[Bubby]

I get FE of 19kmpl with AC on 100%.
I get FE of 21kmpl without AC.

From day one I have been using Premium Diesel.

Black smoke, is this really true that usage of premium fuels will result in black smoke or vice versa.

I always thought that its sudden acceleration that produces black smoke.

I see all cabs releasing black smoke and I am pretty sure that they dont use premium fuels.

[vikasb]

Originally Posted by Bubby

I always thought that its sudden acceleration that produces black smoke.

I experienced the same when i was using premium fuel.
Now even if i do sudden acceleration, there is no smoke.

Not sure about the normal cabs though. They are not multijets

[Bubby]

Originally Posted by vikasb

I experienced the same when i was using premium fuel.
Now even if i do sudden acceleration, there is no smoke.

Not sure about the normal cabs though. They are not multijets

Hmmm, that is something to think.

I always feel that premium fuels are called premium for some reason, which means that they are better then normal.

But if its better then why black smoke???

[tortoiseNhare]

Originally Posted by amarprusty

Hi MJD gang,

What FE are you guys getting out of your beauties

Anyone found any improvement with premium diesel like Shell or Turbojet Diesel

Any response will be appreciated

My Palio is used for daily commuting and weekend trips. It's about 12 km to drop my wife at her school and then back to my office. The traffic on the road is not like typical b2b city traffic and I can do an average of 45-50 kmph. I am on b2b city traffic may be on 5% of total travel. I fill normal HP diesel of Rs. 1000 from a reputed pump in the city as soon as the low fuel indicator appears and reset the trip meter. The mileage hovers around 650 km (diesel costs 31.45 per litre here and I use the AC sparingly) which translates to about 20.5 kmpl.

[amarprusty]

Hi MJD owners

We can safely conclude the FE range with normal diesel is

Worst - 14 KMPL
Best - 21 KMPL

Premium diesel is non essential as per the responses,good savings per litre

[subbarao]

Originally Posted by architect

I
So now, the final question: would I have been happier with another car? Besides the Swift and before the Vista, this was the most competent and VFM diesel hatch. After so many kilometres, I can say that what I lose is the sharp handling characteristic of the Swift, but what I gain is better ride quality. What I lose is the Maruti peace-of-mind, but what I gain is a respectable back seat and boot. What I lose is better NVH, but what I gain is a little more driveability. What I lose is the smaller turning radius, but what I get is much better visibility.

Isn’t life all about choices?

Dear Architect.

As i have swift Vxi from Jan07, it was decided here in the forum[http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/hatchbacks/20152-santro-booking-cancelled-what-next-4.html] after running of 27k km's till date i don't have any compliaints & happy to live with.
In aug.08 i have transferred to new office & my daily travelling increased by 30km's, by then i am thinking to go for diesel, i test drived MJD, Vista quadrajet, off couse the DDiS, after this fiat made me to wait till y'day to have TD of GPunto, since morning i am searching for the review's on said hatchback's with straight from the heart.. i got your thread, it is unbiased & i like very much of your last paragraph. it gives much better idea of what we get for our hard earned money.
Thank you for your clean review.

[architect]

Originally Posted by subbarao

Thank you for your clean review.

Thank You, Subbarao. I am inclined to believe that one should write honest reviews. Frankly speaking, it is quite easy to decipher a dishonest review or a biased viewpoint quite easily.

On a side note, I would like to add that in your position, I would do a lot of serious mathematical calculations before trading in my Swift VXi for a diesel hatch. Even though your running has increased drastically, extra 30 kms of daily running means about Rs 4000 worth of petrol every month. I am sure any of the diesel hatches in your list don't cost less than Rs 5 lakhs. Assuming a resale (just assuming a very desirable resale value ) of Rs 3.5 lakh for your Swift VXi, you would still invest Rs 1.5 - 2 lakh for the new car. You can run your Swift VXi for another 3 years on petrol for that money.

If you want a new car for other reasons, please go right ahead.

[PankajP]

Nice review architect.

I have completed 15k kms on Palio Stile 1.6 now.

The only gripe I have is about the Clutch which seems bit HARD. What do you think about it? Is it the same on MJD?

[great_guns]

To answer the question posed here about Palio MJD FE, I would like to present my figures.

Average mileage with 0% A/C - 21 KMPL
Average mileage with 100% A/C - 17 KMPL

Lowest mileage calculated - 16 KMPL
Highest mileage calculated - 22 KMPL

These are all city driving figures. This includes a mixture of high speed patches and absoulte dump yards with riding on clutch and first gear bumming for a few kilometres.

I strictly use normal diesel from company operated petrol pump opposite RTO in Pune or from the petrol pump opposite Dai-Ichi in Kasarwadi.

[architect]

It's been a good 25,000 km so far, but here are some issues:

1. At around 8000-9000 km I drove into an open manhole hidden under a foot of flooding. Took it for wheel alignment and balancing the next day. Fiat cars don't have adjustable camber so ASC don't bother to check for it either during wheel alignment. Wheels were aligned and balanced and the car did another 5000 km or so when I noticed uneven tyre wear on the inner side of the left front wheel at the next service. Again the same routine, balancing, alignment and more waiting.

While buying new tyres at 21000 km (because I got a good buyback offer, I upgraded to Yokohama 185s), I checked for camber and the LF wheels was out by more than a degree (I think half a degree is acceptable limits). The person at Star Wheels Gurgaon offered to fix it by creating some play in upper one of the two bolts (working on it on a lathe to reduce the dia) on to which the axles are fixed. Apparently, he had fixed the problems on dozens of Palios that way.

