[Arun_S]

Originally Posted by Sankar

Oh wow! What about the festival of politicians aka elections? Problem was not with the election but its timing. Elections too could have waited for another month or so in this crisis situation. Media or Politicians sometimes I wonder which is the greater evil. Selective media and corrupt politics.

Sir, the Irony is the states which had elections are atleast doing ok compared to the ones which are facing serious crisis.

I do agree that elections turned the focus from second wave containing to campaigning.

[Sankar]

Originally Posted by drrajasaravanan

Hi
It's media mate. No doubt about it. The extrapolate one situation in the capital to rest of the country and they've access to us. Are they showing any positivity that's happening around us. Definite no. There is no oxygen shortage in most parts of the country and it has been extrapolated from few hospitals to a national calamity to the point that people around me are buying or renting portable oxygen if things go down. On top of it there is a directive from the centre asking the state's to ramp up oxygen production to handle the expected crisis but it has not been done. Plus the hospital in trying to do good by admitting more patients than they could be handle are actually causing harm. You can ask a registrar to extend his duty for another 12 hrs citing lack of help but oxygen is finite and you can't have two ways about it. At Least in the place where I am working and the city I am in the hospitals are rationale to balance what can be done and when to draw the line to say no to profit. Plus now hospitals are starting to say no to the whole babu culture in my city and that should help. Let's hope and see.

You are absolutely right sir. They are doing their bit to demoralise the country and driving people to panic. Good news pays less than bad news and scare mongering. It also helps their cause to paint a grim picture of the country in the west who were actually waiting for something to hook on to and cry foul of the govt. Media will then re-feed indian public the western view and amplify the negativity.

According to the news our state O2 is surplus; thanks to the private sector mainly INOX. The O2 plants installed with centre's help is yet to be commisioned awaiting utility connection etc from the state which they are in no hurry to expedite. On one side we have a delhi cm asking other states to send surplus O2 to delhi and on the other we have a state who is yet to commission the plants but is crying foul of the centre citing O2 deficiency in the country. With the health being a state subject I wonder what the delhi cm was doing till it hit the fan? Didnt he use the funds to install the O2 plants, what was he doing? I just read that plants are now being installed in delhi with pmcares fund. Although health being a state subject people crying and dying in delhi will paint a poor picture of the central govt rather than delhi cm because that is where the parliament is and as the rest of the world knows Delhi = India or Central Govt and maybe that is what they wanted. What I have seen in the press in these covid times is that if something goes wrong blame Modi and if its praises I'll have them please, thank you.

Originally Posted by Arun_S

Sir, the Irony is the states which had elections are atleast doing ok compared to the ones which are facing serious crisis.

I do agree that elections turned the focus from second wave containing to campaigning.

You are right although the numbers are increasing multifold and rapidly post the two elections here not many are critical are as the unfortunate people in delhi. I think the reason for this could be the innate poor air quality in the capital city which affect people's health over a long term. Poor air quality combined with a cold climate is a recipe for respiratory illnesses and add wuhan virus into the mix for a deadly cocktail.

[vivek95]

Just wanted to share a minor positive update in the hope that it spreads some positivity this morning. As an individual person, I believe in "acceptance" whether it is negative or positive. In the midst of this crisis, let's still have an optimistic view alongside accepting the adverse outcomes and tragedies that is striking many families. God is in total control end of the day, I firmly believe.

Had attended two particular elderly female patients aged 60+ with Covid positive status in my ICU and they a very bad presentation on admission. Very low Spo2, respiratory distress, CT severity score of 24/25 which means hardly any healthy non-affected lung left there. Other lady had 23/25. Both required Non-invasive Bipap support of ventilation initially (as a trial) and what seemed like they were soon headed for Invasive mechanical ventilation. Honestly, we had little hopes they would survive but over the last 12 days or so, their progress has been remarkable and miraculous to me. No, its not me, its many senior docs and their team behind the management, I am just one part of them. As on date, both ladies are without oxygen support and made their way to ward from ICU and will be discharged in about 2 or 3 days. They will go home walking !!

