[anivy]

Originally Posted by deathwalkr

What was funny was that all the snakes had little chicks (as feed?) but even for small juvenile snakes the chicks were roaming around inside and were making quite the racket.

Most definitely, those chicks were feed. Had the opportunity to see snakes and chicks sharing space in the Vizag Zoo and the way the snakes were popping the chicks was primal. Wish they make the enclosures bigger to let the snakes do some work catching the chicks.

[Dr Alpha]

It wasn’t a surprise anymore seeing threads on topics not even remotely close to automobiles in this forum. That’s how vast this forum is.

Was googling for any devices or solutions to prevent snakes from entering an area and landed here.

The search started as I lost a brave soul (My 11 month old German shepherd - Whisky) to cobra bite a week back. I had 7 dogs (4 different Indian breeds 2 daschunds and a German shepherd) the Indian breeds and daschunds will corner the snakes and not allow them to escape by maintaining a safe distance. They never attack the snakes and wait for us humans to come and take necessary actions. Once they cornered a Russel viper for nearly 45 mins and made continuous noise and alerted us. This is the first encounter for whisky with a snake and the brave soul decided to take the matter into her own hand.

Time for an unpopular opinion.(or is it?)

If snakes are rescued they should be released into a proper reserve forest where chances for human snake conflict is very minimal or held captive in some zoos or snake parks. Certainly not released near small lakes surrounded by housing areas calling the lake as natural habitat for snakes. Even more so if the snakes are poisonous. This is what is happening in the area I’m residing at and there’s a huge rise in snake population which in turn increases human snake conflict. In the past one month more than 15 snakes have been " DEALT WITH " in my street alone and it’s not even monsoon.

Being a doctor I’ve seen lots of lives lost to snake bites from 5 year old child to mother of a 3 months old infant. On average more than 70,000 hospital reported cases die per year in India and if unreported cases in rural areas are taken into account the death will easily cross 1.2 lakh per year according to the health inspector visiting the hospital to collect data on all cases.

So my opinion is rescuing is not the important aspect but releasing it in proper reserved forest (that too disturbs the ecological balance if done overtly) or in snake parks or zoos should be the most important. If that is not possible the snakes should be properly "DEALT WITH". Since we escaped from a horrifying encounter with the snake doesn’t mean it can be rescued and released which puts other peoples life at risk who may not be equally lucky.

If there is any way to prevent snakes from entering an area using any device or spray or solution or by any other means kindly let me know.

TIA

[whitewing]

Losing a dear pet in an untimely manner is hard!

Originally Posted by Dr Alpha

... there’s a huge rise in snake population which in turn increases human snake conflict. In the past one month more than 15 snakes have been " DEALT WITH " in my street alone and it’s not even monsoon.
..

If there is a sudden spurt in the snake population that only means that there is some disruption, either because
- there is an increase in rat population which in turn could be due to access to some place near by place where food is being dumped at a regular basis. Or frog population due to a nearby swampy area with interconnected drains.
OR
- there is some development activity in your neighborhood like conversion of fields into housing sites etc. which could be causing displacement in your area.

Unless the root cause is eliminated, one would not be able to prevent the odd visits.

My elders used to tell that marigold/lemongrass/(another medicinal plant that had a very bitter taste with waxy leaves, I can't recollect the name) repel snakes. Although I must say that in spite of these being planted in my uncle's farm, they still used to get an occasional visit. The claim was that planting these plants had reduced the frequency of intrusions.

[fhdowntheline]

The society premises where I stay has had some mongoose families resident for a long time. We used to have civets but somehow dont seem them anymore. We have had snakes occasionally, but perhaps the presence of mongooses may keep a check.

[deathwalkr]

Originally Posted by Dr Alpha

The search started as I lost a brave soul (My 11 month old German shepherd - Whisky) to cobra bite a week back.

Sorry for your loss. Speaking from experience (of watching snakes in the city tv show) the snake catcher couple really get worried when dogs are around as they can poke their nose in and might result in fatality which no one wants.

When it's human life in danger now or in future, venomous snakes are mostly killed especially in areas where healthcare is not very accessible.

We have mice, cats, rat snakes and mongooses (mongeese?) roaming around our garden at home. Saw a rat snake slither close by me and climb up a jackfruit tree the other day and man oh man did I almost have a heart attack!

A few weeks before that, our security alerted us to a snake behind a cement tank. It was just chilling in the cool shade between the tank and the wall. Shined a torch and saw it was a rat snake, so just let it be

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by Dr Alpha

If there is any way to prevent snakes from entering an area using any device or spray or solution or by any other means kindly let me know.

I know very little about snakes, but I have heard that they cannot make it more than two feet up a vertical, featureless wall. We think that snakes coming to our sub-urban garden have been helped by people piling wood, etc, against the compound wall. So one needs to be sure that people do not do this.

