Quote:
Originally Posted by V.Narayan I didnt realize we had MiG-21PF's in service at one point. Always good to learn something new. I assume they came in as fly aways from the USSR to fill the gap till the FLs got out from HAL. |
Yes, the F-13s and PFs were an interim solution till the FLs deliveries started. It is widely belived that the IAF MiG-21 acquisition was a hurried response to the debacle of 1962. In fact, it was a counter to the PAF's acquisition of F-104A/Bs in 1961. License production of the new supersonic aircraft in India was an important pre-condition. Accordingly the French Mirage IIIC, English Electric Lightning and MiG-21F were evaluated. The Americans refused to offer F-104 to India. Of the three evaluations, the Mirage & Lightning were considered expensive and license production rights was also denied. The Soviets readily agreed to supply interim MiG-21Fs and PFs and gave license for production of MiG-21FLs in India. So, in August 1962 the Indian Govt entered into an agreement with USSR to license manufacture MiG-21FLs, its engine, forgings & castings, avionics, K-13 missiles in India .
Here's a brief time line of the early MiG-21s in IAF service:
1963 (September): No. 28 Sqdn formed with six Type 74 MiG-21F-13s(Srl Nos. BC816 to BC821)
1964 (January) : Two Type 74s lost in a Mid Air Collision during close formation practice for Republic day flypast (Wg Cdr MSD Wollen & Sqdn Ldr A K Mukherjee ejected and survived)
1965 (March): Six Type 76 MiG-21PFs(in CKD condition) arrive from Russia(Srl Nos. BC 822 to BC 827)
1965 (September): After a B-57 raid on Adampur, Type 74 MiG-21F-13 (Srl No. BC818) destroyed on the ground & Type 74 MiG-21F-13 (Srl No. BC816) lightly damaged (it was repaired and put back into service). At Pathankot, Type 76 MiG-21PFs BC 823 & 824 were destroyed on the ground after a PAF F-86 Raid.
Early 1966 : Type 66 MiG-21Us arrive
Late 1966/ Early 67 : First Type 77 MiG-21FLs deliveries start . No. 1 Sqdn "Tigers" first to convert, followed by No. 45 "Flying Daggers" and No. 28 "First Supersonics"(Till then No. 28 continued flying its three Type 74s, four Type 76 and Type 66 MiG-21s)
BC817 - The lone surviving Type 74 MiG-21F-13 in India -> Had a few animated discussions long time ago with Mr PVS Jagan Mohan about this particualr airframe, on whether IAF Type 74s were equipped with the second internal cannon on the port side or not. After seeing the available pics of IAF Type 74s, we came to a conclusion that unlike the early Soviet MiG-21Fs, IAF MiG-21F-13s had only one cannon on the starboard side.
Quote:
Originally Posted by V.Narayan Kanchan you are describing the differences {and your descriptions are perfectly correct and beautifully put} from the standpoint of an aviation observer and enthusiast while PGA is describing the fundamental sameness from an engineers structural point of view. Like in my ex-world the 737-600, 737-700, 737-800 and 737-900 were looked upon as essentially the same aircraft though they had differences other than just in length. PGA, Kanchan thank you for enriching us all with your valuable inputs. I really like it that the aviation threads stay sane and courteous and yet rich in knowledge sharing. |
Yes, I guess I should have been more specific. By "structure", I actually meant the way the MiG-21s were differentiated "externally:. In engineering terms, I suppose it means what you and PGA sir quoted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PGA yes I worked as a maintenance man on MiGs for a decade and later for some time was involved with procurements. So have been directly or indirectly involved with some things being discussed on this thread. |
Firstly, a big salute and thank you for your service. It is a matter of pride for us that former servicemen like you are a part of this forum. As a civilian, I feel the sacrifices that men and women like you make, have never been fully appreciated by us, as a country.
Secondly I feel embarassed
. My attempts at giving gyaan to some one like you is like a noob student trying to teach a teacher how to teach!!!! And please, don't call me sir, now that I realise that you are much senior to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PGA I still remember my instructor chastising me about R-13, he said forget about R-13 it was never with us and and even if we had it is never going into a conflict.
The tales of unreliability of R1L and RP 21 radars on T-77 and T-96 are legendary anyway.
My salute to your observation and knowledge, I have been to Deolali and never ever gave a second glance to the MiG placed there. |
Really look forward to reading about such tales.