[Nithesh_M]

HMSI isn't targeting mass market buyers. If they did these bikes would be made here and sold through all Honda dealerships. They have obviously taken note of the average monthly sales numbers for every manufacturer in this class and they're all averaging 600 units a month at best

These bikes will be imported at roughly 50 units a month just like the 650F which was imported at 20 units a month and the Africa Twin which was imported at 50 units a year or even the CBR150R whose engines were imported in 200 units per month. This prevents the situation TVS now finds themselves in.

If looks were all it took to sell a product then the TVS RR310s wouldn't be struggling to sell 1000 units every month. It has almost every feature in the looks department including a mini ducati-esque bodywork, usd forks and decent power.

The reality is that the 300-400 market is struggling to show decent numbers for any single manufacturer. Its a lot safer to import and sell small batches of bikes per month than to gamble your money by manufacturing 1000 bikes a month and only managing to sell half of it because you over estimated the demand in the market.

Mr.Bajaj is another example. He set out to sell 10k units of Dominars a month and he had an aggressive tv campaign to try and steal some RE customers, yet much like TVS he too suffered a big fall as the D400s struggle to do 10% of its monthly targets.

[Thebat]

Originally Posted by Nithesh_M

HMSI isn't targeting mass market buyers. If they did these bikes would be made here and sold through all Honda dealerships. They have obviously taken note of the average monthly sales numbers for every manufacturer in this class and they're all averaging 600 units a month at best.

The reality is that the 300-400 market is struggling to show decent numbers for any single manufacturer.

HMSI is sitting ducks is what it is. Most people looking to buy a bike in the segment would go for a Honda over others if the pricing was decent and had wider service support, this move just shows how content Honda are with their activa sales and a clear lack of commitment.

If it was a fringe manufacturer what you told would have made total sense, but Honda with all its resources sure can be a trailblazer if it decides to.

And finally if you haven't noticed Royal Enfield is surviving because of that segment and it will only grow in the coming days with the consumption pattern in India showing a clear uptrend.

[Nithesh_M]

Lots of manufacturers have trail blazed and ended up getting burnt. Yamaha with the R3, Kawasaki with the Ninja 400, Benelli with their 300s/600s, Suzuki with their GW250, Hyosung with their GT250R, Bajaj with their D400, and we can go on about that list.
RE has managed to survive with their outdated bikes for decades because its a generational thing, much like Harleys where prospective customers buy it because somebody in their family had one or because RE = macho image(I get asked why a man of my size doesn't own an RE).

Yet you see, Harleys are struggling worldwide today because they chose to stop catering to their old customers(who are dwindling in numbers thanks to old age/death) and are trying to get youngsters to latch onto the brand with their new projects. Unfortunately, the youngsters cannot afford one.
Ever wonder why RE is selling the 650s for rockbottom prices today? Look no further than the Harley story. Nostalgia can only do so much. If you don't innovate, you'll end up like most British/European automotive companies, either doomed to closure or bought by Asian billionaires. Even RE had a big setback with the 535 CGT which was supposed to be a gamechanger!

[ethanhunt123]

Originally Posted by Nithesh_M

Yet you see, Harleys are struggling worldwide today because they chose to stop catering to their old customers(who are dwindling in numbers thanks to old age/death) and are trying to get youngsters to latch onto the brand with their new projects. Unfortunately, the youngsters cannot afford one.

Yeah well you got it totally wrong. Harley is struggling because they chose to focus on their older customers - while the young one's soon realised that its selling outdated tech at platinum plated prices. Hence the young one's are either buying Italian / Jap / European bikes while the older gen is slowly reducing in number as age catches up.

Which is why the recent change in strategy by HD to modernize their portfolio and try to compete with the Japs/Europeans.

[Nithesh_M]

HD has been trying to woo youngsters for the last 5 years now. They even plant their motorcycles into Marvel films to target youngsters. Interestingly, the moment they experimented with new bikes is the same period of time their sales chart began to take a dip. Have you seen old RE loyalists take a dig at the new RE products saying "It doesn't thump so its not a real RE", the HD loyalists too took a dislike to RE's new offerings.


Might want to read this article on what made HD build smaller motorcycles over the last few years, and some responses from its target audience on why they wouldn't buy one.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/03/harl...ss-factor.html

MILLENNIAL DRIVE

After years of targeting older, affluent riders, Harley-Davidson is now focusing its marketing strategies on a younger generation as it seeks to expand its fan base.

The company recently started a social media campaign and last week launched 13 motorcycles with its new Milwaukee-Eight engine and futuristic styling.

