[HPP]

Regarding the missed shift discussion. Missing a shift is real and it happens to everyone regardless of the skill level. When you are trying to run your fastest timed run you have to shift as fast as possible and time the movement of your feet and your hand perfectly. It is much harder then you can imagine with a high HP car with a heavy clutch and all that power/tq fighting you as well. In any case, it happens, and it kills 1/4 mile times.

Originally Posted by DKG

You could study the Dubai Autodrome business model to understand if something like this is workeable in India.

Originally Posted by v1p3r

Too expensive. An acre of land is worth more in HYD and BLR than most American cities.

Yeah, I've looked at the Dubai scene, but it's a bit of a different situation then India and HYD. Land may not be an issue as a lot is already owned. If the scene ever shows real promise, it's an option I/we'd be very interested in researching further.

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by HPP

Yeah, I've looked at the Dubai scene, but it's a bit of a different situation then India and HYD. Land may not be an issue as a lot is already owned. If the scene ever shows real promise, it's an option I/we'd be very interested in researching further.

That's an interesting statement. What I DO know is that if your proposed dragstrip/track was based around BLR, you could recover your investment a lot quicker than any other city in India. BLR is just dying for some sort of official motorsport. Have a dragstrip and charge 500 bucks a run, I'm sure you'll be pulling in lakhs over a weekend.

[HPP]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

That's an interesting statement. What I DO know is that if your proposed dragstrip/track was based around BLR, you could recover your investment a lot quicker than any other city in India. BLR is just dying for some sort of official motorsport. Have a dragstrip and charge 500 bucks a run, I'm sure you'll be pulling in lakhs over a weekend.

I do believe that something near BLR or Bombay would have a larger market. The issue is the proximity to the investors and possible management(all in HYD), as well as the already owned land is mostly all near HYD. We'll keep flushing out ideas and possibilities and try to figure out a solution in the future. I just hope the market continues to grow, if so, I'd love to get this project past the market analysis stage to the planning stage and beyond.

[DKG]

Originally Posted by HPP

I do believe that something near BLR or Bombay would have a larger market. The issue is the proximity to the investors and possible management(all in HYD), as well as the already owned land is mostly all near HYD. We'll keep flushing out ideas and possibilities and try to figure out a solution in the future. I just hope the market continues to grow, if so, I'd love to get this project past the market analysis stage to the planning stage and beyond.

If you already own the land get a drag and a offroad track made. Turn it into a weekend motorsports activity hub. It will work.

[HPP]

Originally Posted by DKG

If you already own the land get a drag and a offroad track made. Turn it into a weekend motorsports activity hub. It will work.

That was my thought as well. Start fairly basic(keep overhead as low as possible) and add features as things progress. This isn't something that will happen overnight, but I'll be working with my relatives/cousins to start planning it out in more detail. Some of them were at this last event and I think it may have convinced them even more so that the market is or could be there.

[f450]

Not to be a pessimist, but I have my doubts about this project if the investment is very high. The main reason is that the market is pretty limited. Not in terms of number, but in terms of segment. It's aimed only at 18-28 year olds (or maybe slightly more) and nobody else. It's not a family outing, so putting it on the outskirts will further dwindle the market. And last but not least, even car enthusiasts might fail to see the point of paying 500 rupees to do something that you can do on a KBR or an ORR.

I do have an alternative suggestion that might eliminate some of these disadvantages but I'd like to hear the counter-arguments for this first.

Note from the Team-BHP Support Staff : Abusive language – whether used directly or indirectly - is STRICTLY prohibited on Team-BHP. A decent communication protocol must be adhered to.

[jassi]

Originally Posted by f450

Not to be a pessimist, but I have my doubts about this project if the investment is very high. The main reason is that the market is pretty limited. Not in terms of number, but in terms of segment. It's aimed only at 18-28 year olds (or maybe slightly more) and nobody else. It's not a family outing, so putting it on the outskirts will further dwindle the market. Add to that the fact that normal employees who are not petrol heads will be hesitant to "f*** their cars up". And last but not least, even car enthusiasts might fail to see the point of paying 500 rupees to do something that you can do on a KBR or an ORR.