Intention to share this post is to alleviate anxiety. No matter what, a ray of hope is what a human being needs. It also plays a role in strengthening the will power and hopefully recovery from a disease.

--Dr. Vivek

[warrioraks]

Originally Posted by warrioraks

Even now when the situation is war-like, we see a great hesitation of the centre and nearly all state governments to impose a lockdown to break the chain. What we instead get is stupid (IMHO) measures like night curfews.
I am not pro-lockdown or anti-lockdown but just thinking - is there a threshold beyond which lockdown becomes necessary. Something like - if the number of daily cases in a district stay above 70% (or X%) of Covid beds in that district, then government is advised to impose the lockdown. Coming up with something like this has two benefits in my opinion:
1. Some consistency across the country in how things are being managed
2. Political hot potato decisions like lockdowns can be based on something concrete rather than heuristics

I asked this question few pages back. Got an answer today reading my morning dose of Economic Times. Seems the government has finally put in some early warning signals to anticipate districts where
healthcare system might collapse unless additional preventive measures are taken.


Districts with over 10% positivity or 60% bed occupancy liable for intensive actions, Centre tells states

https://www.newindianexpress.com/nat...-s-2294763.amp

[locusjag]

Originally Posted by Sankar

You are absolutely right sir. They are doing their bit to demoralise the country and driving people to panic. Good news pays less than bad news and scare mongering. It also helps their cause to paint a grim picture of the country in the west who were actually waiting for something to hook on to and cry foul of the govt.

How right you are! I tried to spread some positivity in a closed WhatsApp group of friends just now, that this O2 shortage isn't as widespread as it is made out to be. There's no need to succumb to the fear etc. And those who needed to criticize the central govt made me the villain immediately! I was stunned...all I did was to tell people to stay positive and take the media hype with a pinch of salt

It's a sign of the times we live in. This is why I don't comment on this thread either. I don't have anything meaningful to add, for one. And then, I've seen the exact same thing play out on this thread before. If you spread positivity at times of dread, they make you a villain.

I'm going to withdraw into a shell now. I hear the mortar shells whistling in overhead.

[m8002?]

Originally Posted by Sankar

According to the news our state O2 is surplus; thanks to the private sector mainly INOX. The O2 plants installed with centre's help is yet to be commisioned awaiting utility connection etc from the state which they are in no hurry to expedite. On one side we have a delhi cm asking other states to send surplus O2 to delhi and on the other we have a state who is yet to commission the plants but is crying foul of the centre citing O2 deficiency in the country. With the health being a state subject I wonder what the delhi cm was doing till it hit the fan? Didnt he use the funds to install the O2 plants, what was he doing? I just read that plants are now being installed in delhi with pmcares fund. Although health being a state subject people crying and dying in delhi will paint a poor picture of the central govt rather than delhi cm because that is where the parliament is and as the rest of the world knows Delhi = India or Central Govt and maybe that is what they wanted. What I have seen in the press in these covid times is that if something goes wrong blame Modi and if its praises I'll have them please, thank you.

Unfortunately, today we do not have a neutral media. Most of them tom-tom the govt. for anything they do (and even when they dont). The remaining criticize them for everything. And the truth, as always, is somewhere in between.

Its left to us to read/analyze both sides and come to a conclusion. I am not telling its easy since we can easily get carried away by our own interests.

To play the devils advocate on question about what the Delhi CM was doing, Maybe he was fighting/scheming against the crazy laws enacted where the central govt. has taken over all his ability to "claim" success to any of his projects.

[mayankk]

Originally Posted by Sankar

On one side we have a delhi cm asking other states to send surplus O2 to delhi and on the other we have a state who is yet to commission the plants but is crying foul of the centre citing O2 deficiency in the country. With the health being a state subject I wonder what the delhi cm was doing till it hit the fan?

