[-xplora-]

Meanwhile, this is what my dealer's accessories guy sent on Whatsapp - the touchscreen system offered for BR-V (35k inclusive of navigation & reversing camera). It's made by AVN Inc. Anybody heard of it?

Its a brand of Caska India. They make OE AVNs for most of the Indian cars and also universal ones.
http://caskaindia.brandwebdirect.com...vn-concert.htm

I am planning to go for an Android based solution, as I really need audio quality to be high and adding a USB external 192k DAC will not be possible on these Windows CE based closed devices. Will replace the stock speakers with components and put a multi-channel amp plus sub and am good to go.

Plus there are units with Android 5.1.1 now available, giving you the latest functionalities and familiar apps. Unless you cut any wires and/or harnesses I don't think the warranty will be void. The dealers might crib about it since you have not bought the AVN from them, but I am willing to take that risk for a better device.

In retrospect, I am glad that BR-V does not have an AVN, and no additional cost associated with it. I would have thrown it out anyway.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by riteshritesh

Which cars are safe in the last row(2nd in a sedan, 3rd in a 3 row car)? An average car buying family has a budget of 8 lakhs. What options do they have?
.

Thanks to the large boot area (with the 3rd row up) and large rear overhang, kids in the 3rd row are likely to be safer in the BR-V than in a hatchback.



Safety concerns about kids in 3rd row in a Suzuki Ertiga or Mahindra XUV 500 are probably valid. The 3rd row seat in these 2 cars are extremely close to the rear tailgate.

Originally Posted by riteshritesh

Can you check on the warranty, if the HU is replaced with an aftermarket unit. To lose a 3 year warranty, suddenly doesn't make sense to me or maybe I can retain the original set and put it back in case I have to claim warranty.

If I ask, he will probably say "Yes saar, bye bye warranty"

[BUXX]

Took the TD today of the Petrol-loved the package.

Excellent engine,light clutch, great AC, nice visibility,OE Sound system is good, mileage in my 6-7km TD was about 13.5KMPL.

Doesn't feel long in the tail.

Yes there are cons, it is too narrow -at best, a 6 seater; 7 if you wanna "adjust". will carry the associated luggage with aplomb.

Low as well, but once you are in the cockpit -these are forgiven .Seating position is high enough .

If one is in the market for a 6/7 seater Petrol Automatic Crossover - there's nothing else in the market in NCR. Period.

And call it a Crossover when introducing it to friends . Avoid the SUV/MPV debate & sound like a propah expert.

[BlackPearl]

Excellent review Aditya and Rehaan!

Originally Posted by Aditya

Honda has a lot riding on the BR-V, especially since the Mobilio flopped. The BR-V uses the same platform as the Brio, Amaze & Mobilio. Of the 3, it's most similar to the Mobilio. Measuring 4,453 / 4,456 mm in length, 1,735 mm in width and 1,666 mm in height, it is the largest car based on this platform too. Interestingly, the BR-V's wheelbase is 10 mm longer than that of the Mobilio!

Attachment 1510373

I have one query - the wheelbase of the BR-V looks longer than the Duster in the images and in flesh as well, however the numbers show it is the opposite. Is it an optical illusion and am I the only one suffering from it?

[guptad42]

Honda has priced this above the City hoping for an SUV premium. The problem is that does not have any SUV like presence on the road.

And it has no premium feel inside the cabin to persuade people to pay more. Creta has that.

After the initial launch period, they'll have to position it a lac below the city to push numbers.

[BUXX]

There are a few concerns that I have:

• Comfort level over Long drives
• Ride quality over bad surfaces
• AC Cooling for 3rd row folks

Will help if some other members are able to share their experience /observations on these aspects .

Thanks!

[riteshritesh]

Originally Posted by guptad42

Honda has priced this above the City hoping for an SUV premium. The problem is that does not have any SUV like presence on the road.

And it has no premium feel inside the cabin to persuade people to pay more. Creta has that.

After the initial launch period, they'll have to position it a lac below the city to push numbers.

