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Originally Posted by anachronix If its acceptable for ANHC, its also the same for the Linea where both are targeting the premium C segment. |
You think no one will be cross-shopping between the Linea and the Manza, even though they are both sold in the same showroom, the same size, and despite the fact that the Manza has more accomodating interiors + comes from a brand which is far more trustworthy?
I can tell you this as an analyst : It's wishful thinking.
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But how does it justify the fact that the Manza would eat into the sales of the Linea which I would expect to be almost 1 - 2L over the Manza.
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I sincerely hope that the Linea is not 2 lakh rupees more than the Manza because that will kill the Linea. Like I said earlier, wait and watch. Its going to be a close battle between the two. And no, there isn't going to be a 2 lakh price difference either.
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and for any premium hatch to be a hit in India needs time and maturity.
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Please update yourself with the i20 sales figures. It has been a rocking success. You can't get any more of a premium hatch than the i20.
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People overlooking the fact of "badge/brand value", its more to do with driving a Honda is the feel good factor here rather than driving a VFM car when it goes to the premium C segment!
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Well, I think its the product and the brand, you may think its only the feel good factor of driving a Honda. Whatever it is, it sure is working for the excellent ANHC. Maybe other brands should also work hard toward creating such an indestructible brand then, and not goof up with their customers / commitments.
And for all this talk of "premium brand" gibberish, I own a Mercedes Benz, a brand you can't get more premium than. Yet, and as I have amply stated earlier, I am not going to buy a new Mercedes for a LONG time to come. However, Honda can count me in as a return customer. Does that say a lot to you? I think it should.
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Originally Posted by finneyp Does it mean that those who bought Linea are Fiat fans or owned a Fiat before? |
Please read my statement again. I have not stated that ALL Linea buyers are Fiat purists, but have posted the same as one of the reasons that someone will choose a Linea over the Manza.
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Not really, we have not yet reached that stage! Very few do a detailed study of the cars available in the market, very few check the details on the net, very few do a Test drive too.
They just go by the brand image and by what their friend or uncle suggest them to buy!
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Whatever type of research they do, they still get the information they want. Fact is, according to a recent study, 1/3rd of car buyers now research on the internet. That is HUGE when you consider the low penetration rates.
Another fact : Word of mouth is something that I go by, and pretty sure most Team-BHPians do as well. Word of mouth rules, always has, and it is built on FACTS. Read = actual user experiences that build the reputation on the street. There is a reason why Maruti is what it is today.
I can't think of any truly pathetic product that sells well in India. It is glaringly evident that the Indian customer is making the right choices.
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Originally Posted by RX135 Fuel Efficiency of City and Linea are not drastically different. Linea weighs almost 120kg more, thanks to its solid build and returns approximately same FE as AHNC. |
10% more kpl still right? Also, don't overlook the fact that the ANHC engine offers 20% more power, yet delivers better fuel efficiency. Generally, more power = less efficiency. The ANHC, simply put, gives you the best of both worlds.
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More importantly, Linea comes at price tag of whooping 1.5L cheaper than AHNC, which is good enough to fill in for lack of FE |
The 1.5 - 2.0+ lakh resale of an ANHC will more than make up for that. Fiat petrols stink in depreciation, its a fact proven over the last 10 years with Fiat and 99% of Euro petrols which have had a diesel.
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one experiences ride and handling all the time one is inside the car.
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Where do you drive more RX? On the expressway or in the City? No taking anything away from the stability and handling of the Linea at 150 kph, but how often are you going to use that?
Take me as an example : 90% of my driving is within the city, I'm pretty sure its the same for most other BHPians. That means, for 90% of the time, the ANHC is better as:
- Its got lighter controls, a smaller turning radius and better efficiency : All of which make it much easier to drive in the city and for an overwhelming majority of typical Indian car usage trends.
- And no, again, the days of the OHC waftiness at speed are long gone. The Linea may have an edge at high speed, but the ANHC is good at 140 kph too. Just because one excels doesn't make the others bad. The ANHC more than does the job on the highway. Look up the many reviews of the car which state that high speed stability as one of the most significant improvements of the ANHC.
Net net, it will be much quicker in getting from pt. A to pt. B on an open road thanks to its 50% quicker acceleration rate. Heck, the difference is 5 seconds to the 100. Lets talk of the 12 - 15 second difference in getting to 150 between the ANHC and the Linea. The petrol Linea is the slowest in its segment, and the ANHC the fastest. A fundamental fact is, the ANHC will be able to exploit its handling a lot more than a slow car with better handling. You need to
really move to do that remember?
I speak for myself where I state that I enjoy driving a 10 second Honda, that sweet high-revving engine and working that slick gearbox. If I prefer this over my C220, I'm pretty sure I'll enjoy it over the Linea too.
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While AHNC is still selling in decent numbers, it has already tapered down sharply, while NHC ramped up all the time till it was selling, peaking in the end. NHC took over where OHC left (low numbers -> high) and AHNC took over from NHC, which was already selling like hot cake.
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Its just done 4,000+ cars last month! The fact is that the ANHC is managing the same averaged sales as the NHC did (to my surprise too, I might admit)!! And with far greater competition. To borrow from your terminology, the ANHC is also selling like a "hot cake".
Next, bring turnover into the picture. Same sales + a more expensive product. I don't need to explain to you that the net cash coming in will be higher.
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While Linea was never expected to beat AHNC, it has achieved its purpose well. For a brand, which had hit rock bottom just an year back, suddenly has become talk of town.
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I echo your thoughts here. Look up my September report for the exact comments. I'm probably the happiest at Fiats comeback due to their excellent cars.
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Comparing GM and Fiat, Fiat brand has been in shambles for long time before it started its recovery in India and worldwide, while GM has been respectable brand till economic meltdown. Both are recovering and I don't see drastic difference in the way they are recovering.
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Sure, but GM / Chevy can still sell a 100 units of a 20 lakh car that Fiat can only dream about. Don't forget the Spark example that I've given you. Look up sales numbers of the Spark when the bankruptcy was plastered all over newspapers + tv shows. They hardly moved! The truth is, the general public is not as scared of buying a Chevy today as they are of Fiat.
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Originally Posted by extreme_torque No offense to you just asking, All you wanted from your 9 lakh rupee car was reliability and refinement?
Keeping all your requirements in mind Hyundai i20 fits the bill perfectly |
The i20 is a hatch and he clearly wanted a sedan. In addition, he was looking for refinement, reliability, wide support network, resale and brand. All of which are very solid purchase factors. Not to mention, the ANHC AT's performance is way superior to the i20 ATs.
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Originally Posted by neoonwheels Lets give FIAT some time for Brand building (May be an year or two) as they are making a comeback. |
I'm the first to give them credit for this. And have been incredibly vocal about the same too.
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Originally Posted by StarVegabond Today, Automobile Market is a Buyers Market.......... |
Excellent post. It is indeed a buyers market and the Indian customer, who puts his money where his mouth is, has the loudest voice!