[pixantz]

Originally Posted by iss1307

I think it'll be the year of 2019.
How does it make any sense to go for Figo Aspire when you want a petrol?

Your observations are right iss, but given that the diesel Figo is smooth as hell too, I don't think going for the diesel should be a real pain here. Except cheaper fuel option, maybe

[iss1307]

Originally Posted by pixantz

Your observations are right iss, but given that the diesel Figo is smooth as hell too, I don't think going for the diesel should be a real pain here. Except cheaper fuel option, maybe

The difference is that the Aspire is an entry level Sedan and the City is a premium sedan. And yes the diesel is a cheaper fuel option but given the rising pollution, sticking to the petrol is better. :P
Plus there's nothing under 10L that can beat the 1.5 i-Vtec. Low end fuel efficiency and top end performance. Everybody's happy. The only competition being the TSI from Volkswagen, but the lack of manual and only a 1.2 is kind of a bug.

[avdhesh15]

Couldn’t post earlier as was caught up in year-end activities!

Originally Posted by iss1307

Yes , have gone through the entire thread of the niggles. But these rattles and all are there if you pay some serious attention to details right? And as enthusiasts we all do that. Am I right when I say that the niggles can be looked over as trade-offs?

I wouldn’t say that the niggles can be overlooked. If you are going to self-drive the car, these niggles will be quite prominent but if you will be in the back seat, then perhaps.

Originally Posted by iss1307

We want a car which would be with us for 7 long years and our current car the WagonR sits at 42000 after 6 years. So our commute is pretty low.
Which premium car would you suggest under 10 lakhs?
We saw the Verna, was pretty good but 2016 will see a new generation but in the later half. We haven't visited VW yet, will visit soon. Fiat was never in the list. Ciaz, is fine, parents not so happy with the looks.

Originally Posted by iss1307

Our budget is of 10 lakhs.
Which cars do you guys suggest?
I have the Ecosport Ecoboost in the list. But it is available only in Titanium+ which 11,32,000 OTR and a Trend+ which is like a base variant which I don't like.

I agree no petrol sedan south of 10L apart from Ciaz, but since you are ready to contemplate cars from other segments, how about S-Cross? Massive discounts going on currently on the car and it’s damn solid. You have mentioned EcoSport yourself so could check it out. If you have patience, why don’t you hang on for the Maruti YBA or the BRV to be launched (although I have no idea about the prices, should be close to your budget)?

Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain

I don't think so. The promise of the City was that it was a fill it-shut it-forget it kind of car that you just could not go wrong with. This was also why the car had such good resale value. That is no longer the case now. The competition has improved while the City has deteriorated. At current prices, I see no reason to pick the petrol City over the Vento TSi apart from sheer cabin space.

While I don’t know about the VW, I totally agree on other points. The new City just isn’t the same.

Originally Posted by Rajeevraj

No car is niggle free, but the kind of niggles and the frequency I have been reading on this thread, seems a bit too much for a upward of 10L car- that too a Honda.

Bang on! I drove a SX4 which seemed to have lesser niggles when I sold it after 4 years vis-à-vis my new City which is less than 2 years old.

Originally Posted by Turbohead

4th Gen City is a huge leap in most depts except downright reliability and quality. As you know there is a thread dedicated to this. Honda should and I hope is working on these problems.

As a new City owner, I agree on the quality part. Reliability seems to be fine as I haven't faced any major issues till now.

Originally Posted by GKMahajan

My 2 cents - This is the first time I have heard someone generalize City as unreliable. I had a City (2006 ZX VTEC) for 9 years and sold it to get an automatic Jazz. I could have kept it for 6 more years - it was so niggle free.

Two close cousins still have their 7-year old ZX and 3-year old 3rd gens and they still feel solid. The grievances are with the 4th gen City.

Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain

My fundamental grouse with the car is that it has aged very quickly. From dull and scratched paint to noises and rattles all over to a rough sounding engine (mine is diesel) with a clunky gearshift to soft and sagging seats to things like brakes and suspension taking a beating. It does not feel like a car that has 40k km on the clock, but like one which has done twice or thrice that mileage.