Harley-Davidson has also partnered with motorcycle rental company EagleRider, which serves more than 100,000 riders annually and offers bike tours across the United States.

The company, which says 3 million people ride its various motorcycles in the United States, is aiming to add another 2 million riders in the country by 2027.

https://www.news18.com/news/auto/har...s-1505861.html

HD: A Victim of its own success
https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/...n-success.aspx


And ofcourse the closure of Victory Motorcycles 2 years ago.

Let us now get back to the topic of the CB300R as we've gone way out of topic here.

[ram.iyer95]

I kinda like the way this bike looks from the snaps, albeit a bit small. People shopping in this price bracket expect their rides to give that "big bike" feeling, which I feel is missing in this one. Looks more or less the same size as that of a Suzuki Gixxer, as some have mentioned.

Still, for someone like me who admires Japanese bikes for their fuss-free nature and reliability, this ticks most of the right boxes. All said, I'd rather pick the CBR250R over this one, even with it's slightly dated looks. That machine is all I'd ever need for my requirements.

I appreciate Honda for atleast bringing their fresh lineup of premium products in India. Now we need to see how many of those Facebook and YouTube comments section "keyboard warriors" who keep on bashing Honda for not launching their premium bikes actually get one of these home.

[aravind.anand]

Well the CBR250R is a brilliant package that has definitely not got the credit it deserves in our market. It might not be a racer's fancy toy, but as a solid tourer this bike can just not be ignored. It has spot on ergonomics, a very reliable engine, a usable pillion seat (which most other competitors lack today!) and the ability to cruise comfortably at 100 kmph all day even with a pillion and some luggage added.

In fact, the CBR offers so much and serves all my needs beautifully, so much so that I am having a hard time convincing my brain that the Interceptor 650 booking I made from my heart is actually a good decision. Really cannot fault the CBR250R as a product, what irks me though is the annoying service support that Honda dishes out. No offense, but I seriously cannot keep fighting with 20 other Activa owners every 6 months at the service centers. Most dealerships are overflowing with Honda scooters (good for them) and the experience is just chaotic, so I have been managing with just spares from their store for the last 2 years.

So I really do not doubt the CB300R for its ability as a product, but if Honda is going to have the same service support, then it makes a tough case for anybody who has already experiences their chaos. Only good point is that the reliability of the bikes really limit the number of visits to these dealerships

[targaryen]

While this bike and its price has divided opinions, it has really got me interested. I am on the look out for an all rounder bike in the range of 2-3 lacs. I am an average joe and I don't intend to break records doing laps, I don't intend to go off-roading, I don't intend to lean into corners and I don't care if my bike grabs eyeballs (in fact, I would be happier if it did not catch unwanted attention). I want a bike that I can use to ride to office comfortably and take on the highways occassionally. Most importantly it should bring a smile on my face without having to worry about niggles and breakdowns.

A few months ago, I short listed and test rode the Duke 390, Apache RR310, CBR250R and BMW G310R (The Dominar's riding position was a little too relaxed for me and personally was not a big fan of how it looks. Great VFM product otherwise!). The Duke 390 was a little too
visually loud for me and even a short test drive in winter warmed up my shins. I would definitely think twice before buying it in Ahmedabad where temperatures are above 35 degrees for most part of the year. The ownership reviews filled with niggles did not help the cause either. The Apache's riding position was a little too sporty for me and the dealership experience was a major turn off. Same story for CBR250R (it is not under the superbike category for Honda). The guys at Honda would rather sell me 2 Activas than a CBR250R (I hope it is not the case with CB300R also ). The G310R nailed it in terms of the overall experience right from the dealership to the bike itself but the on road prices were way beyond my budget and I was left smitten with the baby GS more than the G310R. I have received many calls from them offering discounts but the projected service costs in the long run are higher than my car. So I had to sadly cross it off my list.

Soon after, the Jawas and the Interceptor 650 were launched. Oh boy, both these bikes looked sweet and fit right into my budget. I checked out the Interceptor first. RE has really upped its game this time and it is irresistible at this price. However, for my frame, I found the bike to be too heavy and I would not feel confident if I ever faced a breakdown on this beast. Moreover, being a brand new engine and product for RE, I was hesitant in becoming a guinea pig customer. I would wait a year from launch before buying any RE. (No offence meant to RE loyalists!) About the Jawas, well, I would never book a bike without a test ride. Forget test rides, I think they are yet to open a dealership in my city.

