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-   -   Road Rage - Understanding, Avoidance and De-escalating Situation (https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/road-safety/133373-road-rage-understanding-avoidance-de-escalating-situation-76.html)

A 5 year old child has been injured. A proper investigation should be done and all at fault should be punished. The people who caused injury to the child should be tried for suitable penal clauses under the BNS. That’s criminal.

What’s wrong with the society, where are we heading for? A simple fender bender and people are thirsty for someone’s blood. Why people have become so insensitive to others? Scary times to be on roads.

Navi Mumbai road rage: Bizman attempts to run over 4 with SUV after brawl, gets attacked by mob.

Road Rage Mumbai

It's great that you and your friends are safer. Yes escalating the issue would not let us anywhere. Even I also experienced a lot of road rage situations but just like you, I did not escalated them at all. Sadly all of this attributes to lack of civic sense. I don't know what is up with the drivers mindsets while on the road.

Apologies in advance for the long post.

Was always thankful to the gods for saving me this misery but at the same time was wary that it was definitely due for some time. And alas, yesterday, i had the first taste of it – though not physically abusive as road rage but more of a mentally unnerving case (facing obstinate people and a situation unfolding contrary to rationale when the “people factor” comes in - including my own decision making thought process).

Scenario – A minor incident on the single carriageway NH near Nooranad (in Kerala). A Wagon R crosses over the center line at a crucial moment (a bottleneck situation) with an end result of shattered side view mirrors and ego's of driving prowess. My plan was to simply show him the video, discuss that both of us were on the receiving end and let’s just move on with this learning.



Now what i hadn’t prepared for was (1st mistake) - these young guys in the wagon R starting all this fiasco, of blaming me and asking for compensation and more surprisingly asking it to settle in the local police station – after even seeing the dashcam footage. I mean it felt like they were “digging their own grave” and I was fine to go ahead, with even my ego kicking in with their blame game(2nd mistake).

It was only later in hindsight that I had realized the quagmire I had stepped into.
The fact that i had not accounted for the “people factor”, came forth at the local police station. While i initially felt that the police personnel was siding with the local aam aadmi in the wagon R with the “light hearted banter” from him that had started to unnerve me. Small comments like using comically broken hindi language (yup, i am a north Indian malayali which shows up on my Malayalam’s “hindi” accent) and to top it off, these kids going on like “a stuck taperecorder” blaming me to be on the wrong side, the "fun filled" blame game of answering which car hit whose car.

All this happening before the officer even looking at the dashcam video. This got on my nerves and now i was not just focussed on fighting the blame game, but even hell bent on getting compensation from them no matter how long it takes or if it gets dragged on to a case(3rd mistake). And this was immediately put through to them and the officer, regrettably, not so nicely.

So while the officer asks me to retrieve the video, they started bickering endlessly with detailed description of how i was far out in their lane. And this is where i lost it, my frustration almost made me swear at these kids. But fortunately, a brain freeze caught my tongue and i just mumbled - that i need to retrieve it from my car and might take a few minutes.

It was just these few minutes of solitude back at my car that gave me a chance to calm my nerves and recollect my thoughts - the realization that such a tiny incident had spiralled to this level.

Thoughts running in my head at that moment:

1.) Priorities – I had somewhere to be and had no incentive to engage with these kids. I should have called off their bluff at the accident site, and should have moved on after showing them the video. This could have given them time to put their heads to it and then decide whether they want to drag it to a police station. All in hindsight.

My responsibility now was to prove to the police that it is not my fault – that is all.

2.) My position – Am i wrong, do i have proof? Since this part was sorted, there was no reason to feel threatened.

(This dynamics definitely would have changed if the opposite party was someone who is wielding money or political influence or if the accident was more of grievous nature)
Fortunately, it was not so.

3.) Nothing is personal – They had no personal vendetta against me, they were trying desperately to get money out of me as they had to fix the car and were using every tactic they could. (i later realised the car was not even theirs and hence the higher levels of desperation)

Even the police officer who already seemed quite busy, was being burdened to mediate this puny incident. I guess the frustration was showing in his dark humour and lack of interest in listening.

This bought back some composure to my frustrated head and that is when i started getting a clearer picture.

All their aggressiveness – “we know the law, our folks are backing us up and there is no escape unless you compensate us” started to look hollow (a ruse to drag it on). They were getting no calls or messages and nobody had shown up in all the time we were there.

