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Old 9th December 2019, 23:41   #1156
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Here is the website:

https://altroz.tatamotors.com/

Like for downloading brochure:

https://altroz.tatamotors.com/tata-altroz-downloads
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Old 10th December 2019, 00:24   #1157
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

So a very mediocre Petrol Engine and a stonker of diesel engine without Auto gearbox; at a time when market is shifting towards petrol + Auto? What I can think about is that:
1. Tata doesn't believe in the market response of petrol and thinks that they can re-write history by moving against the tide.
2. They want to completely come out of taxi branding and cab aggregators should not think about diesel Altroz as a point A-B people mover, but as a rich man's sports hatch!
3. And by giving ONLY manual gearbox, Tata has also ensured a worthy competition to 911GT3, Civic Type R, etc.
4. The final most exciting part which is going to be the crowd puller is to give a golden paint-job and just name it as G-O-L-D!

That's it!! That's one hell of a product and the launch-of-the-century.
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Old 10th December 2019, 09:53   #1158
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nazaar25 View Post
My bad. The diesel is much better than the petrol but I still feel 10-15 more horsepower could have added more zing to the motor.
Now I am not saying that it's an under-powered machine in any way but it's definitely not in the same league as the Ford Figo TDCi and as ACI said, the new platform deserves a more powerful engine.
ACI mentioned the "deserves a more powerful engine" in the context of the petrol motor. Not diesel actually.
  1. Guys - unless we drive the car (or get the TBHP official review when it comes) its not wise to pass a judgement on the power-train. We never know by looking at media house reviews that are pretty useless & vague. The car in reality may well be driving very well in that combination.
  2. The Petrol engine for instance, isn't just the same engine from Tiago. More compression ratios, VVT, stronger build, balancers. Its more of an evolution of the Tiago engine. Should get the job done for most Indian users IMO. The figures are respectable. Not everyone buying a car is going to race at the Buddh circuit. I drive a nexon - 5k kms done. I have very much driven around 110kmph regularly but the car is yet to see anything above 2200 RPM. So as long as the torque & power curves are optimal, just peak power & torque numbers don't matter.
  3. A 90 PS 200 Nm diesel motor is very good for such a compact car. Remember - a large Honda City drives with just 110 horses at most. We shouldn't always expect an Indica priced Porsche 911 from Tata. I don't know why people always do.
  4. The gearbox used in the Altroz seems to have a torque limit around 200 Nm. This gearbox also keeps the costs down significantly. A 6 speed unit from the Nexon would rocket the cost up considerably. And so - the 90PS/200Nm ceiling for the engine seems to be pretty much what the car can do. I don't think re-mapping the car for higher tune might be wise. It might kill the gearbox very soon. Potential buyers better keep this in mind.

What we seem to be missing also is - the reviews are asking for a more powerful engine because the car is handling & riding unlike anything around it. Thats one BIG positive that is being lost while the focus stays on whether the engine is powerful enough. The car is asking for a more powerful engine because its handling sporty & confident. I believe the engineers deserve a lot of credit for getting that right! For a person loving driving I think this is the USP of the car. Nothing else.

What I'm utterly disappointed about is how poor the media houses were on the technical details.
  1. Not a single one talked about the BSVI implementation. How has TML done the conversion of the 1.5L Revotorq? Are they using a DPF with AdBlu? Nobody showed the filling caps etc. What a shame.
  2. Only Overdrive mentioned the horn buttons at thumb pads. But then the OD reviewer seemed sleepy & with a very limited vocabulary. Words were trickling like a leaking tap!
  3. Surprisingly, C&B's Siddharth Patankar also was very ignorant about a lot of details. It was as if they weren't interested in reviewing the car.

My god are the TBHP reviews 100 levels up! Details like door handle functions, beading fittings, the little significant things. We have come to look at such tiny details that these lame media house reviews are utterly frustrating!