I think the problem lies with people comparing it with the Creta/S-Cross/Duster,Crysta etc etc. These are all Diesel 5 seater vehicles ( except Crysta)
Leaving aside whether it is a SUV, UV, MUV, Sedan, Hatchback, Crossover or a mixture of 2 or more, try to compare it with any other 6/7 seater petrol automatic vehicle and post your feedback.
When I do that, I don't mind paying the 15 Lakhs OTR asking price. I would have paid 18 Lakhs too. If people are willing to pay 25 Lakhs OTR for a Crysta V Auto, there will surely be people willing to pay 15 Lakhs for the BRV.
Price correction or appreciation is Honda's lookout. Why bother

[SmartCat]

Yeah, 100% of members on Team-BHP who have either booked or expressed interest in BR-V is because of 3 row seating.

Creta/Duster/Brezza/Ecosport seem like a competitor to BR-V only for casual observers - but not to those in the market looking for a new car. Those interested in Creta/Brezza etc will attach zero value to the 3rd row seat or roof mounted AC or the tumbling 2nd row seat or the 700 litres boot space when the 3rd row is folded down. When you assign zero weightage to the extra practicality of BR-V, obviously Creta/Brezza will always seem better value proposition.

The real competitor for BR-V is Ertiga/Mobilio/Lodgy and base/mid variants of XUV500 and perhaps even Innova. People who are interested in TUV300, Scorpio and Strome might also evaluate BR-V - especially those who like the flexibility of the jump seats in these 3 models.

That's why the real BR-V customer is likely to walk in to a Renault showroom to look at the Lodgy (not Duster). The prospective BR-V customer will walk into Maruti showroom to look at Ertiga Zdi/Zxi (not Brezza). An actual BR-V customer is unlikely to enter a Hyundai showroom.

Originally Posted by BlackPearl

I have one query - the wheelbase of the BR-V looks longer than the Duster in the images and in flesh as well, however the numbers show it is the opposite. Is it an optical illusion and am I the only one suffering from it?

Optical illusion because of front and rear overhang of BR-V

[-xplora-]

Originally Posted by smartcat

Yeah, 100% of members on Team-BHP who have either booked or expressed interest in BR-V is because of 3 row seating.

Creta/Duster/Brezza/Ecosport seem like a competitor to BR-V only for casual observers - but not to those in the market looking for a new car. Those interested in Creta/Brezza etc will attach zero value to the 3rd row seat or roof mounted AC or the tumbling 2nd row seat or the 700 litres boot space when the 3rd row is folded down. When you assign zero weightage to the extra practicality of BR-V, obviously Creta/Brezza will always seem better value proposition.

I, for one, am an exception. I don't have any use of a 6-7 seater. I had booked Ecosport AT, they did not deliver on time. Had booked Creta petrol AT, then shifted to BR-V. Reason it offers "much more". Yes you can argue interiors, but I like them. Rest of the "missing features" argument is not worthy of discussion as everything is available after-market especially a much better AVN than stalk. Like mentioned in my earlier post, there hare hardly one or two things in Creta petrol AT better than BR-V, while BR-V has 10 things better or not available in Creta.

Yeah and those road-trips with friends or extra luggage, why not ? . Looks and performance department you really cant equate it with Ertiga or Lodgy. I think the real competitor for this product on the low end is Ertiga, ie those only looking for the budget as the main thing, on the other end its XUV W6 etc. There will be cross-shopping of Cretas/Innovas and the likes.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by -xplora-

Yeah and those road-trips with friends or extra luggage, why not ?

See? See? It's not obvious but its sublimal. You are assigning some weightage to the extra practicality bit

Yes you can argue interiors, but I like them.

Same camp. For me, the interiors of the BR-V is a "deal-maker", not a deal-breaker. The dash of BR-V has good design flair, intrument console looks classy and steering (both steering wheels!) feels comfortable.

The biggest "deal-maker" is the all-black interiors.

I have been in 2 cars (Optra LT & Civic VMT) with beige interiors for the last 12 years - beige leather seats, beige plastics etc. If I see beige again in a car, I will throw up. I even seriously thought about changing my old Civic's beige interiors into black.

Aspects like exterior styling and interiors (design part) depend on personal tastes.

However, one can definitely say that QUALITY of Creta's interiors is better than BR-V's - because quality is measurable, DESIGN is not.

[adimicra]

I am very interested to see how the market responds to the BR-V.
Going by the response in Team BHP, it seems like BR-V is heading for a disaster.
But, I won't write it off so soon just because it's a car with a unique positioning and so it's very difficult to predict. Just imagine which car buyers can consider the BRV.