So i went ahead with my own decision - Papers out, car parked in police station and figuring out next steps of filing the case. My decision was to call out their bluff and give them a chance now by either fixing my side mirror or compensating me else if it meant dragging it out on a case so be it.

I had already starting to look at the next steps with an official case, and was just ignoring their attempts to argue.

While this was getting dragged on, i overheard colleagues of the officer, asking him to join in for a tea brake since he had missed his lunch (True or not i do not know). But the realization hit hard - the officer was actually managing the staff radio, the station phone calls and the paperwork – all this time while we were in the station. And this is when i had the pang of guilt, all this nonsense might seem like a childish brawl to him.

So contrary to what I had planned earlier, I decided to be done with it. These kids can plan whatever their game was, but if they decided to just leave it be and be on their way- then I will not be fighting any further. Even if it meant losing the argument to them and not getting compensated.

So, I started to look at the clock and the time on my mobile and started babbling on the wasted time and i think they took the cue.
The de-escalation seemed to be quite quick after that, they were rushing on their way out with a no discussion - sign off on a “no complaint” agreement. At that moment all that was running in my head was the, guilt of wasting the officer’s time - the feeling of having lost to these kids in Wagon R just paled out in comparison.

Thoughts in hindsight:

1.) Maybe i could have avoided the incident altogether by coming to a stop behind the parked car but then this seemed beyond defensive driving. So decided that this was a one off incident and not to dwell over it.

2.) Could have shown the video’s and pics and be on my way. If they had decided to push this any further and involved the cops i could have just shared the snaps over watsapp/email and let them decide if such a prolonged drama at the station was worth it. A crucial mistake which now serves as reminder from experience.

3.) Losing the composure and sight of our priorities – The priority of the occupants of wagon R was to gain compensation from me, to which they had played out. Mine instead was to let it be and move on. But somehow i lost sight of what i had in my mind and played onto their game. And shamefully i must admit – i was completely outmaneuvered by these kids and fell for their game.

4.) Most importantly, in the heat of the moment testosterones over-rides the rational brain – no arguments on that. If someone’s doesn’t then they have mastered something almost impossible. All we mere mortals can do is take a break, mull over it and let the testosterone level go down in the blood to start thinking back again humanely or atleast a bit more rationally.rl:

Hope i can learn from this experience and not make this mistake again (though that’s something that i am well known to fail at:coldsweat)

Things are getting real bad now. I drive with caution when I am in Bangalore these days.

Video courtesy - YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmnQyxXFC20

On a lighter note:

https://twitter.com/labelled4/status...732930164?s=19

Not Road rage, but just had a very frustrating and irritating argument with a 'Educated biker' on a bmw/harley(couldn'tget a proper look except for that blue helmet of his), right in front of my society main gate.

Let me explain the layout outside my society.
We are located on the service road at the end of JNPT road, where you get down before the bridge and then take that humongous one way roundabout to start on the karnala- Goa road.
We were promised an underpass right in front of maingate and our locality maingate was planned accordingly. But Nhai at the last moment moved it about 10 meters from where it was supposed to be so now the maingate and underpass is 10 meters away from each other.

This has caused a problem to all of is, as to go towards ulwe, bombay or atal setu, either we take a almost 2 kms u turn, which is filled with disastrous potholes(The same road where some unfortunately bikers lost their lives by coming under trucks due to falling due to potholes) and truck/trailers and blind spots, OR, a small 10mtrs opposite side driving (on a kaccha road/side service road) and wait for an opportunity opposite the underpass to cross over.

Now, i don't feel this as wrong, since we are taking the kaccha/side road to go and not driving opposite on the 2 actual proper lanes, and it's hardly 10 meters, and merging properly to cross over.

I'll try to post pictures later, so that fellow members would understand that it's not wrong and more safer than the actual planned route.

The incident:

I strap my toddler in his baby car seat and with my wife head to the nearest temple which is just 500 meters away. As i come out of my main gate, there is this biker on his hog, talking on the phone waiting for someone. He is exactly at the spot where the society pavement ends and kachha road starts.

I wait for him to finish talking and small honk slightly, expecting him to move, this guy sees and ignores me.

I small honk again, and instead of moving, he gestures at me to take a wide turn around him, which will make me go on the actual road and a wide turn against oncoming traffic, which would be dangerous and illegal.

