[srinitata]

Hi,

I gave my Kushaq for a 3rd service last week and they did the wheel balancing and alignment as part of the package. While riding back from the service I could visibly feel vibrations on the steering at speeds above 80kmph. At around 100, if I take off my hands I can see the steering wheel literally vibrate. I called the centre and as expected they said all was well in their wheel alignment and balancing. I asked to send the report and it’s been sent. Need help from the community experts - do I have to get it re-checked for the wheel balancing… is the alignment report looking ok? (SAI post alignment reads quite large - is that normal?).

Thanks in advance

[zeng]

Originally Posted by srinitata

Need help from the community experts - do I have to get it re-checked for the wheel balancing… is the alignment report looking ok? (SAI post alignment reads quite large - is that normal?).

Thanks in advance

Does the steering wheel ever so slightly (if perceptible) off-centre to the left whilst driving in a straight ahead direction?

Generally this alignment job is done quite well and I believe the vibrating steering wheel is wheel balancing related that requires making good.

[srinitata]

Originally Posted by zeng

Does the steering wheel ever so slightly (if perceptible) off-centre to the left whilst driving in a straight ahead direction?

Generally this alignment job is done quite well and I believe the vibrating steering wheel is wheel balancing related that requires making good.

Thank you for your assessment. No, I did not see any drift of the vehicle. I will check the wheel balancing locally.

[curios]

Originally Posted by Nikhilb2008

Partly true. Some tyre shops dont know how to handle TPMS sensors which are inside the tyre. But most decent tyre shops today know how to handle them. The SA is just scaring you to retain your business. No harm in sticking to the authorised service centre if they are doing a good job, but dont stay with them out of fear.

WA is not necessary but balancing is surely needed. As many others have mentioned in this thread, the moment you remove a tyre and fit a new one, wheel balancing is required.

It's also a good idea to check the wheel alignment. Off late, I have noticed a lot of brand new vehicles being mis-aligned.

Seriously, I need some help here. I bought an i20 Sportz a month ago, and have felt from the beginning something was off about the steering and drive feel. The stock CEAT Secura Drive tyres felt rock hard on bumps but that was expected.
In a fit of unusual self-confidence and without doing a little more probing as I normally do, I went ahead and replaced the OEM tyres with Michelin Primacy4ST of the same size (195/55/R16). This was because my previous car's (Chevrolet Spark) experience with XM2s was superb.

Since this tyre change, I've had even greater discomfort -- road grip has been poor and I get a slight bouncy/wobble feel. I got re-balancing redone at a Pirelli Performance Centre (for Rs 800) and the owner alleged that no balancing was done at all by the previous tyre dealer during fitment.

Sure, there was an improvement after this. But I continue to feel that the car still dances/sways a bit at slow speeds especially, and it is not as 'planted' on the road as I want it to be.

When I called the Pirelli shop owner again, he curtly advised reducing tyre pressure whereas they filled nitrogen at 34psi saying it's ok. Hyundai recommends 33 psi max.

One more critical thing. Any turn of the steering feels jerky and not normal. This has been the case from day one with the stock tyres as well.

Have driven 250-odd kms so far, but have been unhappy, and regretting the tyre change. I am avoiding driving my new car as much as I can since I feel under confident of handling it and it delivers an unpleasant experience. For reference, I drove a friend's Creta yesterday for a short distance and the road grip felt just right and planted as it should.

What could be the reason for a brand new car with premium tyres to behave this way? Was the balancing done wrong the second time, is this an alignment problem (been told new cars don't need their alignment adjusted) or some other serious issue.

My impressions of the Hyundai dealer's authorised service staff when I went to check another issue of unusual heating (felt burning hot) on the bonnet in just 30-40 minutes, was brushed aside as "nothing to worry, it's normal". Not sure I should visit them until my first service/checkup in due in another month.

What should I do now? Kindly advise.

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[zeng]

Originally Posted by curios

Seriously need some help here. I bought an i20 Sportz a month ago, and have felt from the beginning something was off about the steering and drive feel. The stock CEAT Secura Drive tyres felt rock hard on bumps but that was expected.


