[AdiSolEn]

Originally Posted by GTO

Go ahead and test-drive the Ford Endeavour 3.2 & Skoda Kodiaq. Both of them are the segment best. One is a brute SUV, the other a sophisticated Crossover. You can't go wrong with either. Test-drive both, read our official reviews and choose based on whichever you like more.

Thanks a lot! I will check out both the vehicles. Infact I was planning on checking out the Kodiaq this week. Let me see how it goes!

Originally Posted by landcruiser123

If you are okay with a 2WD, I'd pick the Innova Crysta 2.8. There are not too many cars with a comfortable second row. I'm not sure any of the crossovers might be able to satisfy your need for space. The Innova should be better to drive than the bulky Isuzus, Fortuner and Endeavour.

If 4WD is an absolute must, I'm sure the 3.2 L Ford Endeavour is better than the Fortuner. Nothing wrong with the latter, but the former is slightly better.

Thanks for the feedback. One of the ideas playing around in the head is the same, that since moving more people is one of the basic requirements, I can stick to the Hexa or Innova, and the money saved as a result can be used to buy a Jimny when it is launched

Originally Posted by ruzbehxyz

The Ford endeavour is definitely the better one and value for money vehicle. The features and ride comfort are far better than Fortuner.
What you are paying for Fortuner and Toyota cars like Innova is a big premium, at least a few lakhs more. The service costs are very low but you have already paid a premium in the start. In case of Endeavour it is competitively priced and the services are very cheap for the beast. Please see online costs for service. Abroad where the market is different, the Endeavour or Everest is far more expensive than Fortuner and is compared to Land cruiser.
Ford India has also gone ahead with quality service and are very strict with their service centres. The Endeavour definitely wins the battle here.

Thanks. I have asked the Toyota dealer and VW dealer to send the scheduled service cost breakup till 100000 Km. I will get the same from Ford and Skoda as well. Should give a much more clear picture after that.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

You have listed a lot of requirements

I feel your best bet will be to stick with the likes of Kodiaq or VW Tiguan rather then Fortuner or Endeavour. Innova is a very comfortable, best choice if you are being chauffered mostly.

However, if you can wait as you have mentioned, the Honda CRV can be the one that should tick most of the boxes in my opinion.

Thanks a lot Sir! However, the urge for a proper 4X4 is quite strong. My dad used to love the desert rides in his Pajero during his time in the middle east, and hence if there is a chance of getting a proper 4X4 within the budget and ticking most of the boxes, he would give a priority to that. I have seen your post on this thread regarding picking up a Fortuner after having used the Endeavour. Can you throw some more light on what made you decide on this course of action?

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by AdiSolEn

However, the urge for a proper 4X4 is quite strong. My dad used to love the desert rides in his Pajero during his time in the middle east, and hence if there is a chance of getting a proper 4X4 within the budget and ticking most of the boxes, he would give a priority to that. I have seen your post on this thread regarding picking up a Fortuner after having used the Endeavour. Can you throw some more light on what made you decide on this course of action?

Well, in that case, I am afraid, there is no proper SUV that will come close to your budget or even at twice of that. Fortuner & Endeavour are built on ladder-frame chassis and rear seat comfort on both is very bad. From my personal experience, I will sit on a Fortuner middle row over the Endeavour though if that helps. If you need a proper 4x4 and want to take your family in all the comforts, I am yet to find anything other then LC-200 without sacrificing something or the other. But then even with LC-200 there will be umpteen issues.

I have asked the Toyota dealer and VW dealer to send the scheduled service cost breakup till 100000 Km. I will get the same from Ford and Skoda as well. Should give a much more clear picture after that

Nothing will beat Toyota, period.. One of my old Endy where I missed taking Extended warranty had an AC failure and the estimate is over a Lac. At this time my colleague who is using the car has got the Gas refilled. Will know soon if that holds up.

10. 4X4 is not a must-have, but is preferred. Order of preference for it is proper 4X4 with low range>AWD.

You will need to prioritise your requirements and then compromise on the least. But if you like Kodiaq then no harm in waiting for CRV either, they should have an AWD.

