![]() | #526 | |
Distinguished - BHPian ![]() Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Chennai
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A certain Mr.Gupta has much to answer for! | |
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![]() | #527 |
Team-BHP Support ![]() ![]() | ![]() Moderator Note: Let's avoid discussing the political angle. Thanks! |
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![]() | #528 | |
BHPian ![]() | ![]() Quote:
Let's see what turns up eventually. Last edited by khan_sultan : 28th March 2019 at 15:36. Reason: Line spacing for better readability | |
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![]() | #529 | |
BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: hyderabad
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Everyone know that MkI-30 is a superior jet, but how come when multiple Pakistani jets were firing multiple missiles at our planes, what were our guys up to????? The article suggest that even though we had superior jets that day our pilots were still dodging the incoming missiles (successfully) and not a single missile was fired from Su MKI-30 in retaliation???? WHYYYY ![]() Isn't the purpose of BVR missile defeated if our pilots were still waiting for visual confirmation before firing. I don't see any logic in this. The only claimed missile fired, was from Abhinandan's Mig which took down a F-16. Again no proof. Sir, at the end of the day our jet was shot down and our pilot was taken as a prisoner of war. PERIOD. Pakis showed the world the proof, we Indians didn't. Now all the Indian experts can claim whatever they want, but it definitely doesn't answers many important questions. Just my 2 cents. Last edited by ashroy_6 : 28th March 2019 at 14:50. | |
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![]() | #530 |
Distinguished - BHPian ![]() Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Chennai
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| ![]() ^ I personally wish that our folks wouldn't question our defence forces as a whole, even if my definition of the defence forces includes the defence minister. When the Pakistanis lost the Kargil war, they also lost their entire Northern Light Infantry unit on the barren peaks and slopes. They refused to even acknowledge their own dead, an entire infantry unit's dead soldiers - just because it would poke holes in their propaganda about the entire war being a freedom fight. That's the peak of misinformation and propaganda. That's the kind of thing our forces won't do. (There have even been insinuations that since the Pakistani NLI was mostly manned by Shia soldiers, the Sunni majority Pakistani establishment had no remorse in disowning them.) My rambling point is that - trust is all we need. Our track record so far is one of honesty, professionalism and humane treatment of their PoWs. Our enemy's track record is appalling. And it seems they have wired enough money to journalists on our soil to peddle their jaundiced points of view. So what if we didn't pack a full punch when the enemy came knocking? So what if we don't have proof to show for everything we said we did? Most of us are operating on "he said" and "she said" about the events of the Balakot strike and its aftermath. Any evidence presented is poked at either by jaundiced or loving eyes. But all we really need to do is trust and hope that we maintain our willingness to alter the status quo of us helplessly suffering suicide bombings and 26/11 styled attacks again and again. I'm not criticizing those who're curious to learn about what happened, because i'm one of them as well... |
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![]() | #531 |
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Completely agree. We shall know in due course of time. Last edited by khan_sultan : 28th March 2019 at 15:34. Reason: Trimmed quoted post |
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![]() | #532 |
BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: hyderabad
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| ![]() No organisation or government should be above scrutiny. That's what differentiate Indians and Pakistanis, that here in India, we can question any institution unlike our neighbours where everything is controlled by army. Isn't that the beauty of democracy. Just labelling people who questions the govt/ army as anti nationals or on enemies payrolls is not done. Each and every institution is answerable to the citizens of the country. In this age when the whole world revolves around accountability why should a freehand be given to a particular institution????That's the problem with us that we are all too trusting. I personally would have been happy if the govt would have kept the real picture in front of the public. So what if we lost..there's always a second chance. My worry is that the integrity of our armed forces shouldn't be compromised because of the political agenda of our political parties. |
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![]() | #533 | |||||
Senior - BHPian ![]() | ![]() Quote:
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Squadron Leader Siddharath Vashisth Squadron Leader Ninad Mandavgane Sergeant Vikrant Sehrawat Corporal Pankaj Kumar Corporal Deepak Pandey Kumar Pandey The seventh casualty was a civilian who was at the spot where the chopper crashed. Sqdn Ldr Vashisth received commendation for his role in rescue ops in Kerala floods last year and his wife is also in the IAF. The wife of Sqdn Ldr Mandavgane made an emotional appeal on TV to stop mad dance of war because it is them who pay the ultimate price, not us and definitely not the politicians. Quote:
