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Old 13th December 2021, 10:12   #136
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

I have been following F1 very closely for more than 2 decades now and the biggest take away is that it's never over till it's over.

Mercedes blew this race and the drivers' title by being overtly cautious. Its as simple as that.

They have the car with that beast of a power unit, they got Lewis at the very top of his game and yet they played it a little too safe. It's as if they thought they were entitled for the double championship after that text book start and getaway from Lewis in the early laps.

And what a mega performance by Perez! It was a defense masterclass. And that forced reduction of the gap was instrumental in making Merc pit wall make that call to stay on the track on used rubber instead.

And what was Lewis complaining about Perez like he do about his tyres every so often?? After the utter domination all these years, both Toto and Lewis feels entitled if things aren't going their way. And that is what leaves a bad taste really.

In hindsight, Merc should have just given up track position and went for the attack themselves. They really have the car and driver to fight from behind and win. But then hindsight is 20/20. In the world of F1, circumstances are always stacked against leaders who got the most to lose.

Which brings us to Masi and he has been found severely wanting this season. And both teams have gained and lost from his calls. So, over the course of the season, it all averages out I guess. Though, I will be very surprised if he keeps his position or this level of control next season.

And congratulations, Max! It is well deserved! Enjoy the break after that titanic battle this season! I really hope its not just a two way fight next season and we have the old boys from Ferrari & McLaren too join these guys. At least Ferrari got no more excuses. Both Red Bull & Merc would have invested a lot more to this season than they would have wanted and that got to help the chasing pack.

This been a brilliant season after so many years and we fans are really fortunate to witness it first hand. And I really can't wait for the next one. Cheers!
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Old 13th December 2021, 10:15   #137
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

Good read on what went in to making the current World Champion, genetics+environment, nature and nurture:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/59555388

"Max Verstappen: Formula 1's 'bull fighter' & the family that shaped him"

"An F1 driver father and an accomplished kart racer for a mother. Max Verstappen - now 24 - was essentially born to be an F1 driver. Once that became clear, his father then effectively programmed him as one, too."

"School finished at 2:30pm. I was waiting in the van. He got in the van and I drove to Italy. We would spend two days at all the circuits he needed to drive on and then Sunday afternoon around 5pm I packed up and we drove back. That's about 1,250km (780 miles) each way. Then in the morning, I dropped him off at school again."

Last edited by am1m : 13th December 2021 at 10:20.
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Old 13th December 2021, 10:26   #138
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

Whatever happens to the 2021 results from here on, Mercedes need to a take a long, hard look at their strategy department for 2022 and beyond.

They've gotten away with conservative strategy calls when they had no sustained competition through a season, and often by the singular brilliance of their champion driver making up for it on track.

If Mercedes and Red Bull carry their form over, and a few teams develop enough to challenge for wins/podiums occasionally, Mercedes can no longer afford to play safe on race day.

Toto's 'cool heads' and 'I love hard but fair racing' mask slipped when he moaned about Checo yesterday. That's probably the cleanest wheel-to-wheel action we've seen in F1 in years, esp. considering the monumental stakes, and he labeled it 'dangerous' driving.
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Old 13th December 2021, 10:51   #139
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

Valtteri Bottas - the perfect wingman was missing in action yesterday at the front. Don't know if it would have made any difference in the end, but surely he could have helped Lewis somewhat, at least preventing Perez from getting close to Hamilton.

It's kind of strange - in the end, Mercedes win Constructor's championship, mainly thanks to Bottas scoring those extra points over Perez over the course of the season, but in the one race that mattered most, he ended up being a non-factor!
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Old 13th December 2021, 11:02   #140
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

To everyone saying there's no point in the CAS appeal and it's unsportsmanlike, I disagree and here's why.

I believe that Max deserves the WDC and he should not be stripped of it for no fault of his own. I also believe that the stewards have been doing an abysmal job, not just this race but throughout the season. This race, where they deliberately announced "lapped cars will NOT be allowed to overtake", breaking at least 6+ years of precedent, and then went back on it 2 laps later in a manner that broke their own, written rule stating that the SC enters the pits the lap AFTER the lapped cars are allowed to overtake. Their rebuttal is even more nonsensical, it amounts to - "but the 'Safety Car in this lap' message was displayed, and that means it has to enter this lap"...who made the call to display that message? Was it not Race Direction?