Regarding my shift from Endy to Fortuner, you can just ignore it for any meaningful reasons. Maybe I have some sort of disorder or am yet to find something suitable that meets all of my needs which actually are not very different from yours, just that we don't have any SUV that delivers all. Prado with Air Suspension would have been the ideal had Toyota considered for building here as CKD but at 90 + Lac with old generation engine & 5-speed gearbox

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Regarding my shift from Endy to Fortuner, you can just ignore it for any meaningful reasons. Maybe I have some sort of disorder or am yet to find something suitable that meets all of my needs which actually are not very different from yours,

How is the change over going? Which aspects of the change you enjoy and which ones you long for?

[AdiSolEn]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Well, in that case, I am afraid, there is no proper SUV that will come close to your budget or even at twice of that. Fortuner & Endeavour are built on ladder-frame chassis and rear seat comfort on both is very bad. From my personal experience, I will sit on a Fortuner middle row over the Endeavour though if that helps. If you need a proper 4x4 and want to take your family in all the comforts, I am yet to find anything other then LC-200 without sacrificing something or the other. But then even with LC-200 there will be umpteen issues.

I agree. But the LC 200 is simply way overpriced in India. I am also aware that some or the other compromise is required from my end, however, I feel that if I can get a manual transmission now, it is better as after 7-8 years we will be forced to drive automatics as it is

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Nothing will beat Toyota, period.. One of my old Endy where I missed taking Extended warranty had an AC failure and the estimate is over a Lac. At this time my colleague who is using the car has got the Gas refilled. Will know soon if that holds up.

This is one of my major concerns regarding Ford, Skoda, VW as well. Though they offer really amazing experiences, if something goes wrong outside of warranty, then you are looking at steep bills for sure.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

You will need to prioritise your requirements and then compromise on the least. But if you like Kodiaq then no harm in waiting for CRV either, they should have an AWD.

Regarding my shift from Endy to Fortuner, you can just ignore it for any meaningful reasons. Maybe I have some sort of disorder or am yet to find something suitable that meets all of my needs which actually are not very different from yours, just that we don't have any SUV that delivers all. Prado with Air Suspension would have been the ideal had Toyota considered for building here as CKD but at 90 + Lac with old generation engine & 5-speed gearbox

Thanks again for the advice. I will check out the Kodiaq as well and can surely wait for the CRV if I like the Kodiaq. Also, I will definitely see which requirement can be compromised on and then do a comparison of the choices.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by Sheel

How is the change over going? Which aspects of the change you enjoy and which ones you long for?

I could not drive the Fortuner for a while as was away, maybe I am repeating my initial views, I find Toyota to be better built. Though much less equipped, whatever they have given seems to be of better quality mostly, like the quality of switches or leather and even the plastics. Both have their own advantages and disadvantages but if I have to buy one again then it will be a Fortuner (Just don't ask why am I writing this) I will say, the suspension on Fortuner, especially on the middle row, is little better over Endeavour. Auto Gearbox of the Endeavour is definitely better over Fortuner. The engine also sounds sweeter (3,2 ltr) over the relatively crude Fortuner but it's not something that will turn you off.

The peace of mind that comes with Toyota is something that I am now unwilling to trade off with features or other fancy stuff but that's strictly me.

This will/ may not hold good for anyone else looking to buy something in this segment.

Originally Posted by AdiSolEn

the LC 200 is simply way overpriced in India.

It is actually overpriced in every part of the world just that one country is cheaper or expensive than the other due to duties. If you check the reviews in any country, everyone complains about the prices. So even though its 80,000 USD in the States, thanks to import duties and GST it becomes 1,4 Cr here and then about 10 % extra on road tax etc.

[AdiSolEn]

Hello everyone! Just a short update from my side. The search continues. The story now has changed a bit, as the Fortuner has been ruled out by the high command, due to its ride and NVH. I have also decided to accept her choice as ultimately the comfort of the family is also of paramount importance when deciding the vehicle!

Now, I have manged to get the test drive of the Innova manual and Hexa manual versions. The Innova was a pleasant surprise when it comes to performance! I never expected such a huge people mover to pull so effortlessly. I was absolutely amazed at its performance. However, they should have provided a 6th gear for sure. Also, the NVH left me a little disappointed. Otherwise full marks to it for space, comfort and performance.