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However, the fact still remains the RM and later the FM goofed up big time about the supposedly dead PAF pilot. The RM's statement was based on what? Some social media rumour? The responsible chair that she occupies demands more responsibility in making statements. If not, what is the difference between the RM and Maj Gen Ghafoor AKA Baghdad Bob v2.0? Last edited by skanchan95 : 28th March 2019 at 16:44. | |||||
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![]() | #534 | ||
BHPian ![]() Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: New Delhi
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This was an amazing read Locusjag. I learned a lot from that authors long post. Quote:
I think this is where your answer is hidden. From same article. "Coming to the next gem in his article, he states that PAF F-16s creatively surprised the IAF fleet and fired AMRAAMs on the Su-30MKIs. This apparently was some sort of victory for the PAF which we should all be collectively worried about. Basic 101 tactics in fighter school, available via 100's of accounts over the years, clearly teaches pilots to not be an Arnold in Terminator (spraying belts of ammo) but fire only when the enemy is in your definite kill zone, otherwise be prepared to waste your valuable missile rounds. The author makes a virtue of the PAF pilots lack of skill or fire discipline in having launched multiple AMRAAM rounds without merit. Now reverting back to the author's insightful assertion that the SU-30MKIs were outgunned and outranged I want to paraphrase what AVM A. Subramaniam (Retd) wrote in his detailed account, which of course he cannot openly credit as that of the IAF's but subsequent accounts all bear out how closely the actual events mimicked the details mentioned in the article." You are right no one denies 'Arriving at useful answers first involves asking right question'. But in the garb of questioning if people try to stall processes or play dirty games that is when problem starts. The said article which generated some many posts here, tires to do that. And I think that is why the anger. Since mods have requested to avoid political discussion I am not going there, there is a long history of compromising integrity of armed forces. | ||
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![]() | #535 | ||
Distinguished - BHPian ![]() Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Chennai
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It is a grey area where the MoD is concerned and lines do get blurred; if one Defence Minister sits on acquisition files where not even so much as replacement batteries for submarines are ordered, it's the Navy's men who burn/drown in a submarine. They are inextricably linked. This is a tenuous link, I know most will not buy it. But you really have to think from a Mordor point of view as to how gleeful this looks. I have anyway only stated a wish of mine. I am nobody to stop people from criticizing the MoD, if that's what they want to do. I can recount one horrible episode where I had actually besmirched the armed forces myself on this forum based on a few bad apples in the forces (I don't know what the hell I was thinking at the time) and i can tell you this much - you may think you're being strictly logical at the time, but time and a change of mindset sometimes reveals the real damage done. | ||
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![]() | #536 | ||
BHPian Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: |
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U.S. Jet Fighters Are Back in India For Wargames (The Last Two Times, the Indian Air Force Won) Cope India: when India’s Russian jets achieved a surprising 9:1 kill ratio against U.S. F-15s Fishbed vs Falcon: Why the ancient MiG-21's F-16 kill is no fluke Quote:
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![]() | #537 |
Team-BHP Support ![]() ![]() | ![]() Looks like Mi17 helicopter crash on 27th Feb was a friendly fire incident Budgam: Indian missile fired before Mi17 V5 chopper crash https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...w/68623744.cms |
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![]() | #538 |
BHPian ![]() | ![]() An unfortunate reality of war and something that probably shocked the IAF at that point of time and impacted the events succeeding the incursion of the PAF. Remains to be seen how the IAF sets up its doctrines for the future scenarios and how the learnings are incorporated. Last edited by Maveryq : 29th March 2019 at 13:45. Reason: Better readability |
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![]() | #539 | |
BHPian Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: hyderabad
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![]() | #540 |
Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Bangalore
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| ![]() Saw this news on the phone today in the morning. https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...w/68623744.cms However searching all news channels but no news at all. Did we shoot a Paki helicopter with VIPs that the Govt does not want to disclose?? |
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