The installation was via tendering by CMSS, a central govt body. Therefore, no funds were to be shared with delhi govt, and none were. Please get your facts right.
http://www.cmss.gov.in/sites/default...ERDOCUMENT.pdf

Originally Posted by locusjag

this O2 shortage isn't as widespread as it is made out to be.
.

Delhi, Uttar Pradesh, Maharastra, Gujarat and Madhya Pradesh.
Widespread? Do we need more than 50% states on the list, before it can be called widespread?
It is good that you are in an oxygen surplus state.
There is NO positivity in the middle of this pandemic. At least not in NCR.

[srishiva]

Originally Posted by mayankk

The installation was via tendering by CMSS, a central govt body. Therefore, no funds were to be shared with delhi govt, and none were. Please get your facts right.
http://www.cmss.gov.in/sites/default...ERDOCUMENT.pdf

SO basically, troll the thread and carry on.

Not sure how factual it is but the Delhi govt was supposed to provide land and they seem to have done their part as late as April 19. This was again from media.

I think both are responsible for this state of affairs in this country and we dont need to take one's side against other. I am a person who thinks decentralization is the right thing. Ofcourse after sharing the tax revenues rightly. I hate the 'one country, one system' that people want. If there are systems that could be better you need to allow that and let people decide what they want and who they want. Not everyone will be same. Even if you have to pay some extra tax.
Adding to this as a reason, after decades of getting more assistance, some states are still in the same state while the others have done on their own.

[locusjag]

Originally Posted by mayankk

There is NO positivity in the middle of this pandemic. At least not in NCR.

We aren't insensitive to our collective plight.

But to reiterate, NCR isn't India. NCR is one part of India. Why's the media blowing it up for all of us? People in Tamil Nadu actually think it's bad everywhere including where they live! The fear is real.

[roy_libran]

Originally Posted by locusjag

We aren't insensitive to our collective plight.

But to reiterate, NCR isn't India. NCR is one part of India. Why's the media blowing it up for all of us? People in Tamil Nadu actually think it's bad everywhere including where they live! The fear is real.


This thread is a crying shame. It is a basket case within this forum, an anomaly within it. Nowhere else is such rancid behavior countenanced. Wonder why you should get to attack me and get away with it. Be well, nevertheless, I wish nothing but the best for you.

You are insensitive and better withdraw into that shell you mentioned earlier. Seriously, it's a request with folded hands.

I have lost my father 4 days ago, my mom narrowly survived an oxygen cut off in the hospital while she was in the throes of a Cytokine Storm and came home yesterday. I had to queue up for hours and literally beg officials to allow my father to be cremated because they wouldn't allow his body in due to a technicality - I was alone and on the 12th day of my own recovery. Another person in my family is still fighting it out in the hospital. 7 others in my wife's family are fighting it out at home and we don't have oxygen backup so it's all luck. A lot of my friends and their families are fighting for hospital beds, oxygen and medicines. I am trying to support anyone and everyone in whatever little way I can.

So please don't sermonize on what the government should have, could have done. Being a resident of UP and Delhi NCR I have pretty much seen what the worst possible scenario could be, and then all the Effing Window Dressing.

Please Sir, live and prosper in your happy bubble but don't rub it in for those of us who aren't getting through this as easily.

[msdivy]

Originally Posted by Lobogris

If the IPL is called off today, it won’t help make the situation outside better in any way. In fact this is the need of the hour. We need to find ways of continuing our daily lives inspite of the virus. They are taking the risk while providing us with valuable lessons and entertainment. If a lot of players fall sick, they will call it off and then the experts can try and decipher what went wrong. If they succeed then we have a blueprint for future tournaments. I never watch it but I welcome it.

A couple of points here. If IPL or a similar tournament is called off, will it help the pandemic situation? The alternative is players sit at home in a curfew everybody else. Now, there are helping in some economic activity.

Secondly, such sports events are proof that bio-secure bubbles work. It validates our understanding of the virus and proof that it is not something that works in mysterious ways.

