This Poll will Roll - NHC vs Aveo vs Fiesta vs Baleno

Fiero · 5th June 2006, 22:21

but i guess we aren't considering the vtec here ... the nhc(non-vtec) is really BORING ... nothing exiting to offer on the performance front (including in gear roll-ons).
ofcourse,the NHC does have other advantages.

prince85 · 5th June 2006, 22:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by santosh.s

You definitely meant NCH-VTEC requires "more effort" in city conditions, which IMHO is "less fun to drive".

It does require more effort to drive the NHC VTEC in city conditons compared to the Baleno coz even though the NHC VTEC is more powerful than the Baleno but then as i said earlier the surge in power is more linear in the Baleno and the gear ratios are well laid down compared to the NHC VTEC when driving in city conditions which is often below the 2.5k rpm mark. But then IMHO that does not make the NHC VTEC less fun to drive.

FTD for me is a car which gives me good raw power for high-speed driving with equal sort of intoxicating feel across the rev-band. No doubt Baleno has a lot more juice till 4k rpm but then it fades off atleast when compared to the NHC VTEC after the 4-4.5k mark. Whereas the NHC VTEC has a more even power distribution right upto the 6.5k rpm limit(correct me if i am wrong). This is what was my impression when i test drove the NHC VTEC extensively when i was looking out for a new-car in the 7-8.5L range around 2 months back and these are the drive qualities that i noticed which made it a more FTD machine for me.

I hope i made myself more clear this time rather than confusing you even further

Fiero · 5th June 2006, 22:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by prince85

No doubt Baleno has a lot more juice till 4k rpm but then it fades off atleast when compared to the NHC VTEC after the 4-4.5k mark. Whereas the NHC VTEC has a more even power distribution right upto the 6.5k rpm limit(correct me if i am wrong). This is what was my impression when i test drove the NHC VTEC extensively when i was looking out for a new-car in the 7-8.5L range around 2 months back.

I hope i made myself more clear this time rather than confusing you even further

yup ... thats the whole VTEC advantage ... but the old one was a rocket ... this one is just about as quick as the OHC 1.5 ... still ... damn good top end performance.

mclaren1885 · 5th June 2006, 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by prince85

No doubt Baleno has a lot more juice till 4k rpm but then it fades off atleast when compared to the NHC VTEC after the 4-4.5k mark. Whereas the NHC VTEC has a more even power distribution right upto the 6.5k rpm limit(correct me if i am wrong).

To understand this one has to first understand the concept of VTEC .. The VTEC kicks in at around 3-4k i suppose , so its not at all shocking to see it not loose power throughout the rev-band after the initial.. In short thats what the VTEC was meant for in the first place .. The moment the secondary lobe actuates , the valve opens and closes wrt to the high speed profile of the cam .. The rev-limiter on the OHC was 7200 i guess , not sure about the NHC .. All thanks to the VTEC technology of the Honda's the car is sworn by the racing community .. But a baleno was always meant to be a luxury sedan unlike honda who specifically got in the VTEC with performance oriented sales.. Getting such performance out of a baleno is just a bonus .. I guess its time for maruti to wake up and bring in the twin cam technology the suzis are so popular for , then one will see the hondas running for cover .. Only if wishes were horses ?!

In terms of performance mods , the fiesta is not far behind too .. U get loads and loads OFF THE SHELF parts from europe as the platform is the same .. No wonder the fiestas showed their worth in the recently concluded rally..

PS : Sorry for going slightly OT ..

venkatrx · 6th June 2006, 10:17

Guys,

this thread got reopened due to the post below

request you guys to answer the queries for this.....

As per this article in Autocar india, fiesta-diesel is claimed as a better car than nhc-zx.

http://www.india.ford.com/servlet/ContentServer?cid=1138834993466&pagename=FIPL%2FDF YContainer%2FIndependentReview&c=DFYContainer&inde xid=1

For a long term ownership, what are the additional costs involved in a Feista-diesel as compared to nhc-petrol?

whats it the expected life of nhc (gxi) engine and that of fiesta diesel?

santosh.s · 6th June 2006, 23:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by prince85

It does require more effort to drive the NHC VTEC in city conditons compared to the Baleno coz even though the NHC VTEC is more powerful than the Baleno but then as i said earlier the surge in power is more linear in the Baleno and the gear ratios are well laid down compared to the NHC VTEC when driving in city conditions which is often below the 2.5k rpm mark.

Though gear ratios do have an important role to play, city comfort is mainly due to low end torque, IMHO. which allows us to extend any gear to amazingly low speeds without stressing the engine, 20-25-30kmpl for 3rd, 4th and 5th respectively...its wonderful !!

Quote:

But then IMHO that does not make the NHC VTEC less fun to drive.

Even if we lower the limiter to 2.5K?