To give credit where it is due, the City is very easy to drive in traffic. The car shrinks around you. Steering is very light, the turning circle is really tight and agility is good. The car is always willing to change directions quickly at your command. You never feel the size of the thing. And it isn't that big anyway.

Don't for the moment think the car will leave you stranded at night in the middle of the road It is NOT unreliable. But at the same time, it has to be said that be car seems to have been designed and built against serious cost targets. As such, this generation of the car with just have to live with its basic issues. I will not get my hopes up about quality levels magically improving in the new year or even with the eventual facelift.

Bro – you seem to be in exact the same boat as me! I agree with all your points with the difference that mine is petrol so the engine point doesn’t count in my agreement. The petrol is brilliant to drive.
I also agree that the car isn’t unreliable. But it’s not one where I am happy putting my 11L.

Originally Posted by iss1307

But lemme answer your question about replacing the H with the T. I think I would still buy it. It's not the brand that attracts me, it's the flair the car has.

Hmm - really? Somewhere it does come down to brand value.

Originally Posted by mayank0782

"You have been eyeing it for a while now, secretly, when no one's looking. At traffic lights, parking lots, sometimes right outside your house. You have been quietly nursing a desire, that someday you will hold it, grab it, look into its eyes and say you are mine. Today is that someday"

Classic happy 3rd gen vs. 4th gen

Originally Posted by tejas08

Again, its each individual's perception and choice. Those who want quality can shift to Germans & other Stuff. Those who want reliability can have the Japs & Koreans.

I kind of disagree – I have a ZX, 3rd gen and 4th gen City in my immediate family. The previous 2 were brilliant compared to the 4th gen in terms of quality. I would gladly exchange the toys in the 4th gen for the solidness of the 3rd gen – it was quality along with reliability.

Originally Posted by tejas08

It will be almost two years since the launch of the 4th Gen City. There has been no complaint with regards to the City dropping dead in the middle of nowhere, even after some people have clocked over 40K & 50K kms.

Agree – the point is not on reliability.

Originally Posted by tejas08

A correction. It's 10K kms / 6 Months.

Yes – my bad. However, if you check the “how often you change the engine oil thread”, you will see that 10k km / 12 months is the ideal scenario. Honda is ripping off customers with the 10k km / 6 months routine and this is a point on which our Mods have agreed.

Originally Posted by tejas08

As such it is good to get the Engine Oil changed between 7-8K Kms.

I will. But give me time till 12 months because I have less running. In 6 months I will run max 3-4k km so an engine oil change isn’t justified but I have to get it done due to warranty issues!

[iss1307]

Originally Posted by avdhesh15

Couldn’t post earlier as was caught up in year-end activities!


I wouldn’t say that the niggles can be overlooked. If you are going to self-drive the car, these niggles will be quite prominent but if you will be in the back seat, then perhaps.



I agree no petrol sedan south of 10L apart from Ciaz, but since you are ready to contemplate cars from other segments, how about S-Cross? Massive discounts going on currently on the car and it’s damn solid. You have mentioned EcoSport yourself so could check it out. If you have patience, why don’t you hang on for the Maruti YBA or the BRV to be launched (although I have no idea about the prices, should be close to your budget)?


While I don’t know about the VW, I totally agree on other points. The new City just isn’t the same.


Bang on! I drove a SX4 which seemed to have lesser niggles when I sold it after 4 years vis-à-vis my new City which is less than 2 years old.


As a new City owner, I agree on the quality part. Reliability seems to be fine as I haven't faced any major issues till now.


Two close cousins still have their 7-year old ZX and 3-year old 3rd gens and they still feel solid. The grievances are with the 4th gen City.


Bro – you seem to be in exact the same boat as me! I agree with all your points with the difference that mine is petrol so the engine point doesn’t count in my agreement. The petrol is brilliant to drive.
I also agree that the car isn’t unreliable. But it’s not one where I am happy putting my 11L.


Hmm - really? Somewhere it does come down to brand value.


Classic happy 3rd gen vs. 4th gen


I kind of disagree – I have a ZX, 3rd gen and 4th gen City in my immediate family. The previous 2 were brilliant compared to the 4th gen in terms of quality. I would gladly exchange the toys in the 4th gen for the solidness of the 3rd gen – it was quality along with reliability.


Agree – the point is not on reliability.


