[satyabratpanda]

I own a SX4 ZXi VVT purchased in Dec 2009 and now having 15800 odd kms on the odo. and am writing to you to seek some help related to my car. I have been having a really hard time, and am not getting any sort of resolution or support from the dealership or Maruti, so my intention behind writing to you is to seek your advice and help on how to resolve the issues I am facing.
Background:
1) After the third service I have switched to Castrol Edge Synthetic engine oil.
2) Always using Shell normal or Shell Premium petrol, except for long trips where Shell isn't available.
3) Using nitrogen in all 5 tyres with exact psi as mentioned on the manual.

Problems:
1) Shortly after the third service, I noticed the idling speed was always fluctuating, irrespective of whether the AC was on or off. I bore this for almost 7 months, as after the first check, the dealer and the Maruti engineer said they could not find anything abnormal. I again highlighted this after 15 days. This time they disconnected all couplers, cleaned and reconnected, but to no avail. Only in Oct 2011, when I really got angry with them and asked them to sort it out or else, they replaced a solenoid related to the engine oil pump and the fluctuation has disappeared thereafter. But the pickup seems to have deteriorated after this.
2) After the 3rd service, the vehicle does not feel as zippy as before, when you accelerate, it seems as if an old engine is being pushed to its limits. Prior to this, the vehicle used to maintain a good idle speed even after reaching operating temperature, and could smoothly coast without throttle in 1st and 2nd gears, and beautifully at 40 kmph in 5th gear. After the third service, this has also changed, even in 1st gear, when you release the throttle completely, the vehicle feels as if it is being pulled back. - Mentioned this to the dealaer several time and requested (a) - they clean the fuel tank and injectors, and decarbonise the engine, (b) replace the plugs and the air filter, (c) recalibrate the throttle sensor, and (d) check if the valves are sticking. They negated all except the changing of the air filter, and mention their diagnostic console does not show anything untoward and hence the other steps aren't required. Maruti engineer seconds the dealer's opinion, but neither can tell me why my vehicle's pickup has dropped. (They say it hasn't dropped, it is normal ).
3) Again, after the third service, after 2-3 months of usage, the clutch pedal becomes hard, and there is a consistent shudder, when releasing clutch in 1st gear without throttle. Every time I complain of this, they do a bleeding of the hydraulic system, and then for the next 2-3 months, the clutch comes back to normal, and thereafter it is again back to square one. Also, when the clutch is released in 1st gear without throttle, the rpm dips to nearly 550 or 500. To overtake, even at a speed of 40 kmph, it isnt sufficient any longer to shift down to 3rd. It takes an eternity to build up speed, the first part of the throttle pedal travel towards the floor seems dead. This definitely wasnt the behaviour of the vehicle until the third service.
4) A month back, they have replaced the left side drive shaft as I pointed out it was making noise while turning. Once they did that, I asked if they had balanced and aligned the wheels, and they said it wasn't required as the same was carried out maybe 4-6 weeks back. Nevertheless, after that the power steering has become really tight and difficult to use. I of course am not expecting the steering to be as light as that on a City, but having driven other SX4 VVT ZXI Manuals of the same age and approx, same mileage covered, I feel the one on my vehicle is abnormally tight.
My concern is that something is wrong with the vehicle, as it definitely did not exhibit all these symptoms until about 7000 kms on the odo. I am however, silenced by the fact that the Maruti folks say their diagnotstic console shows nothing untoward, and hence they feel the vehicle is normal. I have requested the Maruti engineer to test the vehicle as well, and he also agrees with the dealer's opinion.
Do you agree my concerns are valid? If you would want to substantiate my claims, I shall be more than happy if someone from your team would like to test out my vehicle. If yes, please help me by suggesting what I should ask the dealer to do to sort out the issues on my vehicle, and in the eventuality oftheir refusing to do so using their same old plea, what option do I have? Can I request your medium to help me get this sorted out? I have been rueing the day I purchased this vehicle, as I have completely lost my peace of mind because of these niggling issues. My worry and agony are accentuated by the fact that this vehicle has such poor resale value.
Grateful for any help you can extend to help me get this sorted out.

[S5157]

Where did you get the vehicle service? Get the vehicle checked by a different service center if not already done.

[JustCause]

Driveshaft gone at <15K, Clutch shudder, Idle problems, subsequent low pickup points to a defect in the manufacturing. Please tell me that you took 3rd year extended warranty.

Please get these looked at

Throttle position Sensor, as you report a dead range.

Steering could've been 'tightened' when they changed driveshaft. It can be brought to normal by doing a minor adjustment at the workshop(I don't remember the exact part name). Just tell them to loosen it up a bit.

