[Cessna182]

Originally Posted by hgps

Any course/qualification that i can do while working full time? Thinking about ACCA/US CPA/CFA, while some people are suggesting that data analytics is the future.

Please suggest

I am not from your field but a lot of people I know cleared the CFA while in college. It helps in getting the job but I don't know if it helps experienced professionals like yourself. One thing I can suggest is to explore executive management programs at IIMs after a few more years or the ISB MBA because it can open doors to a wider variety of corporates in India. There are people who do a double degree in management and it is justified these days because concepts change very fast. Going abroad is also an option but except analytics and data science the job prospects are bleak for most programs unless you go for a top ranked university.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by hgps

Thinking about ACCA/US CPA/CFA, while some people are suggesting that data analytics is the future.

My son is doing B.Com Analytics from one of the top 10 University (in commerce) in the country. Even he is coming to realise that almost all people who use the title data scientist or data analysts are really cleaning up the data to feed to the analytical model created by someone with Phd or really top expert. In other words, less than 5% (may be lesser) of folks really do analysis and build models. Rest do clean up and prepare the data.

That means most of the data analysts/scientists are really data washerman or data dhobis.

Then there is the other aspect.

Everyone keeps talking about analytics, while simply preparing same old IMS reports. Instead of saying regression analysis, they call it ML. Even logic based decision trees are called AI. Unless sales people call their product enable via ML/AI, they can't get the customers interested. Once the customers give their requirement, we realise it need doesn't any AI/ML. This has become a vicious loop, like the old USSR trope where employer pretends to pay and employees pretends to work. Here, the customer thinks he needs ML/AI, the vendors pretends to give ML/AI. Everyone is happy.

[VWAllstar]

ITIL or PMP or Both

Hi, I am a FT MBA Grad and currently working as SAP Project Management. I have completed the PDUs for PMP however since my experience is in managing Support Projects, my Delivery Manager is of the opinion to go for an ITIL certification first. I have put a lot of money in my education and with above average returns (salary) however again going ahead for multiple more certifications makes sense?

Regards,
Aditya

[am1m]

I'm looking at a job opportunity that ticks almost all the boxes at this stage in my career, except when it comes to the money. It will mean a pretty significant pay cut (about 40% reduction in the in-hand salary).

First off, I realize how lucky I am to still have a job during these covid times when a lot of people are being laid off and are being forced to take pay cuts anyway and so I hope I'm not coming across as being insensitive with my query. But I really would like the advice of the more experienced and more driven/successful people here.

I've never been a career-oriented chap, to me the job has always been a way to finance my life. I'm an IT guy, mid-career, doing a job that I enjoy and am pretty happy to continue doing this kind of role till I retire. I don't worry about designations and am perfectly happy being an individual contributor, and think I'd make a lousy people manager. Past 10 years have been with the same organization and while everything is going really great, I've just stopped learning anything new for the past 2 years at least. And there is no scope to change roles laterally to explore anything innovative here, I've tried and been told a couple of times that innovation is really not a priority! At my age and career level, it's been pretty hard to even get interview calls and going by the salary data that one of the professional organizations in my field publishes each year, I also know I'm being compensated above market rate (it's one of the only ways my org can retain people, since we're an unknown brand).

My gut feeling tells me to take up this new role, take the pay cut, get out of my comfort zone, get off my butt, take up some additional responsibilities, learn a completely new domain.

But on the other hand, am I being reckless/stupid? The first new reduced payslip is going to feel bad, no two ways about it. Should I just keep my head down in these troubled times and slog along, saving as much as I can? My present org is great in all respects, boring but a great place to be, good management, flexible policies, good teammates, but I know I'll just keep doing the same thing or some variation of it for life, I have colleagues who have been here for 25-30 years doing more or less the same thing!

Financially, I have no debt, no dependents, my spouse works as well, we've been saving pretty constantly for our eventual retirement, so I can afford to take the pay cut.

If you've been kind enough to read my rambling for so long, thank you and any advice (including "hey just appreciate that you have a good thing and shut up!" or "don't be such a wimp, people take far bigger risks, just do it!" ) will be most welcome. Thanks in advance.

EDIT: My bad I didn't go back and read this on the previous page of this thread itself! Good advice:

Originally Posted by Zed

Im in a similar career situation like yours: In search of a career path that motivates me and provides financial security Vs carrying on with a cushy job that has become rather insipid over time. Here are some insights that I can share.

If you are looking to switch to a new domain, especially one that promises a better long term (8-15 years) than your current industry, it absolutely makes sense to endure the short term pain of a paycut or reduced perks.

But remember, if you do take the plunge you have to keep a learning mindset, be open and positive to change especially in situations where you may not be able to control consequential events. Stating the obvious : if your personality type does not feel comfortable with change or not being in control - think twice!