Yes – my bad. However, if you check the “how often you change the engine oil thread”, you will see that 10k km / 12 months is the ideal scenario. Honda is ripping off customers with the 10k km / 6 months routine and this is a point on which our Mods have agreed.


I will. But give me time till 12 months because I have less running. In 6 months I will run max 3-4k km so an engine oil change isn’t justified but I have to get it done due to warranty issues!

Unfortunately the S-Cross does not have a petrol option. :(
Yes, we'll be buying it till March so we have plenty of time to wait for the YBA as well as the new Volkswagen compact sedan. BR-V will be priced alongside Creta so that's out of our budget.
Plus I am attending the Auto-Expo so I can easily check out if there are any other options under 10L.
And why we don't like the Ciaz is because we don't want a Maruti this time since we have owned only Maruti's till days. After the 800 came the WagonR, and we aren't satisfied with the WagonR at all.
We are planning on the SV model of the City. Which will cost us 9.84L.
And what is everybody complaining about sagging seats? :O they seemed extremely comfortable.

[GKMahajan]

Originally Posted by avdhesh15

Couldn’t post earlier as was caught up in year-end activities!

....

....

I will. But give me time till 12 months because I have less running. In 6 months I will run max 3-4k km so an engine oil change isn’t justified but I have to get it done due to warranty issues!

Dear avdhesh15,

Your delayed response is very good. So, I think your apology is redundant.

I agree with you almost totally.

I have no experience of the 4th gen City. However, if the feel that I am getting from my new Jazz is any indicator, I would expect it to be good too.

It seems you have first hand experience of the 4th gen City. I got a feeling that you are not 'totally satisfied' with it. Interesting!

I do about 12,000~13,000 kms per year. I guess I will have to stick to the 6 month schedule of maintenance for 4 years at least. The oil changes may be earlier than desired, but ... we are not to ask why - we are but to do or die!

Girish Mahajan

[aviator1101]

Dear all, wishing all of you a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year ahead.
Now to the point. In my previous post, I had mentioned the main gear box seal of my 2014 Honda City Petrol giving way and Deep Honda Bathinda placing order for the same as it was not readily available. Day before I called up the service section and the service advisor confirmed arrival of the part. Today I went for the replacement which was covered under warranty thankfully. But was surprised to see a bill being furnished before delivery for some adhesive tube used to replace the seal. It was a matter of only Rs 378/- but sounded quite illogical to me as the seal replacement is covered under warranty and the sealant not. I discussed the issue with the AGM services who waived it off saying that though the sealant was not covered by Hoñda as part of warranty, me being a regular customer, they are waiving it off. Also during the seal change, when the car was hoisted up on the lift, the SA told me that the exhaust pipe needs to be coated as it had started catching rust. Now I have two questions open for anybody who is aware to answer :-
1. Is it possible that the material required to replace a component under warranty not itself covered under warranty or is it a prevalent practice by service centres to fleece ignorant customers? I have no grudges service wise with Deep Honda. They are very cordial and prompt.
2. When I bought the car a year back, I went in for the anti rust treatment. Isn't the exhaust pipe supposed to be part of the same package? And is it common for the exhaust pipe of a 14 month car with only 7600 on the odo to start rusting near the can. Or is it just a superficial rust?

[Shreyans_Jain]

Originally Posted by iss1307

And what is everybody complaining about sagging seats? :O they seemed extremely comfortable.

They are very comfortable to begin with. But because the seat compound is so soft, it tends to sag and get compressed over time. All the more so if you are on the heavier side. After a couple of years of use, my car's driver-seat's foam has sunk a fair bit and the seat is not as supportive as it was when the car was new. Passenger seat is still good though.

I'll put this in another way. I did a few Delhi-Mumbai runs in the first year of the car. I had no issues despite spending 18-20 hours continuously behind the wheel. Nowadays, my lower back starts to hurt after just a few hours spent in regular Delhi traffic.

Originally Posted by GKMahajan

I have no experience of the 4th gen City. However, if the feel that I am getting from my new Jazz is any indicator, I would expect it to be good too.

It seems you have first hand experience of the 4th gen City. I got a feeling that you are not 'totally satisfied' with it. Interesting!