Was the Synthetic oil of the correct grade? 0W40 is normally available at workshops. Check online if SX4 is okay with this.

Did you complain of 'Mileage'? If so, they might have made stupid 'adjustments' that are sapping you of power.

Normally, when warranty is over, you are presented with a long list of to-be-replaced components (their idea of milking money).Don't do any paid replacements without consulting another workshop.

[sumeshmani]

Originally Posted by JustCause

Steering could've been 'tightened' when they changed driveshaft. It can be brought to normal by doing a minor adjustment at the workshop(I don't remember the exact part name). Just tell them to loosen it up a bit.

I think you might be referring to the steering dampers. I had faced a similar issue with my car. Unfortunately the technicians struggle to find the sweet spot on my car. They either set it too tight, or too loose. Loose to the extent that it clatters.

[satyabratpanda]

Thanks so much gents for all the useful feedback. I have always got the vehicle serviced from pratham (bought it from them too). Problem is, they are not willing to do things like cleaning / checking throttle sensor, injector cleaning / tank cleaning or checking the valve clearances, they say their diagnostic console reports everything within normal ranges. When I go to another dealer (Bimal), those guys say all this shall be chargeable as the purchase / service was from a different dealer. Have complained to Maruti once, their engineer also says he cannot see any issue. My problem is to get these guys to accept there is a problem being faced and to look into it. Any suggestions on how I can achieve that?

[mayankk]

throttle body cleanup, was it done in any of the visits?
grab a TB cleaner can, remove the hose, and have a buddy keep revs up while spraying on the valve.
better yet, have a mechanic remove and clean it thoroughly.

edit:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...problem-3.html

may be of help

[scorpian]

Yes your absolutely right this car suffers from pathetic resale value.

The problems you highlight are basically result of work done bad on your car.
Foremost your steering problem is a easy one to sort,however if your car is in warranty then you can ask them replace this citing over tight steering and causing discomfort.
Let me tell you a simple thing the scan tool do-sent show up half the things, and besides i strongly believe there's a lot more to physical checking then just connecting a scan tool and saying all is well.

Your low pick up could be cause of your valves,something i experienced on my car and had a tough time sorting it out,despite the maruti engineer claiming all was fine,coz please realise boss thats what they are suppose to do.Am citing an example of a SX4 which had his airbags opened without any impact and the company engineer tried everything possible to save the expenditure on the company,ultimately they had to replace but yet they said to the client we r doing it as a goodwill gesture and airbags opened coz of rough usage of car.

My own car has been totally turned bad at MASS when after a suspension overhaul they slipped a nut on my left shock absorber and eventually on my drive on the highway the strut just shot out leading in to me running off road.The answer i got was it happened coz i was driving at high speed.So u can well understand how eager they are to get rid of major headaches.

Most of the mechs at MASs are so over burdened that they flatly refuse to sort issues which involve laborious task as cleaning fuel tanks etc etc.

If i am not wrong the SX4 has drive by wire or so(am not to clear on this)and there's a way to reprogram-me the throttle which has been mentioned elsewhere on the forum, sum-thing which involves disconnecting the battery,pressing the throttle and some other steps,if you search u may stumble on the same.

I feel your car needs a independent good mechanic who will have patience and check step by step rather then mass which will try and wash their hands off.trust me once the warranty is over their skills dramatically improve coz then on everything is chargeable.

You should press your foot down hard and test drive another sx4 in front of the engineer and ask him as to why the lag and difference in performance.

All the best and hope your problems are sorted out.

[satyabratpanda]

Thanks all you wonderful people for the suggestions. What you all suggest is gradullay confirming my suspicions. One question - if the dealer does not agree to carrying out these actions, am I within my rights to approach another Maruti dealer and asking them to get it done FOC - the vehicle is anyways in extended warranty.
Would any of you have contact details of someone really senior in Maruti on the technical side? Mailing to the generic mail id does not help, they simply redirect the email tot heir local engineer and the concerned dealership - and these two parties have anyways been telling me for the last few months that they donot see anythign abnormal on my vehicle - .
How can I ascertain if the issues I face could be due to a manufacturing issue and then take the maruti folks to task?

[Rajeevraj]

Originally Posted by satyabratpanda

One question - if the dealer does not agree to carrying out these actions, am I within my rights to approach another Maruti dealer and asking them to get it done FOC - the vehicle is anyways in extended warranty.

... and these two parties have anyways been telling me for the last few months that they donot see anythign abnormal on my vehicle - .
How can I ascertain if the issues I face could be due to a manufacturing issue and then take the maruti folks to task?

I assume that any dealer should honor the warranty irrespective of where you bought it from. IN my case I bought an SX4 VVT ZXI from Bimal True Value, but I got the free services done from Pratham.