I was keenly following the CB300R ever since Honda announced it would launch it in India. The pricing of less than 2.5 lacs ex showroom made the deal even sweeter. This bike ticks almost all the boxes for me on paper. A tried and tested global engine. Light weight and flickable. Honda's reliability. Sound safety features. The fact that Honda considers it a "superbike" has my hopes up on the dealership and service experience too.
Further, since it is a CKD I am assuming it is manufactured where all the other CB300R are manufactured for global sales and quality or first batch niggles should not be an issue at all. Final verdict is awaited till I get to test ride it though. I think it would be wrong to write off this bike so early.

[payeng]

Originally Posted by targaryen

While this bike and its price has divided opinions, it has really got me interested. I am on the look out for an all rounder bike in the range of 2-3 lacs. I am an average joe and I don't intend to break records doing laps, I don't intend to go off-roading, I don't intend to lean into corners and I don't care if my bike grabs eyeballs (in fact, I would be happier if it did not catch unwanted attention). I want a bike that I can use to ride to office comfortably and take on the highways occassionally. Most importantly it should bring a smile on my face without having to worry about niggles and breakdowns.

The Yamaha MT-15 Could be an Option. By the way the bookings seems to have started as well. NEWS SOURCE:

[am1m]

Originally Posted by targaryen

I am on the look out for an all rounder bike in the range of 2-3 lacs. I am an average joe and I don't intend to break records doing laps...(in fact, I would be happier if it did not catch unwanted attention). I want a bike that I can use to ride to office comfortably and take on the highways occasionally. The Dominar's riding position was a little too relaxed for me and personally was not a big fan of how it looks. Great VFM product otherwise!

Originally Posted by targaryen

The Duke 390 was a little too visually loud for me The Apache's riding position was a little too sporty for me The guys at Honda would rather sell me 2 Activas than a CBR250R but the projected service costs in the long run are higher than my car. So I had to sadly cross it off my list. I was hesitant in becoming a guinea pig customer. I would wait a year from launch before buying any RE. I would never book a bike without a test ride.

Originally Posted by targaryen

This bike ticks almost all the boxes for me on paper. A tried and tested global engine. Final verdict is awaited till I get to test ride it though. I think it would be wrong to write off this bike so early.

My gosh, it's as if I were typing all that! Agree with ALL those points, my thought process and process of elimination exactly. So I guess there are a few of us who think this way.

Add to that I've owned a Bajaj bike and an RE bike for more than a decade each and I'll never buy another RE (bad quality and the absolute worst service and dealer experience in Bangalore), and most probably not a Bajaj either (bad quality, but good service backup), though the Dominar does seem decent.

[targaryen]

Originally Posted by am1m

My gosh, it's as if I were typing all that! Agree with ALL those points, my thought process and process of elimination exactly. So I guess there are a few of us who think this way.

Good to know I am not the only one on this boat after all. It seems we have more in common because of where we come from. My past motorcycles were a Bajaj and a Royal Enfield too. I owned a Pulsar from 2008-2012 and a Classic 500 for some time too. Bought a TVS Jupiter in 2015 for peace of mind after a hellish ownership experience with the RE. The bike keeda (bug) has been biting me ever since!

Coming back to the topic, I hear Honda is planning to launch a slew of bikes in the mid-size segment under their Silver Wing campaign. Is this something like what Maruti did with Nexa? Honda really needs to improve on their dealership experience and distinguishing their premium products from the scooters.

[Nithesh_M]

SilverWing is pretty much like BigWing dealership networks in Thailand and other countries. You will eventually find bikes and maxiscooters between 150cc-1800cc sold through the Wing dealerships.

[Mafia]

Originally Posted by ethanhunt123

Yeah well you got it totally wrong. Harley is struggling because they chose to focus on their older customers - while the young one's soon realised that its selling outdated tech at platinum plated prices. Hence the young one's are either buying Italian / Jap / European bikes while the older gen is slowly reducing in number as age catches up.

Which is why the recent change in strategy by HD to modernize their portfolio and try to compete with the Japs/Europeans.

+1 on the Harley analysis

The younger crowd simply prefers the convenience of a gearless scooter for commute.

I did not like the CB300R looks much. I don't really think the design is cool enough to buy. it looks it can hide in plain sight.

can't comment on the performance front as of now.

[Nithesh_M]

A somewhat size comparison between the hefty Ninja H2 SX SE and the CB300R. Turns out its not as small as you see from the images.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NklxY9a3QKE

[Axe77]

Love the video. Whatever I saw of it.