I do have an alternative suggestion that might eliminate some of these disadvantages but I'd like to hear the counter-arguments for this first.

well a small go kart track and restaurant (a must) could keep the family happy. I don't think driving on a public road can replace what one can do on the track. Track days are a big concept in aussie, uk, etc. and I am sure theres petrol heads at every age who would like to have some good time with their cars in india too Although my outlook maybe very positive, I am sure this will kick off over time, given the number of track days, I have seen being organised by the tbhpians itself!

[DKG]

Originally Posted by HPP

Start fairly basic(keep overhead as low as possible) and add features as things progress.

Dragstrip, go kart track and a offroad track is a good way to start. A pay and play park where people come with their family for a weekend of fun. You can run a foodcourt and eventually a accessory shop with car wash etc. You could create a series of adventure activities too. Perhaps a hobby centre too, a large shed will do. Basically keep adding and fine tuning revenue streams. Hyderabad needs a hobby centre !

Considering the real estate scene will take a back seat for the next three years or so this might be a more productive use of your land

[speed kills]

If i'm not mistaken, Red Roosters Racing had plans of buying a large land parcel on the outskirts of BLR for a circuit. Hope the project becomes a reality.

[blueraven316]

Originally Posted by speed kills

If i'm not mistaken, Red Roosters Racing had plans of buying a large land parcel on the outskirts of BLR for a circuit. Hope the project becomes a reality.

Yep I have heard of this, some 300 acres it seems, also they are planning a Dyno within BLR limits.

[f450]

Originally Posted by DKG

Dragstrip, go kart track and a offroad track is a good way to start. A pay and play park where people come with their family for a weekend of fun. You can run a foodcourt and eventually a accessory shop with car wash etc. You could create a series of adventure activities too. Perhaps a hobby centre too, a large shed will do. Basically keep adding and fine tuning revenue streams. Hyderabad needs a hobby centre !

Considering the real estate scene will take a back seat for the next three years or so this might be a more productive use of your land

For both Dragstrip and Offroad track, I think there should be an option to use your own car or to be driven by an expert driver (for those who don't want to risk accidents/own cars). This is especially useful for Offroad (assuming it'll be marketed in a way similar to Dubai's desert safari).

And just a thought, instead of a dragstrip, wouldn't a proper track do better? F1 style?

[HPP]

Originally Posted by f450

Not to be a pessimist, but I have my doubts about this project if the investment is very high. The main reason is that the market is pretty limited. Not in terms of number, but in terms of segment. It's aimed only at 18-28 year olds (or maybe slightly more) and nobody else. It's not a family outing, so putting it on the outskirts will further dwindle the market. And last but not least, even car enthusiasts might fail to see the point of paying 500 rupees to do something that you can do on a KBR or an ORR.

I do have an alternative suggestion that might eliminate some of these disadvantages but I'd like to hear the counter-arguments for this first.

This is exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for. I know we are all car nuts, so we all want to see a project like this to happen, but I want objective feedback of the pros and cons. So this is the kind of thing that I'd like to hear more of. I am not completely sold the idea is viable(yet), but I want to keep the idea alive and develop it to a point that is a legitimate investment.

Originally Posted by jassi

well a small go kart track and restaurant (a must) could keep the family happy. I don't think driving on a public road can replace what one can do on the track. Track days are a big concept in aussie, uk, etc. and I am sure theres petrol heads at every age who would like to have some good time with their cars in india too Although my outlook maybe very positive, I am sure this will kick off over time, given the number of track days, I have seen being organised by the tbhpians itself!

Agreed, but having those features from the onset will raise the initial investment. But yes, to have those as a future part of the plan.. yes for sure. Restaurant may be easier to implement early on then a go kart track just based on initial and ongoing expenses relative to each.

Originally Posted by DKG

Dragstrip, go kart track and a offroad track is a good way to start. A pay and play park where people come with their family for a weekend of fun. You can run a foodcourt and eventually a accessory shop with car wash etc. You could create a series of adventure activities too. Perhaps a hobby centre too, a large shed will do. Basically keep adding and fine tuning revenue streams. Hyderabad needs a hobby centre !

Considering the real estate scene will take a back seat for the next three years or so this might be a more productive use of your land

This is exactly what I had in mind, I also have a few other features that could/would attract high end customers from across the country. It's not something I came up with, it's something that has become popular around the US over the last few years.

Originally Posted by speed kills

If i'm not mistaken, Red Roosters Racing had plans of buying a large land parcel on the outskirts of BLR for a circuit. Hope the project becomes a reality.