Since you mention Pratham is your regular servicing center, I assume you must be based somewhere around the Outer Ring Road area. One suggestion I have. There is a Multi Brand car service center called 'Raj Motors' in Belandur(On the Road connecting Belandur to Sarjapur Road). Small setup but those guys are pretty good, and even if you do not want to get detailed work done there, the owner-mechanic there can have a look at your vehicle and may be suggest resolutions for your problems. Then you can decide how to take it further.

[Jakku]

Hi Satyabrata, From my friend's experience, Pratham (at ORR) is not that great when it comes to customer service and interaction. He had very had experiences there. Another friend of mine is getting his service done from Bimal near by to Yelahanka. I would suggest you to take this vehicle there and get it checked after getting an opinion from Raj Motors as suggested by Rajeev Raj.

Also, if you have to shell out some reasonable amount as labour charge to get the vehicle checked, please do so and get it checked. Once you know what is to be done, any Maruti service center should be honouring the warranty and get the works done as per it's terms. (I don't think they can simply deny like that).

[avigster]

Fluctutating RPM with frequent vibrations while idling ( very noticable on red-lights ) is actually a known problem on SX4, I had it on mine too. Let's see if any of these happenned to you _

1) Was the engine mounting ever changed on a recall?
2) Was the clutch ever changed under any recall?


Generally the symptoms you mention are more prominent to cars with above history..

What you may do now :-

1) Reset you ECU, Get throttle body cleaned up & recaliberated.
2) Clean Fuel Injectors for any clog.

In the case the above two dont work, go to a local garage & ask them to set the plug gap to .7-.8 mm. Drive & see if that does the trick.. if it does, simply run to methods & get iridiums. This is a workaround to the problem & not the actual solution, but trust me it works like a charm!!

This is what I did, & violla had an amazing time with my SX4 thereafter.

[nutmello]

hello. try calling this number and explain in detail your issues. his name is manjunath 9986807919. he will give a patient hearing. follow his advise.all your issues with car will be solved

[Aroy]

As all your problems seem to have started after the third service, the mechanics must have messed up some where. I would never go to that work shop again.

As suggested to to a good independent garage and at least get the car checked and an estimate prepared. It may cost you some money, but you may get an honest opinion.

1&2. Erratic idling and loss of power point to fuel and/or air flow problem. Get the following checked
. Throttle body to see if it is sticking.
. Spark plugs - change them if not done as yet
. Fuel filter - check if they replaced one with a bad/choked one. Best replace it with one bought from an authorised retailer.

3. You seem to have a leak in the clutch hydraulic circuit. Get all the connections/joints checked for micro leaks. Again a good brake specialist will know what to do, and do it for much less than the dealer.

4. They have messed up the settings after replacement. Get it adjusted by an independent specialist.

I normally stand when any job is done on my car. If the "Company Policy" does not allow that, I do not go there! There are a lot of good Maruti trained independent authorised garages. Find one and patronize them. Most of the times the mechanics at the dealer are both over worked and dis interested, so you do not get service quality you paid for, while an independent garage is dependent on your patronage, hence give a much better service.

[satyabratpanda]

Thanks to all of you friends, here is the latest on this. I went to the dealer (Pratham Motors) a couple of weeks back. They said, they did not see any need for injector cleaning, but at my request have done this as a paid job. They also recommended (and I agreed) that the gear oil and coolant be changed as the vehicle has completed more than two years. Got these done and the spark plugs replaced, there is a perceptible improvement in driving and I suspect the mileage shall also increase although I haven't been able to find out yet as I haven't yet refilled. They took note of my complaint regarding the steering being hard, and ordered a power steering motor assembly. They called me yesterday and have replaced the motor and thereafter I find a significant difference in the feel of the steering as well.

[newtonMeter]

Hi Satya,

the issue you have mentioned is surely a small issue now turned ugly due to extensive bad work done at the service centers.

I had the same issue in my SX4 (Zxi VVT 2010 model) of fluctuating idle. Believe it to not it was due to bad petrol i had put in on my way to bangalore from mysore (highway) which had caused lot of carbon deposit in the injectors.

As sx4 is totally ECU controlled, the processor was detecting issues (weak injector) and thus increasing the idle.

I always service my car at MANDOVI - WILSON GARDEN. Trust me they are the best in bangalore.

They solved my issue in a jiffy. All that was needed was cleaning up the fuel lines end to end. then a quick ECU Reset (either by lock unlock door ignition off press clutch release method OR disconnect battery terminal for 180 seconds; the latter works 100%)

Please do give Mandovi Wilson garden a try for any further assistance.