[aargee]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

My requirements have changed as well. All I care about are (growing old ain't I?):[list]

Attachment 1601670

Going by the pattern of your choices...

Ford Aspire Titanium AT might suit you because of...
1. 6 Airbags (going by BBlost's suggestion as well)
2. Automatic
3. Punching engine in both Petrol & Diesel than VW
4. Better GC than Ameo & Baleno (174 mm compared to 165 & 170)
5. ABS + EBD, ESP & HAL (Optional)
6. Cost of ownership less than Maruti (atleast the claims for now)
7. Aston Martin-esque face looks

[agambhandari]

Looking at the remarks table that you have made, I would suggest you to revisit the Baleno since the suspension has been reworked (as per the Baleno review thread) and although you find it fun to drive , a lot of my friends found the CVT baleno to be a bit dull.

On the other hand, I would really suggest you to look into the Ford Figo/Aspire AT. I would have suggested the Ecosport but you have already ruled it out. I havent had any issues with the Ford A.S.S and their service costs have been controlled a lot too. And don't forget the FTD factor in their cars . *wink*

If at all you are open to manual options , Ecoboost ecosport is a good option since it has plenty of power, I would advise you to take a TD since it doesn;t have a very light clutch.

[mohansrides]

Hello BHPians.....After many months of consideration, I think we are at a tipping point in our next car purchase. My requirements used to be quite comprehensive. But, I uncluttered my mind after I came across this thread - http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/street...y-vw-polo.html.

Now the primary requirement list is very simple.

1.) The build of the car should be rock solid to protect the occupants in case of a mishap.
2.) The car should have all safety devices like airbags, ABS, EBD and drivers seat height adjuster, audio controls on steering wheel and bluetooth for phone.
3.) The vehicle should seat 3 people comfortably in the second row of seats. None of the occupants in the second row should be required to "adjust" to make room for the others.
4.) A decent sized boot to hold at least 5 cabin sized roller suitcases (in whichever configuration).

Secondary requirements:
5.) Side curtain airbags would also be a big bonus.
6.) A comfortable 3 row for 2 would be a nice.
7.) Automatic transmission

Please notice that I have done away with considerations such as fuel economy and choice of fuel. Also no Tata vehicles please.

With the above requirements in mind, please do give me your suggestion about the right vehicle. At present, I have not set my mind on anything as this is purely a mind over heart purchase.

For all of your information, after an extensive search, only the Ertiga came up on my radar. But, I have read several mentions of the light quality of the build and that is making me worry.

Thank you

[agambhandari]

Originally Posted by mohansrides

Hello BHPians.....After many months of consideration,

You are correct to look for a solid build in this segment and I would definitely suggest you get the 6 airbags in your next car. If the budget can be stretched , stretch it , its a matter of safety and you know the importance far too well.

For a solid build and 6 airbags, my best pick would be the EcoSport, you can even get the petrol with an AT if you want, or else the other engines.

The only other cars in this price(under 10 lacs ) with 6 airbags would be the i20 top model and the Figo/Aspire.
In terms of space, I think the i20 would be the best in rear seat space, but the EcoSport would be more comfortable since it has a higher and more natural seating posture.
But sadly 3 abreast may not be possible with utmost comfort in any of these cars.

[mohansrides]

Originally Posted by agambhandari

For a solid build and 6 airbags, my best pick would be the EcoSport, you can even get the petrol with an AT if you want, or else the other engines.

But sadly 3 abreast may not be possible with utmost comfort in any of these cars.

Thank you agambhandari sir.

Yes, I do like the Ecosport for its build quality and safety features. But, the lack of space in the 2nd row took it off the list for me. The rear seat is only as wide as my Ritz. I don't want to buy a car for 10+ lacs and have the same seating capacity as my current hatch.

As a matter of fact, I have the same complaint (of lack of shoulder room in the 2nd row) with cars that are more expensive than the Ecosport. The 30+ lacs Fortuner offers very limited shoulder room and so does the BRV which costs some 12 to 14 lacs. For the life of me, I can't imagine why comfortable space for 3 adults in the 2nd row is not considered a basic requirement by car manufacturers when customers are paying 10 lacs plus for a car.