I refused to get that done, it didn't sound very confidence-inspiring, more like a jugaad.

Back at Rama Motors, the Palio specialist mechanic has the same story. No solution except change the part or get the bolt reduced in dia at a lathe. I have now driven for 5000 km with the new Yokos and the uneven tyre wear is hardly noticeable yet. I am willing to have uneven tyre wear on one tyre at this rate rather than go for jugaad of any kind, especially because I am not convinced.

2. Of late, the brake fluid warning goes on whenever I accelerate hard, even though the fluid is well above minimum mark. From what I could figure, it was the sensor not reading it right because the front of the car tends to lift up on hard accelaration. I assumed this because this also happenned while climbing a very steep slope. I haven't noticed any issues with the brake or the clutch and the fluid level has been constant since ages. Maybe bleeding the brake / clutch is due, or its time to change the fluid entirely.

Finally fixed up an appointment with the other ASC (Samyak / Elegant) for getting the camber issue and the brake fluid warning issue checked for tomorrow. In the evening, I tried driving the car in different conditions to isolate any other problem, if present. I was trying to recreate the brake warning problem by accelerating hard and I got a shock.......

3. All the electricals of the car suddenly died with the engine just over 3000 RPM. Lights, stereo, tachometer, everything. Power steering switched off as well and the steering was as hard as a rock. Pulled over to the side as the engine was still running because the car didn't stall or sputter. Didn't try to idle and switched off immediately.

Waited for 5-10 seconds, and cranked up. It started up as if nothing had happenned. Strange, or rather, what a relief!

Called up a friend who is on his fourth Fiat (3rd diesel) and narrated the whole story. He suggested its the battery! I mentioned the Alternator voltage was well above 12V (I vaguely remember it should be 14V at idling off the alternator terminals) during the last service.

Then I remembered that the OEM battery under the hood was Exide. An Exide battery has a 12 month warranty and two of the Exide batteries on my bike lasted for 20 months and 16 months respectively! Coupled with the much higher starting current on a CRDi engine, maybe the Exide has exhibited its family trait once again.

My car has done 6000 km out of 25,000 on the highways. Now I need to get this problem fixed ASAP. I can live with a "disco light" (copyright Tanveer) for a brake fluid warning or even an uneven tyre wear, but not this. Fingers crossed, let's see what tomorrow brings at Elegant cars.
Does anyone have any ideas (before diagnosis at Elegant tomorrow, that is!)

P.S. Although it will cost me a packet, I still hope that for once, it is Exide and nothing more serious.

[architect]

Spent the better part of the day at Elegant Cars.

There is nothing better than sleeping over a problem. I reconstructed the shutting off problem mentally and realised that engine had cut off, because I distinctly remember the battery symbol on my dashboard still on. So the engine AND electricals had cut off. Secondly, it couldn't be the battery as my car was starting at one crank, faithfully, every time. So I ruled out the battery.

Checked the battery and cleaned and reconnected the terminals at Elegant Cars. Ran the scanner and there were no ECU errors. Voltage for the electrical system was at 14.3 V and when I switched on all the lights, AC, stereo (basically almost everything electrical) it dropped down to 13.5V or so. So alternator and battery seemed to be in good health. I even cleaned the air filter (which was rather dirty). The entire diagnosis just drew a blank. What can make an engine and electricals shut off at 3000 RPM?

Regarding the other issues, the disc brake pads had to be changed. On changing, the fluid level in the container went up. A further top-up and the problem disappeared. The wheel alignment was re-checked and by correcting the toe, even the camber reduced from 1 deg 14 min to 0 deg 52 min. Since the acceptable limit is about 0 degree 40 min , I decided to live with it. I also noticed that there wasn't any noticeable uneven wear on the left front tyre after about 4000 km of running.

I have driven the car for 200 km (Delhi-Dharuhera-Delhi) after getting out of Elegant Cars. The "disco light" brake fluid indicator didn't go up even at 3500 RPM under hard accelaration.

Now, the only possibilities are that what happenned yesterday was a freak incident, or that I need to wait till the problem re-surfaces.

[bottle]

Could be a slow leak in the brake lines somewhere. That happened to my car but the problem was more severe. Keep an eye out for that warning light again

[amarprusty]

Black smoke in 2nd & 3rd Gear,using normal diesel,also wheel alignment needs to be done as it pulls to right on a straight road,only run 7.5K since May 2008,due for 3rd service now

[architect]

Originally Posted by amarprusty

Black smoke in 2nd & 3rd Gear,using normal diesel,also wheel alignment needs to be done as it pulls to right on a straight road,only run 7.5K since May 2008,due for 3rd service now

Change your petrol pump, black smoke from normal diesel is not normal.

[tortoiseNhare]

Architect,

As the rainy season started here I noticed that droplets of water (I think condensed water vapour) gets deposited on the inside of the right headlamp glass. Is it any serious problem? No such issues on the other headlamp though.

Meanwhile a problem reported by one of our fellow BHPians was replicated a couple of times in my car - I go to more than 80 kmph on 4th and then engage 5th the engine momentarily stalls (as if not receiving fuel); I release throttle to come down to about 60 and then the car picks up normally (still in 5th). Each instance was the first attempt to get to a decent speed after an entire week of driving at 60 kmph or less. In my recent trip to Upper Assam (a total of more than 1600km) this issue never surfaced. But I have also been upshifting to 5th at 60kmph (the manual recommends upshift to 5th as early as at 50kmph).

Thanks.