[omzworld]

Originally Posted by am1m

I'm looking at a job opportunity that ticks almost all the boxes at this stage in my career, except when it comes to the money. It will mean a pretty significant pay cut (about 40% reduction in the in-hand salary).
...
If you've been kind enough to read my rambling for so long, thank you and any advice (including "hey just appreciate that you have a good thing and shut up!" or "don't be such a wimp, people take far bigger risks, just do it!" ) will be most welcome. Thanks in advance.

Take the risk and move. Suddenly your company will have a new management, they will look to do something (doesn't matter what) and the easiest thing they will find to do is to let go of people with more experience(higher salary) with less experienced (lower salary). I hope this doesn't actually happen, but I have seen how organizations can get hyper aggressive in short notice and the culture changes. I feel you are taking way more risk staying in current organization and in same role.

[AltoLXI]

In most of the organizations, these will be classic conditions for the HR to bid good bye to the employee.

Originally Posted by am1m

• IT guy
• Mid-career
• Pretty happy to continue doing this kind of role till I retire.
• Don't worry about designations
• Perfectly happy being an individual contributor
• Lousy people manager.
• Past 10 years have been with the same organization
• Stopped learning anything new for the past 2 years at least
• No scope to change roles laterally to explore anything innovative here

and then interestingly

Originally Posted by am1m

• Been told a couple of times that innovation is really not a priority!
• Being compensated above market rate
• Colleagues who have been here for 25-30 years doing more or less the same thing

even when the company is not branded can mean that there is no competition since decades !!

Curious to know what domain are you working in. What prevents your organization from being innovative / hiring freshers in place of senior staff?

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by am1m

I'm looking at a job opportunity that ticks almost all the boxes at this stage in my career, except when it comes to the money. It will mean a pretty significant pay cut (about 40% reduction in the in-hand salary).

It all comes down to your risk appetite. Look back within your career, and check if you have taken many risks. If you have taken many risks and overcame the challenges successfully, then you can do it again.

Otherwise, you are wading into uncharted waters. No one can really tell you whether you should take the jump or not.

[am1m]

Originally Posted by omzworld

Suddenly your company will have a new management, they will look to do something (doesn't matter what) and the easiest thing they will find to do is to let go of people with more experience(higher salary) with less experienced (lower salary).

Absolutely, another thing I am worried about, a possible takeover and cost cutting in this fashion.

Originally Posted by AltoLXI

In most of the organizations, these will be classic conditions for the HR to bid good bye to the employee.

That would be true, but we don't exactly attract great talent. As a matter of fact, right now we have a shortage of 4 positions at my team, so there is some safety in that. And this is a perpetual problem, we're perpetually understaffed. Not many young, bright people show up for interviews at a completely unknown brand/domain. And those that do, are not really hiring material. We've been bridging the gap through internships, but even from there, only a few accept offers once the internship is done and those are not usually the best of the lot.

Originally Posted by AltoLXI

even when the company is not branded can mean that there is no competition since decades !!

Yup, you've put your finger on it, can't reveal too many details for obvious reasons, but this is a very old (by software standards) company with legacy products and legacy clients in the US. The clients are happy and we're happy getting maintenance revenue from them. So there is very little incentive to innovate. As you say no serious competition for decades, that could change soon though. The brand is somewhat reputed in this particular domain the US, but no clients in India and completely unknown here.

Originally Posted by Samurai

It all comes down to your risk appetite. Look back within your career, and check if you have taken many risks.

Good yardstick to think about this, thanks!

[Jaguar]

Originally Posted by am1m

I'm looking at a job opportunity that ticks almost all the boxes at this stage in my career, except when it comes to the money. It will mean a pretty significant pay cut (about 40% reduction in the in-hand salary).

I felt like I was reading my job profile. Before the pandemic hit, I was thinking about taking a pay cut and move back to my hometown. But for now, I have decided to stay put and save up till the covid situation improves or there is a layoff, whichever comes first

My advice is, take the plunge only if the new company and job profile are good. If either of these is not good, then what is the point? I am guessing since it was difficult to even get interview calls (I am in the same boat), you are worried about making a switch at a later point in time. But if you are clear that you are stable from a financial POV and can afford a break in the career if the situation arises, then why worry?

Cross-posting ajmat's post (My experience of getting fired!) from the getting fired thread for some inspiration.

[sunilch]

Originally Posted by am1m

Yup, you've put your finger on it, can't reveal too many details for obvious reasons, but this is a very old (by software standards) company with legacy products and legacy clients in the US. The clients are happy and we're happy getting maintenance revenue from them. So there is very little incentive to innovate. As you say no serious competition for decades, that could change soon though. The brand is somewhat reputed in this particular domain the US, but no clients in India and completely unknown here.

This is a very big risk. This feels like your employer is vulnerable to a sudden disruption. You never know. No matter how satisfied the current clients are with your systems and processes in place. There can be a sudden new system/provider who will disrupt your domain or applications and all of your old clients will just go away suddenly. I am saying this because Software is a very open field with very little barriers to entry. I feel your company has been pure lucky to have been able to survive so long.

And perhaps this is another reason why you don't get fresh faces with savvy technical skills easily to hire (Though I know business and I myself personally doesn't give a damn about what technology it is that we use to solve the business problem at hand).