They could have :

1) Not announced the first decision because it made no sense given the track conditions or what was happening behind the SC, we don't know how they arrived at that decision but clearly they agree that it was the wrong one. Let lapped cars overtake on lap 56, SC enters on lap 57, maybe Lewis pits sometime after the first decision was announced and returns way behind, maybe he doesn't and loses the fight on track, but it's a fair way to do it considering the reason why the SC was deployed (Latifi's car crashed, was cleared by lap 55, marshals could have gotten out by the end of lap 56) and not considering the outcome of the SC on the title fight - which is what the FIA are supposed to do. Max would still have been WDC, no controversy, just bad luck for Mercedes.

2) Stuck to the decision to not allow lapped cars to overtake, because they're the Race Directors and what they say goes in accordance with the rulebook. (I mean, when was the last time they overturned a decision?). SC enters the pits at the end of lap 57, as is their prerogative. Hamilton has a chance of winning the WDC, Red Bull are fuming at this decision that breaks so much precedent, but it's far less controversial than what we got.

3) Ended the race under a safety car. No one wants to see this settle a world championship, but it's not controversial, happens quite often. Someone almost always wins with a safety car, and for that someone to win someone else has to lose.

All 3 of the above decisions would have made someone unhappy, but if there wasn't enough time to do options 1 or 2, there isn't enough time to end the safety car in my opinion. It is a SAFETY car, you'd expect them to stick to the regulations. Whether you agree with me so far, I definitely hope that we can agree that safety car decisions should NOT be rushed. And this comes at the end of a season full of comically poor decisions.

I watched a video recently of Hamilton and Massa's clashes in 2011, and in that every time one of them as much as touched the other's barge boards, they would get a 10 second penalty. This whole season is testament to that not being followed anymore. Silverstone should have been given a bigger penalty, although I'm not sure by how much. Spa 2008 - Hamilton overtook Kimi the corner after Hamilton gave back the position, and was hit with a drive-through penalty. The way Max was playing with giving back the position and later overtook Lewis after giving back the position the first time, it didn't look like they were too worried about that.

The Brazil overtaking incident wasn't investigated, so Max and Max fans would have felt wronged when he did the same thing in Jeddah and had to hand the place back. Championship leader Vettel accidentally drove into Lewis during the Safety Car in Baku 2017 at less than 80km/hr and got hit with a 10 second stop-and-go penalty, the most severe penalty there is. Max slowed from 295km/hr to 100km/hr, hit the brakes with 2.4G of deceleration (as enthusiasts on Team-BHP, we can understand what a big number that is), hard enough to lock up his rear wheels under full RACING conditions on the back straight of a street circuit (they don't slow down that much or that abruptly even under a safety car), and got away with a 10 second time penalty for that. Bottas not being investigated for driving too slowly under the safety car in Jeddah and slowing Max down by more than 8 seconds before the first pit stop. Turn 6 of lap 1 in Abu Dhabi. Spa 2021, a 'race' that that left fans freezing in the rain for 4 hours to see 3 laps of a safety car.

I'm sure there are more incidents where Max came off worse that I can't remember. My point is that the stewarding is all over the place, threatening to compromise the integrity of the sport, and now we get this where they can overrule their own rules saying "Well it's okay because I said so.", in a situation where none of this was necessary as they could have solved it in accordance with the rules, with precedent, in more than 2 other ways? Sainz in P3 had lapped cars in between him and P2. Ricciardo and Stroll were P12 and P13 with fresh softs. They could have done some damage, maybe finished in the points, but their competitors were handed a free lap under Michael "It's called motor racing" Masi.

The stewards shouldn't be out there to provide a show. They should be out there to enforce the rules, maintain the integrity of the sport and keep everyone safe. And Max fan or not, that's clearly changing now.