I was a little disappointed with the TD vehice of the Hexa though. There was a lot of noise coming into the cabin (must be an issue with that vehicle for sure). Also, the ergonomics were a let down. I am planning to take another Test drive from Concorde motors (earlier was from Bafna motors) just to make sure that my impressions in the first drive were correct or misplaced!

I also test drove the Kodiaq. It is a fantastic vehicle for sure. But it is definitely going over my budget. The Skoda guys are not willing to offer any discounts other than whatever promotional scheme may be going on! Also, loyalty bonus being offered is a paltry 40,000/-. So much for owning a Skoda for 10 years! Also, the main point that I feel is that the only advantage it offers over the Tiguan is 3rd row of seats. But to pay almost 10 Lacs more for that does not make sense to me. Please correct me if anyone feels that I am mistaken on this.

I have also test driven the Jeep Compass yesterday. While it is amazing to drive, the observation from the wifey is that the rear seat is too upright, and might prove uncomfortable over long distances. Also, the seats cannot be reclined. When I was sitting in the back seat however, I did not feel the seat to be too upright. Can anyone throw some light from their experiences about this point? However, with the Limited Plus variant, I am willing to give it a serious look, as I will be getting better features like Panoramic sunroof, power adjustable driver seat etc. on a vehicle with a manual transmission and fantastic engine and dynamics!

All this while, the VW team has been patiently following up. I am unwilling to rule out the Tiguan, because honestly I just loved it when I took a drive in it. Also, from recent posts on our forum, there are substantial discounts being offered, and fellow members have reported picking up Highline versions for around 31-32 Lacs on road. For this price, I am definitely willing to give this a serious thought!

Hence, I think that I can narrow my search now to the Tiguan, Compass limited plus, Innova Crysta manual (for the space and 6/7 seats and the money that I can save)and if ergonomic and NVH does not seem an issue, then the Hexa as well (lot of money saved + I still get a decent AWD setup and I can consider another smaller fun to drive car as well ).

Ohh, and before all of you say that please TD the Endeavour, the folks at Dhone Ford in Pune have not been able to arrange a test drive for me for the last 1 month, inspite of asking them 3 times. And the best part is that I have twice received calls from their showroom asking me whether I liked my test drive and the vehicle. Good job Dhone Ford, you guys are just awesome

Also Mods, please move this post to another relevant thread if this does not belong in this thread anymore, as the Fortuner has been ruled out for sure!

[JKBKS]

Originally Posted by AdiSolEn

Now, I have manged to get the test drive of the Innova manual and Hexa manual versions

I think it will be a good idea to wait for the launch of Honda CRV, Isuzu MUX (international version coming with new engines) and Mahindra XUV 700 (formerly Rexton) before you finally decide. Their video reviews are also available online, i think to give you an idea about them.

All these are coming next month (October)

[Sahil]

If you loved the Tiguan, my hunch is you will love the new CRV more. Seems like your best bet and you could also consider the petrol if you don’t need 7 seats. This model will be most bang for the bunk.
I too am replacing my Fortuner with the CRV petrol as it fits my needs without the added bulk and SUV harshness of the Fortuner.

[AdiSolEn]

Originally Posted by JKBKS

I think it will be a good idea to wait for the launch of Honda CRV, Isuzu MUX (international version coming with new engines) and Mahindra XUV 700 (formerly Rexton) before you finally decide. Their video reviews are also available online, i think to give you an idea about them.

All these are coming next month (October)

Thank you. Yes, but for the MUX, I think the updates will only be cosmetic. I definitely plant to wait for the new launches before deciding!

Originally Posted by Sahil

If you loved the Tiguan, my hunch is you will love the new CRV more. Seems like your best bet and you could also consider the petrol if you don’t need 7 seats. This model will be most bang for the bunk.
I too am replacing my Fortuner with the CRV petrol as it fits my needs without the added bulk and SUV harshness of the Fortuner.

7 seats are a bonus for sure. However, I will take the test drive for the CRV. But the engine output figure has definitely put me off. But I will comment only after the TD.