Quote:

FTD for me is a car which gives me good raw power for high-speed driving with equal sort of intoxicating feel across the rev-band. No doubt Baleno has a lot more juice till 4k rpm but then it fades off atleast when compared to the NHC VTEC after the 4-4.5k mark. Whereas the NHC VTEC has a more even power distribution right upto the 6.5k rpm limit(correct me if i am wrong).

Though NCH-VTEC is more powerful, the difference is not by leaps and bounds, it almost gets compensated by its additional weight. I think you should refer to discussion here (comparison of baleno & NCH non VTEC) -

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ost238198.html

and then consider the specs of VTEC instead.
weight: 1065kg, payload: 80kg (common to both)
max. torque: 132.4 N-m @4.8k
max. power: 98.6 BHP @5.8k

Then best case torque response would be as given below with the optimistic assumption that it maintains its max. torque untill 5305 RPM and maintains its max. power thereafter. Of course, in reality its going to be much worser than that.

# weight 1.065+0.080=1.145
1500 132.4
4800 132.4
5305 132.4
5800 121.1
6000 117.1
6500 108.1

Similarly for baleno EII (taken from actual EII curve with slight reduction (for EIII) till 5.5k, max. power limit therafter) its is
# weight 0.985+0.080=1.065
1500 110
3000 130.5
4000 122
4500 124
5000 120
5500 118
6000 108.2
6500 99.9

If you plot this in terms of per tonne figures, the picture is clear

Quote:

This is what was my impression when i test drove the NHC VTEC extensively when i was looking out for a new-car in the 7-8.5L range around 2 months back and these are the drive qualities that i noticed which made it a more FTD machine for me.

FTD can be subjective, individual choice

Quote:

I hope i made myself more clear this time rather than confusing you even further

No... nothing much!

50paise · 7th June 2006, 00:13

i like the new aveo.. i think its smooth..

silentscreamers · 7th June 2006, 10:31

people to end the controversy, NHC is still the largest selling model in this segment, because Indians overall are conservative buyers, Fiesta is the second most selling car in the segment, the Aveo has taken off very well but sales are lagging behind Fiesta, while the favourite over here the Baleno is almost non existent on the sales chart, you see head rules over heart! Especially with all these rising fuel prices!!
My vote overall goes for the Fiesta! it seems like the most promising car right now...
And BTW the in-gear acc. in the Fiesta 1.6 as well as the diesel is better than even the NHC Vtec!!! The 1.6 feels much more lively and peppy to drive than the NHC Vtec, the only car coming close to the peppiness is the Baleno, but even its roll on figures are not that good when compared to the Fiestas...
And lets face the fact no matter how many people vote for the Baleno here, while actually going to buy the car almost 90% of em are not going to buy the Baleno, its simply outdated, It looks like a car from the 80's or atleast an early 90's one, dash is clearly of the same generation... Maruti really really needs to come out with a new version for the Baleno!!

Until that the Blue Oval gets my Vote....

speedbuster · 9th June 2006, 15:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by silentscreamers

people to end the controversy, NHC is still the largest selling model in this segment, because Indians overall are conservative buyers, Fiesta is the second most selling car in the segment, the Aveo has taken off very well but sales are lagging behind Fiesta, while the favourite over here the Baleno is almost non existent on the sales chart, you see head rules over heart! .

From where you got this info that fiesta is 2nd largest selling car?

you forgot Accent, Indigo..

Accent sold 5000+ units in march, which was equal to total sales of all FORD cars.

I agree on NHC city part, its the best seller at the moment,but not because of indians are conservative buyers, but it offers best overall package in C segment.

ravibhat · 6th October 2006, 19:22

Hi Smart guy,

I suugest you try newley launched Verna Petrol, its really cool car, If you don't like Verna then go for Aveo,

Verna has latest technology and one can trust Hyundai than GM cars.

Ravi.

esteem_lover · 6th October 2006, 23:00

well said ravi. the verna & hyundai are there to stay, cant say the same about the aveo or GM. the aveo might fade away as fast as the astra, corsa etc.

NIP · 9th October 2006, 19:55

i was at my ICE installer a couple of days ago and there was an AVEO parked up. i've never seen the car close up or its interiors before (probably cause there arent too many around?), but the interiors are just awesome ! i think when it comes to interiors, it beats the other cars here. exterior looks better than a fiesta, especially the rear (subjective). now, why did this package fail...or will it eventually catch up like the how the baleno initially never sold.

Nikhilb2008 · 9th October 2006, 20:42

The Aveo is the best looker among the cars....

The NHC ZX is something which grows on you..... And in black with a biig Ferrari sticker on the black bonnet with alloys, it looks quite decent.

In handling, the Fiesta seems to be really good..... I havent driven any of the cars.... I have only read abt them

My dad has a City ZX Vtec and he touched 170 recently and he said it felt rock steady at that speed...

The only problem my dad has with the City is that the A pillar obscure his vision a bit at junctions..... he finds it a bit annoying....

grvanand · 10th October 2006, 12:34

Fiesta 1.6 is the best drivers car at the moment. As for space, City should be preferred. Baleno is old and Aveo has a harsh engine along with poor safety ratings.

suman · 10th October 2006, 13:36

Nikhil, why on earth would you want to put a Ferrari sticker on a Honda

?????