People in my family are not very tall. But, all of us are decidedly broad shouldered. So, width is more important to us than leg and knee room. With this in mind, after a lot of search, I have narrowed it down to 3 cars

Ertiga (new or pre-owned) -

Pros:

1.) Spacewise, this seems to be the best bet. Three people in my family fit fairly comfortably in the 2nd row; and two people sat with equal comfort in the 3rd row. Plus, there is a boot that's more or less the same size as that of my Ritz.
2.) Comes with 2 airbags and ABS
3.) Most affordable of the lot.
4.) Comes in AT in petrol.

Cons:

1.) The VXI automatic lacks seat height adjustment. I tried sitting in it and I felt quite buried below the dash. There is also no rear defogger. Normally, this would not be a problem. But, during the monsoons, I think this may be needed.
2.) I am really afraid that the Ertiga will be underpowered with 5 or 6 people on board plus luggage. Especially in the ghat sections where there may be bumper to bumper traffic. I have debated the petrol vs. diesel choices just on the basis of power alone (and I have concluded nothing as I am unable to make out from all my research whether petrol or diesel will be a better choice to pull me out of a jam from a dead stop on inclines (with a full load)). I would appreciate hearing other BHPians' opinions on this aspect of Ertiga ownership.
3.) All my research points to the fact that the build quality is poor on the Ertiga. This gives me serious pause.


XUV500 (new or pre-owned) -

Pros:

1.) Great space
2.) Nice power
3.) 6 airbags
4.) Good looks
5.) Has an AT option

Cons:

1.) Very expensive to start with. Appears even more expensive in upkeep over 5 or 7 years
2.) The gear throws and clutch travel were quite long for me during multiple test drives. So the AT is the only option that I would like. And that is very expensive.
3.) Lack of any boot space with all rows up.
4.) Lack of a slidable 2nd row to help with 3rd row leg room.
5.) There isn't any conclusive word on build quality. Maybe it is mentioned somewhere on the forum. But, I am yet to find it.
6.) Outlook of diesel cars appears uncertain over the next few years.



Innova (pre-owned ONLY from prior to 2016) -

Pros:
1.) Great space
2.) Decent power
3.) Great reliability
4.) Good build quality

Cons:
1.) I absolutely hate the looks. It's a friggin minivan !!
2.) More expensive pre-owned than a brand new Ertiga.
3.) For all that money, there are only 2 airbags.
4.) I have not driven one. But, from the looks of it, I don't think I would enjoy it at all.
5.) No AT option prior to 2016

I have made no decisions yet. But, I expect to narrow down to something over the next few months. A 10+ lac car is an expensive proposition for me. So, I have to get this right.

I was hoping that others here would share their views on these choices and also give me more options to consider.

[mooza]

Originally Posted by mohansrides

I was hoping that others here would share their views on these choices and also give me more options to consider.

I liked the experience of travelling around New Delhi in my friend's Honda BR-V recently.

I found the BR-V good looking and fairly spacious. My friend told me it is car like to drive as well. This could be another option that you could consider.

[IshaanIan]

Mohan, are you open to sedans? If so, then the Nissan Teana makes a lot of sense as it is well built, safe, seats people in comfort that is unprecedented under 50 lakhs and the creamy V6 can cruise fast and low rpms all day long. Being a Japanese car, you don't even need to worry about iffy Nissan service as any independent garage owner worth his salt should be able to source parts and service it. A D-segment sedan will be the best built you can find no Innova/XUV/Ertiga can compare on any front.

On highways sedans always feel safer to me than SUVs/MUVs because their low center of gravity makes sure they are able to change direction quickly at high speeds if the need ever arises.

If you aren't so sure about buying a sedan, then you could look into the CRV/X-Trail/Outlander. All very potent Japanese soft-roaders. The Outlander being the best to drive amongst the lot. Popular cars that can be serviced at any good independant garage, they are well built (not D-segment sedan well-built though), can seat 5 peacefully and no 3rd row so luggage is never an issue.

If you are willing to sacrifice soft touch materials and high-tech features and a bit of comfort, look out for a used Grand Vitara. 2.4 liter is the one you should be looking at. This is one rock solid reliable car. It is also extremely cheap and easy to maintain considering its size and segment that it is from.

[autorahul]

Quite a few cars cover many of your points, but very few actually cover this point. I believe this will be the clincher for whichever car you get.