Since this tyre change, I've had even greater discomfort -- road grip has been poor and I get a slight bouncy/wobble feel.

Sure, there was an improvement after this. But I continue to feel that the car still dances/sways a bit at slow speeds especially, and it is not as 'planted' on the road as I want it to be.



One more critical thing. Any turn of the steering feels jerky and not normal. This has been the case from day one with the stock tyres as well.

Have driven 250-odd kms so far, but have been unhappy, and regretting the tyre change. I am avoiding driving my new car as much as I can since I feel under confident of handling it and it delivers an unpleasant experience. For reference, I drove a friend's Creta yesterday for a short distance and the road grip felt just right and planted as it should.

Was the balancing done wrong the second time, is this an alignment problem (been told new cars don't need their alignment adjusted) or some other serious issue.

The above could be wheel alignment related, among others.

Compliance to oem spec range does NOT pre-empt some or all of the above symptoms.

Mind sharing alignment details screenshot, if accessible?

[curios]

Originally Posted by zeng

The above could be wheel alignment related, among others.

Compliance to oem spec range does NOT pre-empt some or all of the above symptoms.

Mind sharing alignment details screenshot, if accessible?

Sigh. Thanks. Before your reply came in, I visited yet another reasonably trusted neighbourhood tyre shop that I'd been using for my previous car's tyre needs.

Rebalancing showed major errors (as was the case at the Pirelli shop), which was shocking, to say the least. Also got the alignment adjusted; report is attached. Their technician was unsure as I was whether I should tinker with the factory alignment but I said go ahead anyway.

After driving out this time, I finally sense quite a bit of the 'planted' feel I'd been looking for, but the steering seems to have gotten stiffer. In fact, the factory setting, which lends a typical lightness to the steering at low speeds (changing to firmness at high speeds) is almost gone, it seems.

I'm exasperated and quite fed up with spending so much time -- with a sinking feeling that I created new problems while addressing a stiff suspension discomfort through the Michelin tyres swap -- at tyre shops across the city, than actually driving or enjoying my new car.

Is this most recent case of alignment adjustment the culprit?

About the jerky feel while turning the steering wheel, the guy suggested I should ask the Hyundai service folks on my first service (due next month) to check its calibration. I guess he means the steering angle sensor (SAS) calibration. Any thoughts on that please?

Wondering if I should visit the Hyundai chaps urgently anyway, since these issues have been compounding and become extremely worrisome on a day-to-day basis.

[curios]

Originally Posted by curios

Sigh. Thanks. Before your reply came in, I visited yet another reasonably trusted neighbourhood tyre shop that I'd been using for my previous car's tyre needs.

Rebalancing showed major errors (as was the case at the Pirelli shop), which was shocking, to say the least. Also got the alignment adjusted; report is attached. Their technician was unsure as I was whether I should tinker with the factory alignment but I said go ahead anyway.

After driving out this time, I finally sense quite a bit of the 'planted' feel I'd been looking for, but the steering seems to have gotten stiffer. In fact, the factory setting, which lends a typical lightness to the steering at low speeds (changing to firmness at high speeds) is almost gone, it seems.

I'm exasperated and quite fed up with spending so much time -- with a sinking feeling that I created new problems while addressing a stiff suspension discomfort through the Michelin tyres swap -- at tyre shops across the city, than actually driving or enjoying my new car.

Is this most recent case of alignment adjustment the culprit?

About the jerky feel while turning the steering wheel, the guy suggested I should ask the Hyundai service folks on my first service (due next month) to check its calibration. I guess he means the steering angle sensor (SAS) calibration. Any thoughts on that please?

Wondering if I should visit the Hyundai chaps urgently anyway, since these issues have been compounding and become extremely worrisome on a day-to-day basis.

Any thoughts/advise on this please?

[zeng]

Originally Posted by curios

Seriously need some help here. I bought an i20 Sportz a month ago, and have felt from the beginning something was off about the steering and drive feel. The stock CEAT Secura Drive tyres felt rock hard on bumps but that was expected.