Ertiga
Innova
XUV
Lodgy

Creta
Brezza
Duster
Terrano

TUV300
Scorpio
Storme

Other than the above, it can also be appealing to the C+ segment buyers like - City/Ciaz
Verna/Vento.

Now, if you look at the sales threads, the total 7-seater MUV segment is hardly 10-12K per month. BR-V should take a significant chunk of it. Say, 2K units per month but that can hardly be called a success.
The real success of the BR-V depends on whether it can take away customers from the Creta/Brezza/Duster segment which we need to wait and see. My gut feel says it can be a reasonable success and do around 4K per month.

[SmartCat]

I have been poring over the prices of various cars in Autocar India magazine this lazy rainy Sunday afternoon. Many a times, I have seen comments along these lines "Brio is a 5 Lacs car, how can BRV cost 16 Lacs"? .

1) The biggest flaw with the above statement is that it compares the base model of Brio with the top end model of BR-V.

2) Turn it around. The top end model of Brio costs Rs. 8.41 Lacs while the base model of BR-V costs Rs. 10.71 Lacs

A difference of Rs. 2.3 Lacs - not too shabby eh?

So the biggest flaw in the "Brio costs 5 lacs, BRV costs 16 Lacs" statement is that it ignores the difference in features, safety, practicality and various engine/transmission options. Honda is just giving customers a choice by offering Brio at Rs. 5.3 Lacs and BR-V at Rs. 16.3 Lacs.

Price difference of Brio/BR-V is similar to price difference of base and top models of Hyundai Elite i20/Creta and Renault Logan/Duster.

I hope this thoroughly addresses all the VFM concerns about BR-V

Originally Posted by adimicra

Now, if you look at the sales threads, the total 7-seater MUV segment is hardly 10-12K per month. BR-V should take a significant chunk of it. Say, 2K units per month but that can hardly be called a success.
The real success of the BR-V depends on whether it can take away customers from the Creta/Brezza/Duster segment which we need to wait and see. My gut feel says it can be a reasonable success and do around 4K per month.

wow, I never realized that MUV segment was so small. If you add 4K from XUV 500 and "jump seat SUVs" from Mahindra/Tata stable, it adds to 20K per month I guess. Drawing customers away from "Jump seat SUVs" might be difficult though - I think most customers opt for it because of the toughness of body-on-frame chassis.

[Ragavsr]

Originally Posted by smartcat

I have been poring over the prices of various cars in Autocar India magazine this lazy rainy Sunday afternoon. Many a times, I have seen comments along these lines "Brio is a 5 Lacs car, how can BRV cost 16 Lacs"? .

1) The biggest flaw with the above statement is that it compares the base model of Brio with the top end model of BR-V.

2) Turn it around. The top end model of Brio costs Rs. 8.41 Lacs while the base model of BR-V costs Rs. 10.71 Lacs

A difference of Rs. 2.3 Lacs - not too shabby eh?

So the biggest flaw in the "Brio costs 5 lacs, BRV costs 16 Lacs" statement is that it ignores the difference in features, safety, practicality and various engine/transmission options. Honda is just giving customers a choice by offering Brio at Rs. 5.3 Lacs and BR-V at Rs. 16.3 Lacs.

Price difference of Brio/BR-V is similar to price difference of base and top models of Hyundai Elite i20/Creta and Renault Logan/Duster.

I hope this thoroughly addresses all the VFM concerns about BR-V
.

The main reason why people are calling a BRV a 16 lakh Brio is because the Brio interiors are poor and shabby for a car costing 5 lakhs leave alone a 16 lakh BRV.

Make no mistake a Brio is a 5 lakh car. Comparing apple to apple , a Base Brio to a Base BRV is just double the price.

Competitors may cost the same but then they have better quality. A 6 lakh i20 would blow away a 16 lakh BRV when it comes to interior fit and finish and interior quality.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by Ragavsr

The main reason why people are calling a BRV a 16 lakh Brio is because the Brio interiors are poor and shabby for a car costing 5 lakhs leave alone a 16 lakh BRV. Make no mistake a Brio is a 5 lakh car. Comparing apple to apple , a Base Brio to a Base BRV is just double the price.

I'm not sure if you got the gist of the argument.