Originally Posted by mohansrides

3.) The vehicle should seat 3 people comfortably in the second row of seats. None of the occupants in the second row should be required to "adjust" to make room for the others.

My top contender for that would be S-Cross. Due for a facelift launch this festive season, S-Cross has impressive build quality. Petrol automatic should also launch with the facelift. If you want a powerful car, you should definitely check out the 1.6. I got a feeling when I was enquiring about the pre GST sale that 1.6 might not come for the facelift.

Next in contention would be Renault Duster. Again a car that is expected to be replaced or usurped by Renault Kaptur during the festive season. Current Duster can be had with wonderful offers too!

Festive season has a lot going for the UVs and I would definitely recommend waiting if that is feasible.

[mohansrides]

Originally Posted by mooza

I liked the experience of travelling around New Delhi in my friend's Honda BR-V recently.

I found the BR-V good looking and fairly spacious. My friend told me it is car like to drive as well. This could be another option that you could consider.

Mooza... Thanks for the suggestion. Actually, me and the Mrs. made a beeline to the nearest Honda showroom with your exact sentiment in mind. I have to tell you that the 2nd row is pretty narrow. Like I said earlier, all of us are a bit broad shouldered in the family. Throw in a child seat in the 2nd row and only one of us can sit there. I do not want to use the 3rd row every time I need to transport 5 people. Even otherwise, the 3rd row in the BRV was quite uncomfortable with our knees pointing upward. By contrast, the 3rd row in the Ertiga was quite comfortable for 2 of us.

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

Mohan, are you open to sedans? ...

IshaanIan.... I have owned 3 Nissans in my previous life :-) So, I quite know what you are saying. But, in this life, the Teanas and the Grand Vitaras of the world are expensive for me.

But, I hear you about considering sedans as I am shopping. You will not believe it. But, a relative who was in my house just this evening was raving about the build quality and boot space of his Fiat Linea. So, I went and looked it up and was impressed. But, the same 1.3 liter mill?!! That seems like such less power for a car with a kerb weight of 1.2 tonnes. Also, as per the latest sales charts on this forum, Fiat seems to be selling almost no cars at all!! That is a concern for me. Anyways, I am calling the dealership tomorrow to ask if there are any offers.

Originally Posted by autorahul

Quite a few cars cover many of your points, but very few actually cover this point. I believe this will be the clincher for whichever car you get.



My top contender for that would be S-Cross. Due for a facelift launch this festive season, S-Cross has impressive build quality. Petrol automatic should also launch with the facelift. If you want a powerful car, you should definitely check out the 1.6. I got a feeling when I was enquiring about the pre GST sale that 1.6 might not come for the facelift.

Next in contention would be Renault Duster. Again a car that is expected to be replaced or usurped by Renault Kaptur during the festive season. Current Duster can be had with wonderful offers too!

Festive season has a lot going for the UVs and I would definitely recommend waiting if that is feasible.

autorahul.... You said it. Three people in the 2nd row is an absolute must for me. I am not buying a car that does not check this box. Period.

Also, it's amazing how all roads converge once the search begins. You said S-Cross and I just got home from test driving one and read your suggestion. :-) The build quality is solid and the ergonomics are great. But, that 1.3 liter is irritating me. It seems that whichever direction I turn, that 1.3 liter mill from Fiat is staring me down!! Are there really no other engines in this country?!!

Coming back to the S-Cross, I found the 2nd row bench to be not really that wide for 3 people. Till date only the XUV has satisfied me in the 2nd row space department. The Ertiga comes a slightly distant second.

Still I came away impressed with the S-Cross's build quality. The thought that niggles me is that if the 1.6 liter costs 15 lacs+ on road in Mumbai, I might as well pay the difference and get the XUV W8. More space, more power and 6 airbags.

About the Duster, I hate the ergonomics in that thing. Everything is in a weird place on that dash. So, no Duster for us.

Like you suggested, I am playing this slow and deliberate and may take until Diwali or even longer to make a purchase. I like to take my time and feel sure about my choice. FYI I decided that I wanted the Ritz and ONLY the Ritz almost 3 years before I actually bought the car. So far, I have not had to regret even one minute of my ownership. Even with this new purchase, my Ritz is likely going to stay as the elder (but smaller) sibling in the family.