Also, I saw the Compass limited plus today in the flesh, and it is not upto the mark for sure if you compare the interiors to the Tiguan (two different segments, but the OTR for the limited plus is 28 Lacs in Pune, hence it is not very far off from the Tiguan if you consider the discounts). Also, the headroom has been compromised due to the sunroof.Hence, will definitely wait for the new launches. One thing is for sure, the new launches coupled with the festive season can only mean more discounts for me

[artemis_fowl]

Voted for the Endeavour!
To me, it looks like the most VFM offering in this segment. It appeals to both the heart and head. As simple as that! If only Fortuner offered it at a lower price, spruced up the interiors a bit and improved the ride (have personally observed it- it’s really not expected after plonking 3 million on the car), they would have had a customer for sure. But it has better reliability, and I’m a sucker for reliability, good service and A.S.Smand for that reason alone I would not mind buying it over the Endeavour.

[navpreet318]

Yesterday I test drove both the Endeavour and Furtuner back to back. This was Round 1 of the TDs. More to follow.
Endeavour:
1.Uncomfortable driving seat. Had a upper backache.
2.Low speed driving in traffic is bad. The vehicle hunts for gears. Have to modulate the throttle a lot leading to leg fatigue.
3.Steering is too light. Feel of the road gets amiss.
4. Very plush ride. Now this has a downside as experienced when driving the Fortuner
5. Loaded over the top with features.

Fortuner
1. Felt at home in the seat. The sides hug very nice and it was very comfy to sit in.
2. Very relaxed at low speeds. No gear hunting. The foot was at ease. And moreover the feel is very direct. Feels much faster than the Endy. Very quick gearbox. Tried both eco and power modes. Both did their jobs well.
3. The steering is heavier. Leading to better control and feel of the road.
4. Suspension is firmer. Downside is a firmer ride. Upside is this is tremendously confident at high speed stability. It begs to be driven fast. Went fast on a curved flyover and changed lanes subsequently to overtake much to the fright of the executive. Nothing. Perfect disciplined handling. Less Body roll.
5. Feels literally a robbery in terms of features. Has the very basic of features.

Round one done.

Endy has upper hand on features and a perceived plush ride.
Fortuner has a bigger upper hand on driver comfort.

Weird but true.
Now more rounds to follow along with wife to gauge her comfort levels as well.
It has to be remembered that I come from driving a Storme 400 4x4 daily. So heavy steering and a perfect balance of plush and firm ride is my experience.

I went into this expecting the Endeavour to come on top as driving appeal and driver comfort. Came out tired.

More TDs to follow but I'm actually disappointed a bit. I love the features on the Endeavour but they would mean nothing in front of driving comfort when putting down my money.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by navpreet318

This was Round 1 of the TDs. More to follow.
Endeavour:
1.Uncomfortable driving seat. Had a upper backache.
2.Low speed driving in traffic is bad. The vehicle hunts for gears. Have to modulate the throttle a lot leading to leg fatigue.
3.Steering is too light. Feel of the road gets amiss.

Few things from my own experience having owned both, Endeavour gearbox has some learning thing. If it is used mostly in city traffic, your observations will be correct, but when you drive it on highways, it behaves differently. Best will be to ask Dealership to let you take the car on an extended drive, say around 30-50 Km on the Highway. Toyota driver seats are tiny, am not aware of your built but most people complain about lack of thigh support on Toyota Driver seats- the world over. Perhaps, the extended test drive will change your opinion. The light steering feel, coming from Safari, I can understand give it a little time, you should start enjoying, it gets tight on higher speeds.

Fortuner
It begs to be driven fast. Went fast on a curved flyover and changed lanes subsequently to overtake much to the fright of the executive. Nothing. Perfect disciplined handling. Less Body roll.

Again, I have found Endeavour handling better & less body roll, maybe something to do with the tyres? MRF ones are terrible, switch over to Yoko or something else. If you are not sure, take mine for a drive whenever you are at Chandigarh.

[navpreet318]

Thats precisely why I have mentioned that this is Round 1 of the test drives. I intend to take more TDs.
I have a feeling which was also mentioned by GTO in the New Endeavour thread that the suspension of the new Endeavour has been softened at the cost of highway stability. Maybe that is what is registered by me in the above TD feedback.