I hope Merc take the FIA to court and that there is an outcome that doesn't strip Max of the WDC that he deserves, but I strongly believe Masi has to be reprimanded in some way. You go to the FIA when you believe your competitors don't follow the rules - who do you go to when the FIA don't follow their own, written rules? I believe they have to fight this out in court to preserve the integrity of the sport. I would still believe that if it were Red Bull who'd come off worse today. And I'm honestly surprised that none of the other manufacturers are protesting.

Last edited by rkv_2401 : 13th December 2021 at 11:05.
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Old 13th December 2021, 11:12   #141
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

I feel it's ironical that even though F1 being a team sport, driver's championship is valued or celebrated much more than constructor's. Redbull had a stronger package overall this year and had a car that can be fast in any type of circuit so losing the constructor's is an underachievement in IMHO.

Definitely this was a thrilling season with lots of ups and downs and it is almost like a super power has decided that it has to go down the wire looking at the events that unfolded in this race. I feel sad for Lewis to lose out after his great efforts given the must win situation for the past few races. We can say both deserved to win, but in my opinion, Lewis in general raced cleanly and handled pressure well. We have seen Max in previous years how aggressive he can be and he had stuck to his driving attitude this year also and if we had a similar racer in Lewis's position, who knows, maybe someone would have won the championship with both crashing out often.

I can't wait for 2022 and hope that my favorite Ferrari can finally produce a fast machine and be in the mix for the wins.
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Old 13th December 2021, 11:21   #142
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

Given the inconsistencies by the FIA, it was half expected that an SC in the last few laps would through out some major controversy (Netflx is probably grinning ear to ear right now). Redbull had been gambling all week long, starting on softs (though this may have been a bit forced) and the changes under the VSC and SC. Sadly Mercedes preferred track position both the times even though Ham was questioning them regularly.
And the fiasco of the last lap was the real piece of drama that sums up what has been an incredible season. Toto crying on that last lap gave a bit of a sore loser type vibe but the appeal is well within their rights. Max was just banging the laps regularly and waiting for a miracle to happen. And it did, thanks to Mick's will to maintain daddy's record.
Hopefully the appeal won't strip Max of a well deserved title but reprimands the FIA.
Big shout to Checo for that god level defense. I noticed Max made up some 5 seconds because of it.
P.S. - Something that went under the radar was Kimi being DOTD. Lovely gesture from the fans although am sure Kimi doesn't care!!
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Old 13th December 2021, 11:30   #143
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkv_2401 View Post
I'm sure there are more incidents where Max came off worse that I can't remember. My point is that the stewarding is all over the place, threatening to compromise the integrity of the sport, and now we get this where they can overrule their own rules saying "Well it's okay because I said so.", in a situation where none of this was necessary as they could have solved it in accordance with the rules, with precedent, in more than 2 other ways? Sainz in P3 had lapped cars in between him and P2. Ricciardo and Stroll were P12 and P13 with fresh softs. They could have done some damage, maybe finished in the points, but their competitors were handed a free lap under Michael "It's called motor racing" Masi.

The stewards shouldn't be out there to provide a show. They should be out there to enforce the rules, maintain the integrity of the sport and keep everyone safe. And Max fan or not, that's clearly changing now.

I hope Merc take the FIA to court and that there is an outcome that doesn't strip Max of the WDC that he deserves, but I strongly believe Masi has to be reprimanded in some way. You go to the FIA when you believe your competitors don't follow the rules - who do you go to when the FIA don't follow their own, written rules? I believe they have to fight this out in court to preserve the integrity of the sport. I would still believe that if it were Red Bull who'd come off worse today. And I'm honestly surprised that none of the other manufacturers are protesting.
You summed up yesterday's fiasco and this season's FIA's inconsistencies very well ! It's shocking that there are so many weird inconsistent decisions from FIA which regulates this sport which is the most technical of all. I read somewhere that the stewards keep changing in between races as well Yesterday's decision was, I feel honesty, was just to increase the "drama and entertainment" in the f1 and nothing to do with actual racing spirit. I believe library media wants to attract younger audience, so they're doing this.
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Old 13th December 2021, 11:43   #144
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

What a season it has been. Both drivers have been brilliant, but you have to hand it to Max. The Mercedes was the faster car and only a Max Verstappen could have achieved this in that RedBull.