I small honk the 3rd time and he still doesn't move and gestures, all he had to do was move ahead and let me pass to the kaccha road.

Now fully frustrated, i drive next to him, roll down my window and tell him he's putting me and my family at huge risk by not moving and asking to go around him the way he mentioned.

Without even understanding the roads around him and the situation, he blames me, saying you are in the wrong by going the wrong way.

I asked him if you are a local or locality resident and do you understand my situation or this road? Like an 'Educated Samaritan' he just points that I'm trying to go wrong way and honking at him.

Now i am mad. Here is a guy, who could have just moved a little bit ahead and let me pass, but his ego wouldn't like that. He is standing right ahead of a main gate of a huge locality, standing right on the path where cars go in and out, talking on his phone in dim lights, without hazard lights on, not understanding service road and it's use for locals to merge, and trying to educate me!

Still as he seemed educated, i maintained a proper but angry tone and didn't swear, but he was hell bent on not moving. By this time, my kid starts crying, my wife is mad at the biker too, and the security and local rickshaw walas come to mediate. And this guy is still arguing and not moving and trying to lecture all of us.

I just tell him, your ego and arrogance has caused my kid to cry and this karma will get you back somewhere, and this guy starts arguing back. I asked him, should i get out my car and have a proper conversation with him, which he mistook as a threat rl:, lol, and said 'I am threatened'. By now my security has moved him and i have way to go to the kaccha road, while 3 cars behind had to dangerously go wrong way as this biker had stopped our access to kaccha road.

I go ahead, visit the hanuman temple, get my bp down and think back on this.

Should i have initiated the talk by rolling down the window? I expected an educated and maturr looking hog rider to be more understanding and not get into messy situations, but he was riding on an ego high.

I don't even remember all i said but, my wife pointed out that i argued the entire time in English and didn't swear (thank you to this thread for that) and one of my statements made my wife chuckle later "Your ego and attitude is as high as that helmet on your head!" The blue half helmet indeed looked good on him though. Looks can be deceiving.

P.S and out of topic: I've come to hate certain weekend superbikers, who create excessive noise pollution every weekend, early morning and late night, opening the throttle as soon as they hit the JNPT road back from the long rides, not caring about the infants and toddlers and elderly people trying to rest on a weekend. we've petitioned for noise barriers and had to spend extra for soundproof windows.

Any TBHP members passing through the area can dm me anytime, coffee and snacks on me:)

So, from what I could understand, you wanted to go wrong way (because NHAI messed up or for whatever reason), honked at a biker who was attending a phone call on the shoulder of the road, who did not move, and you thus rolled down your window & told him "should I get out of the car" (and were then confused why it was perceived as a threat?). Is that correct?

With due respect, you were wrong. On every count. You did not have a right to drive wrong way. The biker was not obliged to move. Those words did actually come across as a threat (especially after you ask "are you a local?"). I mean this in the most sincere way possible - you could have handled it way differently, especially since you were, in fact, in the wrong. You wanted to go wrong side. Sure, there may be "justifications" for it, but that does not mean that the guy is supposed to move or you have a right to proceed in that direction.

https://youtu.be/rq8-RkYlemY?si=Qhg8KqCcVZ6W4pFY

Very easy to blame the biker(s).

Slow down as soon as you spot a bike on the fast lane. Honk loud and clear way ahead. Anticipate, check ORVMs, be aware of vehicles around, lastly pull over immediately and not just carry on.

Ertiga driver? Even more stupid :Frustrati.

Unfortunately, a regular driver who follows the laws of the land doesn't understand these jugaad nuances.

You are rationalizing your illegal driving to shift blame to the biker who was just standing his ground against a wrong-side driver.
He doesn't have to. It's not a private road and so is subject to the same laws of the land that everyone else is bound to.
You DID threaten him, sir!
I really wonder whose ego was in play here.
With all due respect, your wife may not be the most reliable eyewitness in this scenario. If you "don't remember what you said" it's possible, even probable, that you peppered your speech with some spicy language. In any case, you were wrong.