The only time we've had a snake captured by a catcher, he put it in a cotton bag, and when we asked what he would do with it, he said he would take it to his village and release it in forest. To release a dangerous snake in urban parkland seems to me to be unforgivably irresponsible.

Can the knowledgable please confirm how high a wall has to be, and how far from branches, etc, from which a snake could reach.

[Dr Alpha]

Originally Posted by whitewing

My elders used to tell that marigold/lemongrass/(another medicinal plant that had a very bitter taste with waxy leaves, I can't recollect the name) repel snakes. Although I must say that in spite of these being planted in my uncle's farm, they still used to get an occasional visit. The claim was that planting these plants had reduced the frequency of intrusions.

Will definitely try the lemon grass and marigold. Regarding the medicinal plant with bitter taste, I’ve planted it and unfortunately found a snake on the plant itself once

Originally Posted by fhdowntheline

The society premises where I stay has had some mongoose families resident for a long time. We used to have civets but somehow dont seem them anymore. We have had snakes occasionally, but perhaps the presence of mongooses may keep a check.

mongoose will be of great help to keep the snake away and to even reduce their population but the problem is to get one to come and make my place it’s home with lots of dogs around

Originally Posted by deathwalkr

Sorry for your loss. the snake catcher couple really get worried when dogs are around as they can poke their nose in and might result in fatality which no one wants.


We have mice, cats, rat snakes and mongooses (mongeese?) roaming around our garden at home. Saw a rat snake slither close by me and climb up a jackfruit tree the other day and man oh man did I almost have a heart attack!

A few weeks before that, our security alerted us to a snake behind a cement tank. It was just chilling in the cool shade between the tank and the wall. Shined a torch and saw it was a rat snake, so just let it be

I think Indian breeds are genetically wired to maintain a safe distance from snakes where as the foreign breeds are the ones getting curious and trying to catch the snake. There used to be a Doberman and a couple of Indian pariah at my uncles house adjoining to our home. Even same thing happened there indian pariahs maintained their distance but the Doberman lost its life

It’s very easy to identify a rat snake from a cobra. Cobras when disturbed will stand their ground and display aggressive instincts and make hissing noise whereas the rat snake will be as fast as lightning and disappear within second

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

I know very little about snakes, but I have heard that they cannot make it more than two feet up a vertical, featureless wall. We think that snakes coming to our sub-urban garden have been helped by people piling wood, etc, against the compound wall. So one needs to be sure that people do not do this.

The only time we've had a snake captured by a catcher, he put it in a cotton bag, and when we asked what he would do with it, he said he would take it to his village and release it in forest. To release a dangerous snake in urban parkland seems to me to be unforgivably irresponsible.

Can the knowledgable please confirm how high a wall has to be, and how far from branches, etc, from which a snake could reach.

Not all snakes can stand. Cobras and kraits (elapidaes) can stand up to 3/4 of their height with the remaining 1/3 on the ground. I’ve personally witnessed it while a person poked and held a snake with a spear standing on a compound wall the cobra stood around 3-4 feet and tried to bite that person.

[deepak_misra]

I am miles away from being an expert but had an experience in our apartment in Murgeshpalya/Bangalore many years back when a cobra was spotted and took refuge in a scooter wheel pit. A young boy who was the snake catcher took around half hour to remove the wheel and extricate the snake and put it to a cotton bag. He did not mention where he would release it but just said that he would take care. He did mention that it is not an oddity at all to have snakes including venomous ones around most residential areas and it is just that we dont see them. The number of snakes was a function of the open garbage and I dont know the situation now but it seems that every apartment does spot snakes once in a while which means they very much coexist with us. In passing the boy mentioned that he gets more scared of humans than snakes

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

To release a dangerous snake in urban parkland seems to me to be unforgivably irresponsible.
.

Originally Posted by Dr Alpha

Time for an unpopular opinion.(or is it?)

If snakes are rescued they should be released into a proper reserve forest where chances for human snake conflict is very minimal or held captive in some zoos or snake parks.

So my opinion is rescuing is not the important aspect but releasing it in proper reserved forest (that too disturbs the ecological balance if done overtly) or in snake parks or zoos should be the most important. If that is not possible the snakes should be properly "DEALT WITH". Since we escaped from a horrifying encounter with the snake doesn’t mean it can be rescued and released which puts other peoples life at risk who may not be equally lucky.



TIA

I had a conversation once with one of India's best known herpetologist (not naming him since I don't have his permission to do so) and we were talking about releasing snakes in forests. According to him releasing a snake in the wild like forest will surely get it into a territorial fight with other snakes and get killed. As per him, just release it nearby. Note that I am just relaying this conversation without editorial comment. The subject is a complex one and there is no easy solution. In my parents house in Bhubaneshwar, there were a couple of cobras and also 4 mongoose. We have not seen snakes since some time so looks like the mongoose claimed the territory. My point was that all coexisted for quite some time and my parents and the staff were never perturbed by the snakes. I have seen them a couple of times but they normally slithered away at full speed as soon as they sensed us from far off.