Yes, it was over the line a few times but common, no one becomes champion being the good boy ! I was not a fan of Max's antics in the past, but I think he has really matured now compared to his earlier days.

I agree with yesterday's decision apart from the call that cars would not unlap themselves to the sudden reversal. They should have been allowed to unlap themselves as per regular practice a lap or 2 earlier, however what finally happened was fair in the sense the back markets didn't come in the way of the actual racing !

Mercedes played it too safe. There was always the risk of a safety car and with Max pitting during the VSC, Mercedes should have pitted during the final SC. It was highly unlikely the race would finish under the safety car.

Other standouts for me have been the best buddies - Lando & Carlos, although Lando struggled in the second half of the season. Perez was brilliant in flashes, but still great for his first season in a team like Redbull. That defense yesterday was championship level stuff

I will always be a true Ferrari fan so fingers crossed they are back in the front in 2022 and we have a similar close contest with more players involved, but of course Carlos or Leclerc should win the title

PS: Can't wait for the 2021 season of 'Drive to Survive' !

Last edited by fiat_tarun : 13th December 2021 at 11:46.
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Old 13th December 2021, 11:59   #145
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

Quote:
Originally Posted by rkv_2401 View Post
To everyone saying there's no point in the CAS appeal and it's unsportsmanlike, I disagree and here's why.
Wonderful rkv_2401, what people who are against the CAS appeal need to understand is that it's not about Lewis winning the championship out of a court order. It's about the FIA and Race Directors who blatantly misused the rules and abuse of power. Mind you, this can repeat itself anytime in the coming years.

I have been watching F1 since 2007 when I was in 7th grade and to this date, I remember the set of procedures followed when there was a safety car out on track when I was still a kid!!

"Lapped cars may now overtake the safety car", "ALL" the cars which were lapped now overtakes the safety car, rejoins at the end of the pack and the racing resumes.

"Safety car in this lap", once all the lapped cars are back in order behind the grid, this may take half a lap or a full lap, the safety car is pulled into the pits after the 1st procedure has been followed.

Yesterday both of these procedures were followed within a couple of corners, which I am yet to come to terms with, I fully support and stand with Mercedes on their appeal.

PS I don't know what these articles are but "article 10 of the judicial and disciplinary rules" has a catch to it.

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Old 13th December 2021, 12:05   #146
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

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Originally Posted by fiat_tarun View Post
Mercedes should have pitted during the final SC.
That would have been a blunder, Redbull wouldn't have pitted and gained track position.

They however could have pitted under the Giovinazzi VSC, where there were 21 laps in play and Lewis had the pace to fightback.
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Old 13th December 2021, 12:15   #147
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

I have been following F1 since 2005. Been a Kimi fan always. Farewell Kimi, will miss you although I know you don’t care.
“One thing” that caused the drama yesterday and that “one thing” that has not always been fair to everyone in F1 is the SC rules.
All the lead built up by the lead car could not just be lost but also the track position could be lost. It is all down to just luck (the position of the car on track) at the time of the accident.
Take for example, yesterday Lewis would have lost track position on both VSC and SC scenarios if he had pit. On both occasions he had built a significant lead over Max. It was just down to the timing of the VSC / SC call from stewards and his position on the track.
This is a “problem” that F1 has always had and has always chosen not to solve for the pure entertainment value it brings. It is a lottery and Max won it yesterday.

These controversies have brought new audience in the past and very well bring the nextGen into the sport this time around.

PS1: In the past, F1 had tried nullifying any car gaining advantage during SC period but then the show was called a circus.