View Poll Results: Which of the following cars would you buy?
Honda City (non-vtec)	75	24.75%
Chevy Aveo 1.6	49	16.17%
Ford Fiesta 1.6	82	27.06%
Baleno Vxi	97	32.01%
Voters: 303. You may not vote on this poll

5th June 2006, 22:21	#106
Fiero BHPian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 352 Thanked: 146 Times	but i guess we aren't considering the vtec here ... the nhc(non-vtec) is really BORING ... nothing exiting to offer on the performance front (including in gear roll-ons). ofcourse,the NHC does have other advantages.
	() Thanks

6th June 2006, 10:17	#110
venkatrx BHPian Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: bangalore Posts: 453 Thanked: 4 Times	Shootout : Autoindia NHC v/s Fiesta-diesel Guys, this thread got reopened due to the post below request you guys to answer the queries for this..... As per this article in Autocar india, fiesta-diesel is claimed as a better car than nhc-zx. http://www.india.ford.com/servlet/ContentServer?cid=1138834993466&pagename=FIPL%2FDF YContainer%2FIndependentReview&c=DFYContainer&inde xid=1 For a long term ownership, what are the additional costs involved in a Feista-diesel as compared to nhc-petrol? whats it the expected life of nhc (gxi) engine and that of fiesta diesel?
	() Thanks

7th June 2006, 00:13	#112
50paise BHPian Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Mumbai Posts: 66 Thanked: 0 Times	i like the new aveo.. i think its smooth..
	() Thanks

7th June 2006, 10:31	#113
silentscreamers BHPian Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: mumbai Posts: 83 Thanked: 56 Times	people to end the controversy, NHC is still the largest selling model in this segment, because Indians overall are conservative buyers, Fiesta is the second most selling car in the segment, the Aveo has taken off very well but sales are lagging behind Fiesta, while the favourite over here the Baleno is almost non existent on the sales chart, you see head rules over heart! Especially with all these rising fuel prices!! My vote overall goes for the Fiesta! it seems like the most promising car right now... And BTW the in-gear acc. in the Fiesta 1.6 as well as the diesel is better than even the NHC Vtec!!! The 1.6 feels much more lively and peppy to drive than the NHC Vtec, the only car coming close to the peppiness is the Baleno, but even its roll on figures are not that good when compared to the Fiestas... And lets face the fact no matter how many people vote for the Baleno here, while actually going to buy the car almost 90% of em are not going to buy the Baleno, its simply outdated, It looks like a car from the 80's or atleast an early 90's one, dash is clearly of the same generation... Maruti really really needs to come out with a new version for the Baleno!! Until that the Blue Oval gets my Vote....
	() Thanks

6th October 2006, 19:22	#115
ravibhat Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,256 Thanked: 37 Times View My Garage	Hi Smart guy, I suugest you try newley launched Verna Petrol, its really cool car, If you don't like Verna then go for Aveo, Verna has latest technology and one can trust Hyundai than GM cars. Ravi.
	() Thanks

6th October 2006, 23:00	#116
esteem_lover Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Madras/Py Posts: 7,556 Thanked: 502 Times View My Garage	well said ravi. the verna & hyundai are there to stay, cant say the same about the aveo or GM. the aveo might fade away as fast as the astra, corsa etc.
	() Thanks

9th October 2006, 19:55	#117
NIP Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,180 Thanked: 152 Times View My Garage	i was at my ICE installer a couple of days ago and there was an AVEO parked up. i've never seen the car close up or its interiors before (probably cause there arent too many around?), but the interiors are just awesome ! i think when it comes to interiors, it beats the other cars here. exterior looks better than a fiesta, especially the rear (subjective). now, why did this package fail...or will it eventually catch up like the how the baleno initially never sold.
	() Thanks

9th October 2006, 20:42	#118
Nikhilb2008 Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 5,196 Thanked: 10,140 Times	The Aveo is the best looker among the cars.... The NHC ZX is something which grows on you..... And in black with a biig Ferrari sticker on the black bonnet with alloys, it looks quite decent. In handling, the Fiesta seems to be really good..... I havent driven any of the cars.... I have only read abt them My dad has a City ZX Vtec and he touched 170 recently and he said it felt rock steady at that speed... The only problem my dad has with the City is that the A pillar obscure his vision a bit at junctions..... he finds it a bit annoying....
	() Thanks

10th October 2006, 12:34	#119
grvanand BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 211 Thanked: 0 Times	Fiesta 1.6 is the best drivers car at the moment. As for space, City should be preferred. Baleno is old and Aveo has a harsh engine along with poor safety ratings.
	() Thanks

10th October 2006, 13:36	#120
suman Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Kolkata Posts: 4,589 Thanked: 279 Times View My Garage	Nikhil, why on earth would you want to put a Ferrari sticker on a Honda ?????
	() Thanks