First off, we may be speaking in different lingo interpreting a particular word that carries two dissimilar/opposing meaning between both of us and confusing third party readers here.

Feeling rock hard on bumps may indicate front toe-in's (as opposed to toe-out's) whose values remains unknown now.

Steering and driving feel choice selection that is factory adjustable is front toes.

Other parameters affecting such like front cambers and front casters together with non-adjustable rear torsion beam design is incapable of altering the steering and driving feel as it is, unless aftermarket products and mods are done on the car.

Since this tyre change, I've had even greater discomfort -- road grip has been poor and I get a slight bouncy/wobble feel.

Vehicle bounciness as I understand it, cannot be altered by altering front toes.
Wobble feel on steering wheel may be altered by increasing prefering toe-in or prefering toe-out.
Again front toe values remain unknown.

Sure, there was an improvement after this. But I continue to feel that the car still dances/sways a bit at slow speeds especially, and it is not as 'planted' on the road as I want it to be.

Strictly confining our discussion to alignment numbers (disregarding external influencing factors like road surface texture/gradient/smoothness or incorrect parts installation etc) toes can alter 'planted-ness' of steering feel.
Front toes may alter/achieve loose steering feel IF your 'sways' is equivalent to my 'loose' (if you get what I mean).

One more critical thing. Any turn of the steering feels jerky and not normal. This has been the case from day one with the stock tyres as well.

Tight steering feel and steering effort may be altered by altering front toes disregarding external factors like functioning of vehicle steering system.

Have driven 250-odd kms so far, but have been unhappy, and regretting the tyre change. I am avoiding driving my new car as much as I can since I feel under confident of handling it and it delivers an unpleasant experience. For reference, I drove a friend's Creta yesterday for a short distance and the road grip felt just right and planted as it should.

If your friend's wheel alignment numbers differs from yours, then alter your numbers to follow his.
But heck, from factory ONLY front toes are adjustable on this i20 without aftermarket parts or mods.

If both sets of numbers are fully identical (very unlikely), then the unpleasantness is not wheel alignment related.

Was the balancing done wrong the second time, is this an alignment problem (been told new cars don't need their alignment adjusted) or some other serious issue.

Your subsequent post has confirmed balancing problem exists.

Rebalancing showed major errors (as was the case at the Pirelli shop), which was shocking, to say the least. Also got the alignment adjusted; report is attached. Their technician was unsure as I was whether I should tinker with the factory alignment but I said go ahead anyway.

Only front toes are adjustable from factory, but I believe no meaningful front toe adjustment was carried out though the 'entered' Before and After front toes varies slightly. But heck all other non-adjustable numbers varies to a much greater degree. Hence my hunch is positive front toe-in's were not reduced in a meaningful way.

After driving out this time, I finally sense quite a bit of the 'planted' feel I'd been looking for, but the steering seems to have gotten stiffer. In fact, the factory setting, which lends a typical lightness to the steering at low speeds (changing to firmness at high speeds) is almost gone, it seems.

Assuming no meaningful front toe adjustment was carried out, I'm dumbfounded to offer any insights. I may be wrong though.

Having said that the front toe-in's of 13 minutes Before and 10 minutes After should reflect a steering wheel feel on the tight side as opposed to the loose side.

About the jerky feel while turning the steering wheel, the guy suggested I should ask the Hyundai service folks on my first service (due next month) to check its calibration. I guess he means the steering angle sensor (SAS) calibration. Any thoughts on that please?

If the jerky feel is unrelated to tightness or looseness of steering wheel feel, external factors like this may throw in some light.

Wondering if I should visit the Hyundai chaps urgently anyway, since these issues have been compounding and become extremely worrisome on a day-to-day basis.

I wish they are far better than me in trying to understand what you mean to say.