Originally Posted by blueraven316

Yep I have heard of this, some 300 acres it seems, also they are planning a Dyno within BLR limits.

That is something to consider as well. How many other tracks will be built and when. The market will mature over time, so to have too many will not work until the motorsports culture can support them all.

Originally Posted by f450

For both Dragstrip and Offroad track, I think there should be an option to use your own car or to be driven by an expert driver (for those who don't want to risk accidents/own cars). This is especially useful for Offroad (assuming it'll be marketed in a way similar to Dubai's desert safari).

And just a thought, instead of a dragstrip, wouldn't a proper track do better? F1 style?

A professional/expert driver should be a doable thing for events, but not a full time thing.

The reasoning for dragstrip first would be to keep initial costs down. A road course will be a much larger investment but would be the ultimate goal. There are various tracks around the US which have a track/road course which incorporates the 1/4 mile dragstrip into the road course itself. While others have them both(but separate) within the same "Motorsports park", there are advantages and disadvantages to both.

I didn't think this discussion would sprout into this good of a discussion, maybe we can have a mod separate our "track" posts from this thread in order to keep both on topic?

[f450]

Originally Posted by HPP

T
maybe we can have a mod separate our "track" posts from this thread in order to keep both on topic?

Seconded. I'm going to struggle to keep in my responses to ur post till that happens!

[ported_head]

New thread created. Kindly continue discussions here.

HPP, if you wish to change the title, let me know.

[f450]

Originally Posted by HPP

This is exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for. I know we are all car nuts, so we all want to see a project like this to happen, but I want objective feedback of the pros and cons. So this is the kind of thing that I'd like to hear more of. I am not completely sold the idea is viable(yet), but I want to keep the idea alive and develop it to a point that is a legitimate investment.

Also (again, not to be a pessimist) but I do hope you're planning to start this project after a couple of years and not now. What with the difficulty of getting a bank loan and people reluctant to spend large amounts on recreation and outings. In short, after recession.

Originally Posted by HPP

Agreed, but having those features from the onset will raise the initial investment. But yes, to have those as a future part of the plan.. yes for sure. Restaurant may be easier to implement early on then a go kart track just based on initial and ongoing expenses relative to each.

Restaurant/Eatery/Food court is an absolute must from the beginning. a) People expect to have something to eat especially that far from the city. b) Restaurants mint money

Go-kart track is a large investment. Go-karts + cement track +drivers etc. So it's a better idea to decide which one you want to do first, and gradually start the other with profits from the first.

Originally Posted by HPP

This is exactly what I had in mind, I also have a few other features that could/would attract high end customers from across the country. It's not something I came up with, it's something that has become popular around the US over the last few years.

From DKG's points, adventure activities (I assume he meant rock climbing etc.) and foodcourt are very viable, maybe even necessary. The rest, as he said, can be added gradually.

What are these other features? I have a feeling I might be thinking of the same thing

Originally Posted by HPP

That is something to consider as well. How many other tracks will be built and when. The market will mature over time, so to have too many will not work until the motorsports culture can support them all.

One per city is fairly reasonable. Tracks from different cities won't intrude into each other's markets as much. In fact, if you have a collaboration with them, you can even stage tournaments etc. together.

Originally Posted by HPP

The reasoning for dragstrip first would be to keep initial costs down. A road course will be a much larger investment but would be the ultimate goal. There are various tracks around the US which have a track/road course which incorporates the 1/4 mile dragstrip into the road course itself. While others have them both(but separate) within the same "Motorsports park", there are advantages and disadvantages to both.

Like I said, a dragstrip is not very sellable. Not to me atleast. Why would I pay you (suppose) Rs. 500 to race on a straight road with my friend when I can do the exact same thing in Jubilee Hills or Raj Bhavan road or Hitec City? Just for a timing?

Road course won't be as expensive as you think. Especially a regular (not cement) one. Incorporating dragstrip (as you said) is a much more viable option, don't you think?

Also, consider your main requirement. Cars. If my friends and I want to come to this place outside the city, more often than not, we'll come in one car. Then what? What do I race against? My friend is nervous about wrecking/spoiling his car. Then what?

Providing race cars will significantly increase investment but will also make it more marketable. The ultimate goal IMO would be to make this an F1/NASCAR type place which is open to general public.