Since this is my daily drive with 1 or 2 highway excursions in a month I have to give a lot of importance to traffic driving behavior of both cars.
Yes the Endeavour has a large seat but i found it lacking lumber support even at full push of the lumber support lever.
I found the fortuner seat side bolsters hugging my body better. I am a fairly large build built punjabi at 5'11" weighing over 100KG and broad. Yet I was comfy in the fortuner.
I'm all in for the Endeavour and would give it a couple of more chances too but truly dissapointed as I was expecting to immediately fall in love with the Endeavour but instead fell in love with the simple manner of the fortuner. No nonsense plain good drive.

These TDs were a good 1 hour TD spread across the town. Next it will include a little bit of highway, a little mountain road and some bad roads too.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by navpreet318

I was expecting to immediately fall in love with the Endeavour but instead fell in love with the simple manner of the fortuner. No nonsense plain good drive.

It is, there is a reason why this thread and Fortuner/ Endeavour thread runs into pages, many guys are not able to decide what to pick. Contrary to popular views, I find the quality of switchgear/ leather better on the Fortuner, everything looks built to last but when I look at my Endeavour which has done 97 K, it looks as good as new.

It's very tough to choose between these two and you cannot go wrong with either. You should buy whatever ticks most of your requirements.

All the best

[lancerlover]

Originally Posted by navpreet318

Yesterday I test drove both the Endeavour and Furtuner back to back. This was Round 1 of the TDs. More to follow.

I went into this expecting the Endeavour to come on top as driving appeal and driver comfort. Came out tired.

More TDs to follow but I'm actually disappointed a bit. I love the features on the Endeavour but they would mean nothing in front of driving comfort when putting down my money.

Hi Navpreet,

Your observations are very similar to mine, you can read my detailed views here:

https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offic...ml#post4468585 (Toyota Fortuner : Official Review)

I feel, when it comes to the basics/fundamentals like space, drive ability & ergonomics, the Fortuner beats the Endeavour by a huge margin but
if you put features over the basics, the Endeavor appears to be ahead & feels a bit closer (as a package) to the asking price.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

Few things from my own experience having owned both, Endeavour gearbox has some learning thing. If it is used mostly in city traffic, your observations will be correct, but when you drive it on highways, it behaves differently. Best will be to ask Dealership to let you take the car on an extended drive, say around 30-50 Km on the Highway. Toyota driver seats are tiny, am not aware of your built but most people complain about lack of thigh support on Toyota Driver seats- the world over. Perhaps, the extended test drive will change your opinion. The light steering feel, coming from Safari, I can understand give it a little time, you should start enjoying, it gets tight on higher speeds.

Again, I have found Endeavour handling better & less body roll, maybe something to do with the tyres? MRF ones are terrible, switch over to Yoko or something else. If you are not sure, take mine for a drive whenever you are at Chandigarh.

Sir, while the Endeavour is fantastic on the open roads & highways, it really sucks in the traffic. I remember the first time I drove one in the city it almost felt as if the particular car had some gearbox issue, I tested 2 other Endeavours the same day to conclude that the unnecessary revving and hunting is a characteristic not a defect.

The hard steering on the Fortuner is again something that felt/feels more connected & safer on the highway runs.

About the body roll & highway manners part, I could not find any perceivable difference between the two on the test drives I did on the smooth access controlled highway in Faridabad but I have always felt that the Fortuner would/should be better in this regard owing to its the stiffer suspension setup & firm seats. While it feels a little unsettled & bumpy at slow speeds, it is nothing less than a revelation on the highways, specially on the undulating & unleveled road surfaces we encounter on the under construction sections like the Sonepat to karnal road on the Delhi Chandigarh highway. As I haven't driven the Endeavor on such sections it wouldn't be fair to agree or disagree with your observation on the topic.

Thoroughly test driving both is the only way to find out which suits you better and as you go forward please share your observations regarding:

- The middle row - space, ride quality & seating comfort.
- Accessing/using the last row.
- Ergonomics - operating the air con & sound system while driving.
- The Availability & Pricing of extended warranty packages for both.