Brio is a 5.3 Lakh car because Honda wanted the car to compete with everything from a Wagon R to Swift. Other than 4 tyres and a steering wheel, it pretty much has nothing. If you want the basic airbags/ABS version, it would be a 6.9 Lacs car.

Essentially, if Honda had made up its mind right from the beginning not to introduce bargain basement Brio, then it would have always been a 7 lacs car. Get the drift now?

Add ABS (10k cost) to base BRV, and we have a 10.85 Lacs car.

How would sharing of the dashboard of a 7 lacs car with a 11 Lacs car make it sacrilegious? And hey, right now, Brio still has old interiors.

Competitors may cost the same but then they have better quality. A 6 lakh i20 would blow away a 16 lakh BRV when it comes to interior fit and finish and interior quality.

There are two mistakes in the above statement, made only to prove a particular point -

1) BRV is a 16 lakhs car only if you want it to be. Why are you NOT calling it a 10.75 lakh car? What if there was no VX variant at all? What if there was only a S variant in petrol?

2) Basic 6.8 Lacs Elite i20's interior quality (and attention to detail) will blow away the interior quality of 10.75 BRV, I agree. But can the Elite i20 seat 7 people? It is like saying - the Grand i10's interior will blow away the interiors of Mahindra Thar. But hello? Can the Grand i10 go off road? Does it make Mahindra Thar poor VFM?

Interior quality is only one aspect that you need to consider to evaluate a car. There are 10 others. It CAN be deal breaker, yes, depending on customer preferences.

[Ragavsr]

Originally Posted by smartcat

I'm not sure if you got the gist of the argument.

Brio is a 5.3 Lakh car because Honda wanted the car to compete with everything from a Wagon R to Swift. Other than 4 tyres and a steering wheel, it pretty much has nothing. If you want the basic airbags/ABS version, it would be a 6.9 Lacs car.

Essentially, if Honda had made up its mind right from the beginning not to introduce bargain basement Brio, then it would have always been a 7 lacs car. Get the drift now?

Add ABS (10k cost) to base BRV, and we have a 10.85 Lacs car.

How would sharing of the dashboard of a 7 lacs car with a 11 Lacs car make it sacrilegious? And hey, right now, Brio still has old interiors.



There are two mistakes in the above statement, made only to prove a particular point -

1) BRV is a 16 lakhs car only if you want it to be. Why are you NOT calling it a 10.75 lakh car? What if there was no VX variant at all? What if there was only a S variant in petrol?

2) Basic 6.8 Lacs Elite i20's interior quality (and attention to detail) will blow away the interior quality of 10.75 BRV, I agree. But can the Elite i20 seat 7 people? It is like saying - the Grand i10's interior will blow away the interiors of Mahindra Thar. But hello? Can the Grand i10 go off road? Does it make Mahindra Thar poor VFM?

Interior quality is only one aspect that you need to consider to evaluate a car. There are 10 others. It CAN be deal breaker, yes, depending on customer preferences.

LOL! Behold! If interior quality is not the only criteria then having 7 seats should not be one as well.

If seating 7 is the only criteria there are cheaper options like the Sumo Bolero etc.

A thar has a unique selling point in that it can go offroad and costs peanuts to buy.

The BRV doesn't have a USP . Because at a premium price of 16 lacks , other criteria like interior quality refinement also matters. For example , Toyota can't sell Land Cruiser with just off road ability alone, it needs confort, luxury and power to justify its price tag.

As long as Honda sells a BRV for 16 lakhs and a Brio for 5 lakhs , I will consider a BRV as an overgrown Brio for 16 lakhs.

You may think of it as 10.75 lakh car . Good for you. But a 10.75 lakh BRV has nothing just like the 5 lakh Brio. And before making a direct comparison about the base Brio lacking equipment that the base BRV has , consider that at 10.75 lakhs ( at 2x brio) , having airbags is no rocket science.

The Brio Amaze Mobilio and now the BRV reek of cost cutting and poor quality inside and out no to mention terrible NVH on the diesel and a god awful CVT on the petrol. What is barely acceptable on a 5 lakh Brio is just not good enough at 10 lakhs leave alone at 16 lakhs.

The BRV should be priced as much as an Ertiga or a max 50k above it. It is grossly overpriced by about 3 lakhs.

All the 7 seaters in this price range look overpriced just because of one culprit : The XUV 500.