I am in the same place as you except that I have major financial liabilities and hence my risk appetite is low when it comes to switching domain or skills or making a big move that involves taking a pay cut. I would have wanted to do my own thing. Build my own stuff and chart out my own journey like many on this Forum I keep reading about. But I have commitments and dependencies and so I don't take big risks.

But for you, if you don't have any such limitations - it is better to take this risk and try something new. And it is not late. It is better to take the chance at 35-40 than at 55-60 because you will have to energy to learn the new area/skills. And from what I have experienced so far, you may start at 30-40% lower than your current CTC, but eventually (say in 2-4 years) you will catch-up - barring some major global event such as this ongoing Pandemic.

[headbanger]

Originally Posted by am1m

I'm looking at a job opportunity that ticks almost all the boxes at this stage in my career, except when it comes to the money. It will mean a pretty significant pay cut (about 40% reduction in the in-hand salary).

Firstly, you are not alone in this situation. There are so many who share the same implications. Let's just say that's the way IT spanned across a particular time span.

Secondly, try to plan or at least wish how do you see yourself living a decade or two from now. Talk to your spouse about it.

Thirdly, evaluate your risk appetite. Unfortunately, we have become too result oriented to differentiate success and failure. Failure is your best friend to make you understand your abilities and limitations. Having said that, it's covid time today, so it's a wise decision to duck down till it is firing. So stay in your current profile and protect your family.

We may be the first generation to have two careers. So try to start learning any secondary skill which may act as a bridge when the time comes.

In some ways, IT is like a career in sports. Most of us only have limited time to make money. Where we have faltered is to assume it's parity with how service panned for our earlier generation. Assumptions in a software, if breached, creates chaotic results.

Whatever you opt for, just have a plan B. As they say, expect the best and prepare for the worst. The key to dilemma is preparation.

[Shiftlock]

Hi all,
I am currently in my third year of Btech doing Mechanical Engineering. I joined this field of study because of my passion for all things Automobile and I am coming to realize that now, my interest lies in the Operations management and Project management side of things. I know that Project Management requires a completely different set of skills and I am working towards developing those via online courses.

My confusion lies in what I should do post completion of my Btech degree. I have done some basic research and by now I know that working for 2-3 years before pursuing higher education will be a huge bonus for me but the dilemma for me is that I do not know where or how to start approaching the job market and finding suitable roles that will assist my further interests.

I hope for some guidance from members of this esteemed forum and any sort of advice would be greatly appreciated. (PM's are welcomed)

Regards
Shiftlock

[dark.knight]

Originally Posted by Shiftlock

My confusion lies in what I should do post completion of my Btech degree. I have done some basic research and by now I know that working for 2-3 years before pursuing higher education will be a huge bonus for me but the dilemma for me is that I do not know where or how to start approaching the job market.

For one, do not go anywhere near a software job if your passion is operations, your inclination is natural since it's an extension of mechanical engineering.

For operations you need holistic thinking and a deeply analytical approach to everything you do. You can start by imbibing that philosophy and then approaching production companies for internship, paid or not, if you're lucky you might run into a gig which deals in automobile components but really, any production unit will do as long as volumes are high and production layout is complicated, as it will give you the knowledge to tweak and refine more imperfections in the line. It's a slow and continuous learning curve and it won't come easy but once you're adept at it, there would be no going back.

Start with operations as that'll give you a lot of on the ground experience, project management is more of a white collar job and you'll be stuck with a laptop. Use the mechanical degree, get into the finer aspects of production like machine inspection, tweaking assembly line and work-flow, budgeting etc, that's real practical knowledge, start applying to companies randomly with your resume and also let them know that you do not mind an internship, one should click somewhere.

[ampere]

Originally Posted by Shiftlock

My confusion lies in what I should do post completion of my Btech degree. I have done some basic research and by now I know that working for 2-3 years before pursuing higher education will be a huge bonus for me but the dilemma for me is that I do not know where or how to start approaching the job market and finding suitable roles that will assist my further interests.

My suggestion: Target a solid masters in IE/IM (Inustrial Engg/Industrial Mgmt). NITIE is a very good institute. But note : IE needs GATE based score.

The way pandemic is raging, I suspect most masters program may come through some entrance test and not face to face interviews. So do make sure you score solid is GATE. It basically implies make your BTECH count all four years.

[am1m]

Originally Posted by Jaguar

Cross-posting ajmat's post (My experience of getting fired!) from the getting fired thread for some inspiration.

Yes, had already read this and that was actually a big inspiration.

Originally Posted by sunilch

This is a very big risk. This feels like your employer is vulnerable to a sudden disruption.

It is better to take the chance at 35-40 than at 55-60 because you will have to energy to learn the new area/skills.

Absolutely. Both very good points.

Originally Posted by headbanger

Whatever you opt for, just have a plan B. As they say, expect the best and prepare for the worst.

That's a good point, I will consider that.

Thank you all for all your replies.