Being the owner of a Gen4 City as well as a Gen1 Jazz, let me tell you that as an overall product, the old Jazz/City were head and shoulders superior to the current City.

The new Jazz and the current City as basically the same car so what holds true for the City will be valid for the Jazz as well.

As for the 'feel' you are getting from your Jazz, well, it is only a matter of time before it becomes.... mixed. My City felt more than fantastic during its first 15-18 months. But that didn't last. It was only after 30,000km that all kinds of shenanigans started. Jazz though, it is still going strong after 4 years/75k km of abuse. This is the difference between the current product and the previous product.

For your sake, I sincerely hope that your long term ownership experience turns out to be better than mine.

[GKMahajan]

Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain

They are very comfortable to begin with. But because the seat compound is so soft, it tends to sag and get compressed over time. All the more so if you are on the heavier side. After a couple of years of use, my car's driver-seat's foam has sunk a fair bit and the seat is not as supportive as it was when the car was new. Passenger seat is still good though.

I'll put this in another way. I did a few Delhi-Mumbai runs in the first year of the car. I had no issues despite spending 18-20 hours continuously behind the wheel. Nowadays, my lower back starts to hurt after just a few hours spent in regular Delhi traffic.




Being the owner of a Gen4 City as well as a Gen1 Jazz, let me tell you that as an overall product, the old Jazz/City were head and shoulders superior to the current City.

The new Jazz and the current City as basically the same car so what holds true for the City will be valid for the Jazz as well.

As for the 'feel' you are getting from your Jazz, well, it is only a matter of time before it becomes.... mixed. My City felt more than fantastic during its first 15-18 months. But that didn't last. It was only after 30,000km that all kinds of shenanigans started. Jazz though, it is still going strong after 4 years/75k km of abuse. This is the difference between the current product and the previous product.

For your sake, I sincerely hope that your long term ownership experience turns out to be better than mine.

Dear Sheryans Jain,

Baap re.. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

I am an engineer. One small rule I picked up from the shopfloor is that if there is any sound, then it means wear and tear, which in turn means part failure in the future! Presently the Jazz is super silent. I plan to take all efforts to keep it that way. Let us see.

However, I am going to stay alert to your warning. Thanks.

Girish Mahajan

[chandrda]

There was a PGM FI error on my colleagues 6 months old I-DTEC car yesterday evening while leaving home from office. We immediately called the service center and they sent a recovery vehicle. The car was lifted and taken to the service center for diagnosis.

I was very surprised and disappointed to see this error on a new car. Is this error related to Honda recalling City and Mobilio for replacement of fuel return pipes.

Regards

[ashwinee]

Purchased new Honda City VX CVT on December 13th at Trident Auto Honda, Bnagalore. Sold my City ZX CVT on 5th of December and booked the new City on 6th of December. Alabaster Silver was readily available (I was in cosntant touch with Trident, Magnum and Dakshin Honda), October manufactured and shipped in November. Trident being new as a Honda dealer in Bangalore, all the process was a smooth affair and for all the loan/RTO documents, they did visit my house. The car was ready by 12th December, but took the delivery on 13th December. (Auspicious day )
Note: Trident have a VX CVT TD vehicle and did the TD with wife before booking



Initial Impression:
Being a Honda owner, I am biased. From the 2nd generation to 4th, there is a lot of improvement in equipment levels. Being a six feet person felt really comfortable in the new City. The old car was run 1.25 Lakh over 9.5 years and could feel the silence of VTEC engine in the new car.

I drive daily to office (From Banashankari area to Manyata Tech park) and its 50KMs round trip. Initial fuel economy was 10.5 KM on an average. (Peak of 13 and low of 7-8)

Will update with the long drive soon...

[Rahul Bhalgat]

Originally Posted by chandrda

There was a PGM FI error on my colleagues 6 months old I-DTEC car yesterday evening while leaving home from office. We immediately called the service center and they sent a recovery vehicle. The car was lifted and taken to the service center for diagnosis.

I was very surprised and disappointed to see this error on a new car. Is this error related to Honda recalling City and Mobilio for replacement of fuel return pipes.

Regards

Hi chandrda,
I have heard that this error is Programmed Fuel Injection error. Mostly, it needs replacement of the Mass Airflow sensor (MAF) or a glow plug.