[Kln]

An interesting take on IPL in covid times. Puts things into perspective and fingers the pulse as to why it is jarring to see ultra rich players enjoy their secure bubbles - https://twitter.com/ajit_bhaskar/sta...08212660019203

[poloman]

The biggest congregation of people is to begin from May 2 onwards. I have not seen the SOP for universal adult vaccination anywhere.

It will be idiotic to use hospitals contaminated with virus for this purpose. Govt has to use some well ventilated facilities for this exercise with proper social distancing or you can see a very high blip of new cases due to this.

RWAs, companies etc should also try to vaccinate as many as possible.

[locusjag]

Originally Posted by roy_libran

You are insensitive and better withdraw into that shell you mentioned earlier. Seriously, it's a request with folded hands.

I am not insensitive. But it remains my choice to withdraw into my shell or not. You cannot tell me that, no matter that you're experiencing immense personal tragedies. Please know that - I say this respectfully.

I have lost my father 4 days ago, my mom narrowly survived an oxygen cut off in the hospital while she was in the throes of a Cytokine Storm and came home yesterday. I had to queue up for hours and literally beg officials to allow my father to be cremated because they wouldn't allow his body in due to a technicality - I was alone and on the 12th day of my own recovery. Another person in my family is still fighting it out in the hospital. 7 others in my wife's family are fighting it out at home and we don't have oxygen backup so it's all luck. A lot of my friends and their families are fighting for hospital beds, oxygen and medicines.

With one member of my family being seriously ill in January, we were all shaken. Your situation is just plainly shocking. Hope the situation gets better soon, given all the preparations being made on a war footing. My prayers are with you.

Please Sir, live and prosper in your happy bubble but don't rub it in for those of us who aren't getting through this as easily.

I had people such as a neighbor here in Chennai in mind; they are fear stricken and paralyzed by fear of what might happen for no particular reason. This is all they talk about - the oxygen situation, people dying unattended etc.

While I understand your situation, please know that I am not in some happy bubble, whilst I'm not in a fear stricken bubble either. That's it. No need to attribute any villainous tendencies to me. I'm just a plain clueless guy going about his life, whose only mistake was to comment on this baleful thread.

[Zen2001]

Cumulative confirmed COVID-19 deaths per million people, Apr 25,
2021

https://ourworldindata.org/explorers...e&country=~IND

Americas :

USA: 1728.69
Brazil : 1838.53
Mexico :1667.13
Argentina :1363.93
Several more in Latin America above 1000 deaths per million, I need not mention then all.

Europe :

UK : 1880.82
Spain :1659.53
Portugal :1663.67
Italy : 1972.12
Belgium : 2072.89
France : 1511.67
Hungary : 2756.11
Several more in Europe above 1000 deaths per million, I need not mention then all.

Asia:

Russia : 729.33
Iran : 828.33
India : 139.35

The Indian outlook of doom (which refuses to go away amongst the educated but medically illiterate) is because of a skewed view of absolute numbers (of either cases or deaths) instead of looking at numbers relative to our population. For those who think this amounts to hiding behind statistics, this is not a scheme devised just to make numbers look better - this is how epidemiology works - to get the measure of severity of a disease and implement appropriate strategies accordingly. This is a science and has always been so - no amount of your doom and gloom (or personal unfortunate experience) can change it. Diseases (and scientific studies of the same) do not care for WhatsApp knowledge, news channel Traps and politicians' statements. What you want to be believe is your choice.
Even in absolute numbers, India is approaching 2 lakh deaths whereas results of sero-surveys indicate more than half the population as already infected. No one tells you 65+ crore recovered even without batting an eyelid. No one tells you how many critical patients actually recovered. As Dr @vivek95 pointed out, how many have seen any news channel/other source telling you about recoveries of intubated and ventilated critical patients? How many are showing you thousands of hospitals that have enough oxygen relative to their requirements? Or even surplus? People who have condemned themselves to " imminent doom" based on such one sided information are actually halfway there, and will probably drag a couple more along with them too. So people, choose wisely what you feed your brains on.