Ahhh yes, so you admit to being biased to superbikers as a group. This particular member of that group did nothing wrong and you still feel you are justified at venting out at him.
I think I know the exit you are talking about and got the shock of my life when I saw a stream of vehicles headed in the opposite direction when I took this road last month. Didn't bother confronting them on why they are doing this because after 30 years of driving on Indian roads, I know better. They would have probably reacted just as you did, sans the invitation to coffee and snacks :D

The fact that you took effort to write this detailed post indicates you were / are still quite wound up on this. I would assume you did threaten him with much more than what you wrote out here; and probably that is what caused your kid to start crying. You sir are the sole cause of causing the nuisance to your child and everyone else in that situation.

The end scenario is you were going on the wrong side; and expected a biker who was in his rights to be where he was, doing what he intended to be a safe and correct effort on his end; and now are being told by multiple strangers on the net that you were the one at fault. If I were you, I'd just move on.

I had written a detailed post to further explain on the comments above, but took a bath, collected my thoughts and had some realizations and deleted it:)

I don't have a flair for writing and might have not explained properly, but if my fellow members misinterpreted or got some wrong conclusions (which frankly hurt a bit), i can now imagine what the biker thought.

I chose the lesser evil out of 2 available paths to merge, and only people who live near me would understand, but won't elaborate as this is not the thread for that.

Such incidents happen frequently, Indian roads afterall, and i usually forgive or forget or rap myself if I'm wrong and go past it.

Why i wrote on this thread for this particular incident?

A: I tried to have a proper civil conversation, the biker could have yielded, but moral stand escalated it, which is not what this thread dictates.

Why did i try to elaborate this situation in the post?

B: Road rage can be due to Idiocy, ego/attitude, or simple misunderstandings.

The only reason i spoke with him is, he had put me on a tough spot to move my car, he was done talking on phone before my first honk, as i mentioned earlier, i waited till he finished the conversation expecting him to move.

You have to understand, it's not about him being right. He didn't stop me from going the wrong way, which i would have respected and obliged. It was him asking me to continue going wrong way, by going around him, into oncoming traffic is what irked me.

Instead of saying i hate superbikers, actually i respect most of them as they follow rules and are educated.This is what i expected from this gentleman, especially when my first sentence is 'You are putting my family at risk by asking me to move the way you want' and not some expletives.

My unnecessary afterthought about the highway, while writing the post, portrayed as if i have an agenda which is wrong.

No verbal or colourful conversation happened, just one guy adamant to prove he's morally right and me trying to explain this particular situation to him. His 'I feel threatened 'was a sarcastic reply.

I am always careful around people moving with families and kids. And expect atleast a certain driving populace to be the same as me.

My learnings:

Stop talking with people on the road altogether and just drive ahead.

Learn to phrase and write better, and not in the heat of the moment, so that my peers don't misunderstand or misjudge.

Learn to forgive and forget, others and self. Cheers!

I don't think anyone misinterpreted the situation. Your writing was lucid enough at least for me to understand the exact situation and why the blame for what happened (and thankfully, what did not happen) should rest squarely on you.

I frankly don't understand, why are we being so strong to judge people. I wanted understanding and reflection,not who's right or wrong, but i am getting extremely strong blaming replies. Like i said, you won't understand my situation, but still people are pointing and reiterating what others are saying. I just thought of discussing with fellow members, and asking for compassionate and constructive criticisms. That the biker sticking his head right close to the window where my 1.5yrs old was sitting was not the one to make him cry but it was his father who did it. Like you assumed i missed writing about colourful exchange on purpose, similarly I might have not written some things too in much detail.

A couple of months back, I posted about flagging down dangerous driving truckers and asking them to slow down on this same route, and people berated me for doing that. I didn't want the huge stone debris to hit bikers especially. And now all of a sudden moral policing by someone else is correct?

If I was that biker, and the same thing happened and I posted here, and things got escalated instead, what advice would I be getting on this exact thread?

FYI, we have ministers, ACP and lot of govt officials in our locality and all take the same route I take. Builder is going to pave the kachha road for us to take that tunnel, which is the exact path I'm taking legally. Another gate is coming up right next to underpass.


If this picture of the path,where i am exactly in front of our main gate, the dangers of longer path which a bhpian above confirmed, still gives you the idea I'm wrong, then i agree i am wrong. And i belive all the people who told me i am wrong have never made turns like this the entire time driving in India.
Will learn and reflect, and in threads like this, will personally, if i ever reply, be considerate and educating and empathetic.

Possibly this biker didn’t share your nuanced understanding of the whole situation and so he objected to your driving on the wrong side.