[curios]

Thanks so much for taking the time to put out a detailed response to my issues/queries. But you're right, some of it went over my head.
I went yesterday to Hyundai service and their staff though helpful and well spoken, found nothing wrong with the wobbly feel but alignment was a bit off. The alignment guy adjusted it on the roadside itself. He asked me to take God's blessings (yup!) and drive without a worry, and soon any niggles that I'm sensing will go away since the new tyres need a while to get worn in.
I've driven 350 odd km in the 7 weeks since taking delivery. Obviously, my desire to drive is diminishing with each ride and is limited to essential errands or hospital visits for my 90-yo dad.
On the jerky feel, he said he didn't feel it. I still do. Was non-specific on the SAS calibration aspect and suggested brining it up at the first service due in 3 weeks.
I still feel the slight wobble particularly at slow speeds.

[curios]

Update: I continue to feel the wobble and sway at slow speeds but it's now noticeable and pronounced around the rear wheels. At least that's what I've been carefully observing on my few and limited distance drives. Barely feel like driving this new car except for essential runs.

What would be a suitable course of action now? Any suggestions for a reliable tyre/wheel expert in Delhi NCR please or is the Hyundai Service centre my best bet, going forward?

[Bsilver]

Originally Posted by curios

Update: I continue to feel the wobble and sway at slow speeds but it's now noticeable and pronounced around the rear wheels.
What would be a suitable course of action now? Any suggestions for a reliable tyre/wheel expert in Delhi NCR please or is the Hyundai Service centre my best bet, going forward?

Since you have tried to rectify the problem multiple times now, you could also try to check if the wheel bearing is good. Rear wheel hub bearing, if goes bad, then an easy way to check is, jack the rear wheel, rotate front and back with your hand and check if their is some noise when the wheel is changing rotation direction. If there is a noise when you force the wheel to change direction, then it would be most probably the bearing which is bad, and may be it is the one causing the issue of wobble. Do this for all the 4 wheels to be minimize the problem. If all the bearings are good, then it might be some other issue, and further investigation is needed. Hope this helps.

Happy Motoring!

[curios]

Originally Posted by Bsilver

Since you have tried to rectify the problem multiple times now, you could also try to check if the wheel bearing is good. Rear wheel hub bearing, if goes bad, then an easy way to check is, jack the rear wheel, rotate front and back with your hand and check if their is some noise when the wheel is changing rotation direction. If there is a noise when you force the wheel to change direction, then it would be most probably the bearing which is bad, and may be it is the one causing the issue of wobble. Do this for all the 4 wheels to be minimize the problem. If all the bearings are good, then it might be some other issue, and further investigation is needed. Hope this helps.

Happy Motoring!

Thanks a lot for the advice. Are wheel bearing or other serious mechanical part issues possible in a brand new car (March 2024 mfd) that I got delivered in end-May?

[Bsilver]

Originally Posted by curios

Thanks a lot for the advice. Are wheel bearing or other serious mechanical part issues possible in a brand new car (March 2024 mfd) that I got delivered in end-May?

Yes can be, it could be a faulty part or a defect. If you find it, it will be replaced under warranty. Usually they do not go bad on a new car, but there is certain probability to go bad as well.

Happy Motoring!

[jacobsam]

Could anyone guide me to a good wheel
Alignment shop in Indore for our Honda City?

[sanchari]

Not sure if this is the right thread, but couldn't find any general tyre maintenance thread.

I have Honda Jazz and had given my car for service at ASS. I asked them if they are rotating the tyres as per manual, they said they don't move front tyres to back and vice versa, but just turn the tyres to see if everything looks good, like bearings, tyre wear, brakes, rotors etc. I told him they were supposed to change the tyres but he said they are not supposed to do it and it will be done only if we get alignment done. I told I will take it up with Honda.

I am surprised as even the manual shows the order of rotating the tyres at each service interval. The Honda manual link also can be seen here: https://www.hondacarindia.com/owners...06278046-23396

In my car, the front tyres are totally worn out in 3 years while the back tyres still have life in them. It is my mistake that I didn't notice they haven't rotated tyres earlier or monitored the wear. However, it seems strange that the ASS technicians are not trained properly by Honda on how to rotate tyres. When I was in US, they did rotate the tyres properly and I assumed they would do the same here.

Is it the same with all brands? Do ASS never rotate tyres during scheduled service?