Last edited by Reinhard : 10th December 2019 at 10:15.
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Old 10th December 2019, 09:55   #1159
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

So is wide opening doors is the party trick for TATA? Althoughthe Altroz feels like a standard offering on par with the segment not launching the turbo petrol AT is surely a lost opportunity. One big let down is the puny 37 litre tank, even the Chevy spark had a 38 litre one Keenly awaiting the turbo petrol AT.
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Old 10th December 2019, 10:08   #1160
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 400notout View Post
One big let down is the puny 37 litre tank, even the Chevy spark had a 38 litre one
I used a 35 liter tank for 9 years and never once did I find it inadequate. Even a poor 15 kmpl mileage gives 555kms range on 37 liters. I don't think its disappointing at all.

Also - remember, each extra liter of fuel in car adds weight in the car. A "Tank-full" will mean extra weight in the car too which has a tiny effect on mileage & handling. I think around 35 L tank is sufficient for small hatchbacks upto B+ segment that are good on fuel efficiency.
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Old 10th December 2019, 10:10   #1161
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
My god are the TBHP reviews 100 levels up! Details like door handle functions, beading fittings, the little significant things. We have come to look at such tiny details that these lame media house reviews are utterly frustrating!
When it comes to reviews by other media houses, I would recommend seeing reviews done by Zigwheels' Kartikeya Singhee. I feel he presents the review well and gives a balanced analysis of the car.
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Old 10th December 2019, 10:12   #1162
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikhilthegunner View Post
When it comes to reviews by other media houses, I would recommend seeing reviews done by Zigwheels' Kartikeya Singhee. I feel he presents the review well and gives a balanced analysis of the car.
Agreed 100%. Zigwheels seem to have a better review in general since quite some time now. Balanced & useful information. Not a covert paid advertisement or patronizing of any brand in any of their recent reviews that I have seen.
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Old 10th December 2019, 10:31   #1163
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 400notout View Post
One big let down is the puny 37 litre tank, even the Chevy spark had a 38 litre one Keenly awaiting the turbo petrol AT.
I have driven 3 cars over 4.5L kms, each having the same sized tank, the Indica DLG, the Indigo Marina and now the Vista. I have also done two cross-country trips - 8500 kms in 25 days and 5500 kms in 8 days. Never have I found it inadequate.

I drive mostly inside the city these days, an approximate of 40 kms per day and fill my tank twice in a month. I think a discussion about tank capacity is overrated. An average mileage of 15 (city) gives me about 500+ kms for a tankful.

Tank capacity was a major issue in only one vehicle of mine, the Gypsy. A 40L tank and a mileage of 7-10 (jungle) was a major pain. I have had to travel 20 kms out of my work area, just to refuel.
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Old 10th December 2019, 10:40   #1164
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
I used a 35 liter tank for 9 years and never once did I find it inadequate. Even a poor 15 kmpl mileage gives 555kms range on 37 liters. I don't think its disappointing at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by discoverwild View Post
I drive mostly inside the city these days, an approximate of 40 kms per day and fill my tank twice in a month. I think a discussion about tank capacity is overrated. An average mileage of 15 (city) gives me about 500+ kms for a tankful.
Where in the world is 15kmpl a poor city average? My spark have me an average of max 12- 13 in the city ( it was a 4 cylinder) and my city zx CVT gives me an average of 10-11 in the city.

From an average petrol engine the max fuel efficiency i expect in the city is 12. 15 would be like a dream.

I don't know how the Tiago fares in realworld city conditions, figures of Altroz would be lower than that i suppose.
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Old 10th December 2019, 10:47   #1165
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 400notout View Post
Where in the world is 15kmpl a poor city average? My spark have me an average of max 12- 13 in the city ( it was a 4 cylinder) and my city zx CVT gives me an average of 10-11 in the city.
I'm not talking about the city mileage but an 'average' with mix of highway runs, I should have been clearer yes.
For MT cars in 1.2L segment, 15kmpl is a norm pretty much right now. Not for automatics but then Altroz doesn't have an automatic at all.