[IshaanIan]

Originally Posted by mohansrides

But, in this life, the Teanas and the Grand Vitaras of the world are expensive for me.

I understand what you mean. The Teana can be expensive to maintain, BUT please do a bit more research on the Grand Vitara. It is a gem of a car and does not at all cost as much to maintain as its D-semgent tag suggests. Go to your local Maruti service center and ask the service manager or go through any of the threads here on t-bhp Grand Vitara costs about the same to maintain as a locally manufactured car. If you don't require 7 seats, I say chuck the Innova, go for a GV

[mohansrides]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

I understand what you mean. The Teana can be expensive to maintain, BUT please do a bit more research on the Grand Vitara. It is a gem of a car and....

Ishaan... The MSIL site does not even list prices for the GV. A casual search online reveals a price of 25 lacs!! That is way out there for me. But, the car looks great. I will wait and watch.

[hserus]

Originally Posted by mohansrides

Ishaan... The MSIL site does not even list prices for the GV. A casual search online reveals a price of 25 lacs!! That is way out there for me. But, the car looks great. I will wait and watch.

Used grand vitaras are amazingly good value if you find a good vehicle. They will last for lakhs of kilometers and the body won't fall apart before the engine gives up, as is very likely for some of the tin cans on wheels they sell as cars out here.

[sridhar-v]

Originally Posted by mohansrides

Ishaan... The MSIL site does not even list prices for the GV. A casual search online reveals a price of 25 lacs!! That is way out there for me. But, the car looks great. I will wait and watch.

MSIL has stopped selling the Grand Vitara.
If you get a well maintained used one buy it with your eyes closed. See Samurai's thread for all our experiences.

[Aroy]

Originally Posted by mohansrides

Hello BHPians.....After many months of consideration, I think we are at a tipping point in our next car purchase. My requirements used to be quite comprehensive. But, I uncluttered my mind after I came across this thread.......
Now the primary requirement list is very simple.

........
3.) The vehicle should seat 3 people comfortably in the second row of seats. None of the occupants in the second row should be required to "adjust" to make room for the others.
Thank you

Seating 3 persons in one row is the prerogative of wider vehicle - buses and some SUV, rest of the vehicles available seat only two/row comfortably. So if you want to seat 3 persons at a reasonable cost, you will need seats in the third row. That narrows the selection to XUV, Ertiga and Innova.

Unless you are travelling regularly (> 50% of the time) with 5+ persons in Ghats, Ertiga should suffice. Less power can be overcome by climbing in the third gear which is anyway a good driving practice if you are at less than 50 km/h.

[mohansrides]

Originally Posted by sridhar-v

MSIL has stopped selling the Grand Vitara.
If you get a well maintained used one buy it with your eyes closed. See Samurai's thread for all our experiences.

Originally Posted by hserus

Used grand vitaras are amazingly good value if you find a good vehicle. They will last for lakhs of kilometers and the body won't fall apart before the engine gives up, as is very likely for some of the tin cans on wheels they sell as cars out here.

hserus and sridhar-v.... Thank you for this advise. Yes, IshaanIan actually PMed me and told me about the used GVs. I did find one in the Mumbai area that seemed OK. But, at 3.75 lacs for a 2.0 lit from 2007, it seemed a bit expensive for me. Also, I am not too sure if I can trust a 10 year old vehicle with no ABS (or even airbags) to ferry my family on the highway where high speeds are the norm.

Originally Posted by Aroy

Seating 3 persons in one row is the prerogative of wider vehicle - buses and some SUV, rest of the vehicles available seat only two/row comfortably. So if you want to seat 3 persons at a reasonable cost, you will need seats in the third row. That narrows the selection to XUV, Ertiga and Innova.

Unless you are travelling regularly (> 50% of the time) with 5+ persons in Ghats, Ertiga should suffice. Less power can be overcome by climbing in the third gear which is anyway a good driving practice if you are at less than 50 km/h.

Right you are Aroy. My search keeps bringing me back to these three vehicles only. Of the three, I like the XUV best. But, the Ertiga makes the most sense.

While on the Ertiga, what are your thoughts on Petrol vs. Diesel on the basis of power alone? I mean, if I had to pull 5 people plus luggage up a steep ghat in bumper to bumper traffic which one would you recommend?