to weight ratio of a petrol Ciaz is not so lagged compared to Vento/Rapid.
Kudos to Maruthi if they can pull this well.
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