Since the car is just 6 months old, these will be covered under warrantee.

It is indeed disappointing to see this in a new car. Let us hope that it does not repeat in future.H

[iss1307]

Originally Posted by ashwinee

Purchased new Honda City VX CVT on December 13th at Trident Auto Honda, Bnagalore. Sold my City ZX CVT on 5th of December and booked the new City on 6th of December. Alabaster Silver was readily available (I was in cosntant touch with Trident, Magnum and Dakshin Honda), October manufactured and shipped in November. Trident being new as a Honda dealer in Bangalore, all the process was a smooth affair and for all the loan/RTO documents, they did visit my house. The car was ready by 12th December, but took the delivery on 13th December. (Auspicious day )
Note: Trident have a VX CVT TD vehicle and did the TD with wife before booking


Will update with the long drive soon...

Congratulations Ashwinee.
Do keep updating us all.

[ashwinee]

Originally Posted by ashwinee

Purchased new Honda City VX CVT on December 13th at Trident Auto Honda, Bnagalore. Sold my City ZX CVT on 5th of December and booked the new City on 6th of December. Alabaster Silver was readily available (I was in cosntant touch with Trident, Magnum and Dakshin Honda), October manufactured and shipped in November. Trident being new as a Honda dealer in Bangalore, all the process was a smooth affair and for all the loan/RTO documents, they did visit my house. The car was ready by 12th December, but took the delivery on 13th December. (Auspicious day )
Note: Trident have a VX CVT TD vehicle and did the TD with wife before booking



Initial Impression:
Being a Honda owner, I am biased. From the 2nd generation to 4th, there is a lot of improvement in equipment levels. Being a six feet person felt really comfortable in the new City. The old car was run 1.25 Lakh over 9.5 years and could feel the silence of VTEC engine in the new car.

I drive daily to office (From Banashankari area to Manyata Tech park) and its 50KMs round trip. Initial fuel economy was 10.5 KM on an average. (Peak of 13 and low of 7-8)

Will update with the long drive soon...

Longer Drive

Bangalore to Davangere and back. This highway is one of the nice stretches. The traffic was more than usual because of the Christmas weekend, but not too much. Started from Bangalore at 3:30 PM on 24th December to avoid the rat race on 25th morning and peak hour. Started back on 27th evening and there were pile-ups after Tumkur. (Each way is 270 KMs)

As the car was driven only for 450 KMs, we stick to max of 80-90 KM/hr and rpm of no more than 2,000.

MID displayed fuel efficiency:
Bangalore -> Davangere : 21.3 KMPL (Even I am astonished)
Davangere -> Bangalore : 18.5 KMPL (in spite of being part of few pileups)

Have captured the Display for the onward journey



Service and after service mileage after few more runs

[iss1307]

Originally Posted by ashwinee

MID displayed fuel efficiency:
Bangalore -> Davangere : 21.3 KMPL (Even I am astonished)
Davangere -> Bangalore : 18.5 KMPL (in spite of being part of few pileups)

Ashwinee, it's the magic of the 7 speed CVT.
I think that the only petrol engine which gives more mileage than the ARAI claims is the i-Vtec. Love it.
I also saw in a thread where even the manual i-Vtec was giving figures close to yours.
Honda City rocks no matter how much is has been criticized, and all thanks to the frugal and proven i-Vtec.

[ashwinee]

Originally Posted by iss1307

Ashwinee, it's the magic of the 7 speed CVT.
I think that the only petrol engine which gives more mileage than the ARAI claims is the i-Vtec. Love it.
I also saw in a thread where even the manual i-Vtec was giving figures close to yours.
Honda City rocks no matter how much is has been criticized, and all thanks to the frugal and proven i-Vtec.

And we both (me and wife) have driven the City ZX CVT for last 8 years and understand when and how to accelerate. Guess that too played a big part. (All this numbers with 95% time AC on and 5% time sunroof opened). Usually I was never the kind that concentrated on fuel economy, but the green light "and" display of 30 Km/l "and" Rev meter within 1500 for a speed of 60+ KM is addictive

Will post real world city traffic figures after this long weekend. I am getting more mileage than City ZX which was 77BHP, and not complaining. Waiting for some more KMs before I try the S mode.