PS2: F1 is not a sport but an entertainment show, that’s what GOI has deemed few years back. 🤪
And that is why we don’t have an Indian GP anymore 😒
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Old 13th December 2021, 12:15   #148
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

Let's get a few things out of the way:

1. Hamilton was the better and faster driver this race.
2. Verstappen was nowhere even on fresh tyres.
3. Hamilton was undone by poor strategy courtesy Mercedes playing safe.
4. Verstappen was extremely lucky to win this race. (for a change).
5. Checo's masterclass made all the difference - for those calling it dangerous are nothing but fanboys, as there was no contact and the racing was all within the outer white lines. Clean as you like. People calling it dangerous need to evaluate themselves as fans of the sport.
6. Michael Massi pulling in the safety car at the end of the penultimate lap and allowing only select drivers (between Ham and Ver) to un-lap themselves was very unfair.

That being said, Hamilton was extremely unlucky. It was his race right from the start. But it has balanced out because Hamilton enjoyed unprecedented luck throughout the year. Hamilton will rue his major mistakes in Baku and Hungary.

This was Hamilton's race to lose, and he lost it not because of poor decisions by the Stewards and the Race Director. He lost it because Mercedes played safe and were too cautious. He was the faster driver and the better driver on Sunday, no question about it.

I hope some of the objective Lewis fans realize that if Mercedes had strategized correctly, the need to approach the Stewards/Race Director/CAS would not have arisen.

Lewis has taken this on the chin, because he is a gentleman of the sport. But Mercedes is doing what Red Bull is famous for, and that is whining and crying about the result. Take it on the chin and move on, Mercedes.

Inconsistent Stewarding and calls by the Race Director throughout the year need to be looked into. Mercedes is doing the right thing by Appealing the dismissed protests lodged by them.

Next year, I will support Hamilton for his 8th WDC. He deserves it for his come back this year, and I am sure he will get it with Russel backing him provided Mercedes does some soul-searching.

In the end, this was one of the greatest seasons of F1 racing in the modern era. It will go down in history as one of the best ever, at least since 2012.

Honda is bowing out of the sport on a high, and finally we have a non-Mercedes driver who has won the coveted World Title in the turbo-hybrid era. Good times for Formula 1.

Last edited by suhaas307 : 13th December 2021 at 13:19. Reason: typo
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Old 13th December 2021, 12:23   #149
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

What a title decider. A total cliff-hanger. Congratulations to MAX a worthy champion.

My 2 cents:
1. Mercedes blew the race on faulty strategy calls. They should have pitted Lewis under VSC and with the superior pace of his car Lewis would have held back Max.
2. Loved the reply from Michael Masi to Toto. Mercedes boss Wolff complained over the radio: “No, no Michael - that was so not right, You need to reinstate the lap before, that’s not right.”
Masi bluntly told him in response: “Toto, it’s called a motor race. We went car racing.”
3. Parez did a phenominal job of cutting the gap between Lewis and Max from 6+ seconds to 1+ second, which forced the hand of Mercedes on the strategy.

Finally a conspiricy theory.

Why was Parez asked to retire the car at the very end..?? Was it that RedBull would have won both Drivers and Constructors Championship if Max and Parez were on the podium and Bottas down in 6-7...??
Was there a final deal stuck..? Mercedes takes Constructors Championship and RedBull the Drivers..??
Did Liberty Media Corporation play the Deal Maker..??

Last edited by amitku : 13th December 2021 at 12:25.
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Old 13th December 2021, 12:24   #150
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Re: Formula 1 | Abu Dhabi Grand Prix 2021 | Yas Marina Circuit | 10 - 12 December, 2021 - The Finale

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Originally Posted by narayans80 View Post
That would have been a blunder, Redbull wouldn't have pitted and gained track position.

They however could have pitted under the Giovinazzi VSC, where there were 21 laps in play and Lewis had the pace to fightback.
True, but with Lewis' pace, I think they were still very confident to not give up the lead by pitting during the VSC. Once the full SC came later if Lewis had pitted, Max would have stayed out and would have been the sitting duck once the race restarted with the Mercedes pace + the fresh tyres.

Of course in hindsight vision is 20/20, but by staying out they left too much hope in finishing the race behind the safety car.
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