And then - I was also including the diesel Altroz for more highway usage. 37L tank with an engine that will easily clock 20kmpl is more than sufficient. The 1.5 RTQ engine has very little variance between city & highway mileage if driven sedately (personal experience).
Quote:
Originally Posted by 400notout View Post
From an average petrol engine the max fuel efficiency i expect in the city is 12. 15 would be like a dream.
I don't know how the Tiago fares in realworld city conditions, figures of Altroz would be lower than that i suppose.
I believe 15 is achievable in moderate city/highway use with a Tiago. My friends & family report that much from Pune & Navi Mumbai. Altroz might not be much lower considering the car isn't too heavy compared to the Tiago. If tuned & modified properly with the VVT, it might be on par with Tiago in fact.
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Old 10th December 2019, 11:01   #1166
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 400notout View Post
Where in the world is 15kmpl a poor city average? My spark have me an average of max 12- 13 in the city ( it was a 4 cylinder) and my city zx CVT gives me an average of 10-11 in the city.

From an average petrol engine the max fuel efficiency i expect in the city is 12. 15 would be like a dream.

I don't know how the Tiago fares in realworld city conditions, figures of Altroz would be lower than that i suppose.
I drive a diesel. I have been an avid traveller for a long time and diesels always have made more sense for me. My brother drives a petrol Ritz, which I do take out occasionally. But being the torque head that I am, I feel very comfortable driving a diesel and how to extract the most out of it.

Unfortunately, I don't have the need for another car, but if at all I think of a replacement for the Vista, it could be the Altroz EV.

Last edited by discoverwild : 10th December 2019 at 11:03.
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Old 10th December 2019, 11:09   #1167
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reinhard View Post
[list=1][*]Not a single one talked about the BSVI implementation. How has TML done the conversion of the 1.5L Revotorq? Are they using a DPF with AdBlu? Nobody showed the filling caps etc. What a shame.
Dunno the specifics, but BS-VI implementation doesnt require Adblue at this stage. If they had used it anyhow, the reviewers would have mentioned it. Say for the extra chore of filling up on urea solution and cost involved.

Current regulations canbe fulfilled with a DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter) & LNT (Lean NOx Trap).

In the future, when WLTP norms come along, SCR (Selective Catalytic Reduction / Adblue) will become unavoidable.

The recenty launched Kia Seltos goes this route as well.
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Old 10th December 2019, 11:13   #1168
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

Found some good Altroz Videos. Slowly Altroz is starting to look good to me. Repeated statements from all these videos are 1) Great Design 2) Back seat can accommodate 3 people comfortably 3) Rides well because of the wide body 4)enough power 5) waiting for AT and Turbo.








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Old 10th December 2019, 11:29   #1169
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

If you look carefully, among other modifications they have also integrated the exhaust manifold into the cylinder head itself, resulting in a single downpipe from cylinder head to catalyst. That is a very very big change in itself.
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Old 10th December 2019, 13:05   #1170
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Default re: Tata developing a premium hatchback, the Altroz. Edit: Launched at 5.29 lakh.

I could be a little biased as I currently drive a VW Golf vii Wagon (7th Gen that has just been replaced), which incidentally is one of the recognized ‘gold standard’ hatchbacks, along with others like the Corolla, Mazda 3 etc. So a lot of my perspective is based on my experience with the Golf.

The Altroz looks like a solid effort from Tata Motors, with all the fundamentals right – new platform, amazing looks, space and several thoughtful features (90 deg door opening is really good). However, as with most Tata Motors products, it appears to be partially finished and rushed to market.

I am very surprised that Tata which is making a big deal of this being a ‘Premium’ hatch has missed several basic features

1. Lack of 3 point seat belt for middle passenger
2. No Automatic antiglare IRVM
3. No Reach adjustable steering
4. 2 Airbags only
5. No automatic gear box
6. No all wheel disc brakes

These may have been acceptable 10 years ago, but in an era where a Hyundai will get all of this and more at maybe 10-15% higher price, Tata is going to find it hard to justify the ‘Premium’ tag for the Altroz

Sorry to say, but I am underwhelmed by this half-baked effort from Tata. If it is DoA like the Aria, then no amount of feature addition / fixing is going to help it recover.
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