ON another note, do note that "dealing with snakes" can lead to imprisonment and fine since snakes are protected under wildlife laws. This of-course depends on how you deal with them.

Ending this reply with some Bhubaneshwar news from today on this subject
https://www.news18.com/buzz/bhubanes...t-7300009.html

[fhdowntheline]

Interesting how we talk about dealing with snakes as a matter of a deliberate act. As it is the poor fellows get killed by our vehicles, our incessant land grab turning pristine forests into concrete heat islands. Let us leave some species alone for goodness sake. They haven't come to our environment, its the other way around. Nature has a way of restoring balance. We need to be humble and conscious of this fact at all times.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by fhdowntheline

We need to be humble and conscious of this fact at all times.

Indeed. A handyman who works for us has only one word when it comes to snakes: Kill. I forbid it.

[d.w.w.]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Can the knowledgable please confirm how high a wall has to be, and how far from branches, etc, from which a snake could reach.

There is a program on Kaumudi TV (Malayalam regional channel) where a famous snake catcher Vava Suresh goes to houses where snake sightings are reported and catch them. The program is also available in YouTube (I guess the program is called Snakemaster). He goes around the house and explains how the snakes come to the house and what can be done to prevent it. Only problem is the whole thing is in Malayalam. If you have someone around who is comfortable with Malayalam, you can get it translated

[Dr Alpha]

Originally Posted by deepak_misra

1) had an experience in our apartment in Murgeshpalya/Bangalore many years back when a cobra was spotted and took refuge in a scooter wheel pit. A young boy who was the snake catcher took around half hour to remove the wheel and extricate the snake and put it to a cotton bag. He did not mention where he would release it but just said that he would take care.

2)In passing the boy mentioned that he gets more scared of humans than snakes

3)According to him releasing a snake in the wild like forest will surely get it into a territorial fight with other snakes and get killed. As per him, just release it nearby.

1) By gods grace no one was harmed. But take a minute and think what would have happened if no one saw the snake in the wheel and the owner started the vehicle and something untoward happened??
Releasing the snake in nearby areas was what he mentioned as "he would take care"

2) Well even the worst of humans are referred to as snakes and that’s not without a reason

3) So according to him territorial fight among snakes should be handled carefully and releasing it nearby and endangering other peoples life is the better way to handle the problem?? I get it that some people want to protect the snakes but releasing them in nearby areas is not the way to do that.

Originally Posted by fhdowntheline

Interesting how we talk about dealing with snakes as a matter of a deliberate act. As it is the poor fellows get killed by our vehicles, our incessant land grab turning pristine forests into concrete heat islands. Let us leave some species alone for goodness sake. They haven't come to our environment, its the other way around. Nature has a way of restoring balance. We need to be humble and conscious of this fact at all times.

To be clear I’m no where near a forest. The environment which you suggest that I’ve intruded into is where my family is living for more than 6 generation. By stating nature has a way to restore balance are you trying to suggest that imbalance of human and snake population justifies the snakebite deaths?? If that’s what you are suggesting sorry my friend i don’t want to be humble and conscious enough of that fact

I’m pretty sure most of the people advocating that a snakes life takes precedence over a human life has easy access to ASV(anti snake venom) and hospitals with ICU and dialysis setup ( by the way both are very important for treating snake bites, even after recovery there are high chances for significant kidney damage ) within a couple of minutes and more importantly can afford the bill which run into few lakhs even in a moderately good hospital.
Most of these people doesn’t take steps out of their house constantly fearing for snakes on a daily basis fearing for their lives and their dear ones.

[deepak_misra]

Originally Posted by Dr Alpha

1) By gods grace no one was harmed. But take a minute and think what would have happened if no one saw the snake in the wheel and the owner started the vehicle and something untoward happened??


3) So according to him territorial fight among snakes should be handled carefully and releasing it nearby and endangering other peoples life is the better way to handle the problem?? I get it that some people want to protect the snakes but releasing them in nearby areas is not the way to do that.


.

For the record

1) The snake went into the wheel panicking on seeing the people. Else it would have slithered away to its abode wherever it was

3) He did not in any way suggest endangering any people. He just said that if you are in snake territory you need to take basic precautions and the risk minimizes. I am talking about urban settings and not say in agricultural areas where the risk is much more.

The problem is not an easy one to solve, but killing snakes is not the solution

[Latheesh]

Spotted this dead one in our backyard. Killed by a terror cat in our neighborhood. Actually he was resting on the dead snake after killing it.

[Rocky_Balboa]

Originally Posted by Latheesh

Spotted this dead one in our backyard. Killed by a terror cat in our neighborhood. Actually he was resting on the dead snake after killing it.

Isnt this the bronzeback tree snake; can never understand cat's fetish with snakes (now I know, why we say "curiosity killed the cat")