[bhpindian]

WhatCar India have published a comparison road test between Hyundai Creta and Honda BRV.
Hyundai Creta is rated better by them and wins the duel.
0-100 kmph figures for BRV is 16.25 sec. Creta achieves it in 10.81 sec.
Acceleration from 50-80 kmph through gears for BRV is 5.49 sec and for Creta is 5.01 sec.

[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by smartcat

8) Extending the logic to Creta, had it been a 7 seater like the BR-V, each model have been Rs. 2 Lacs more expensive than it is now.

9) While BR-V petrol/auto/diesel ranges from Rs. 10.7 to Rs.16.2 Lacs, Creta 7 seater's price range would have been Rs. 13.2 Lacs to Rs. 20.2 Lacs on road Bangalore.

The above points are wrong.
Ertiga = Swift + higher excise (lion's share) + bigger vehicle frame costs (3.9 -> 4.27m) + 3rd row seats cost
Creta five to seven seats would just involve lesser leg room for the middle row and the cost of the third row.
Creta is already in higher excise bracket
Creta length = ertiga = 4.27m
I would be surprised if third row of seats would cost more than an additional 20-25k. (Duster 2 jump seats = 6.5k incl installation per dealer).

[riteshritesh]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

I would be surprised if third row of seats would cost more than an additional 20-25k. (Duster 2 jump seats = 6.5k incl installation per dealer).

But then, they would need to make the 2nd row movable and foldable to access the 3rd row. Or are you considering a fixed 2nd row with Jump seats thrown for + 2 seating.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

The above points are wrong.
Ertiga = Swift + higher excise (lion's share) + bigger vehicle frame costs (3.9 -> 4.27m) + 3rd row seats cost
Creta five to seven seats would just involve lesser leg room for the middle row and the cost of the third row.
Creta is already in higher excise bracket
Creta length = ertiga = 4.27m
I would be surprised if third row of seats would cost more than an additional 20-25k. (Duster 2 jump seats = 6.5k incl installation per dealer).

Nice catch. This actually concurs with my view that BR-V is a Brezza segment car, and not Creta's.

1) Brezza ducks under the 4 meter length rule and hence qualifies for 8% excise duty on ex-factory price. And is priced from Rs. 8.7 to Rs. 12 Lacs on road Bangalore.

2) BR-V, despite coming under 20% excise duty structure on ex-factory price is priced at Rs. 12.4 Lacs to Rs. 14.8 Lacs (for V Variant). Not just that, BR-V is a 7 seater and hence costs associated with it are included in the on road price.

3) The basic diesel Creta equipped with airbags/ABS starts at Rs. 15.2 Lacs, even though it has none of the costs associated with being a 7 seater.

So when evaluating the "feel good factor" of interiors of BR-V, its best to compare it with Brezza, Ecosport & base Duster - rather than higher segment Creta.

Disclaimer: No disrespect to Brezza/Ecosport/Base Duster/Creta owners

[BUXX]

So when evaluating the "feel good factor" of interiors of BR-V, its best to compare it with Brezza, Ecosport & base Duster - rather than higher segment Creta.

^^ Why? When Honda themselves compare it to the Duster & Creta?!

If you have visited the showroom recently , they have got a frigging tabletop calendar like thingy drawing minute comparisons with these two!!

So much for Honda not calling it an SUV anywhere !

Honda wants to have its cake & eat it too. Nah uh...!

p.s: XUV W6 1.99L AT launching in 15 days-more competition for BR-V

[AYP]

Originally Posted by smartcat

Nice catch. This actually concurs with my view that BR-V is a Brezza segment car, and not Creta's.

1) Brezza ducks under the 4 meter length rule and hence qualifies for 8% excise duty on ex-factory price. And is priced from Rs. 8.7 to Rs. 12 Lacs on road Bangalore.

2) BR-V, despite coming under 20% excise duty structure on ex-factory price is priced at Rs. 12.4 Lacs to Rs. 14.8 Lacs (for V Variant). Not just that, BR-V is a 7 seater and hence costs associated with it are included in the on road price.

A prospective Brezza customer might end up with the BR-V but that doesn't mean that they fall in the same category. The Creta, BR-V and the Duster are a segment above the Brezza and the Ecosport.
People aren't going to go through these tax structures and evaluate the feel good factor of the interiors of the BR-V. They might just settle for the Creta SX.

Originally Posted by smartcat

3) The basic diesel Creta equipped with airbags/ABS starts at Rs. 15.2 Lacs, even though it has none of the costs associated with being a 7 seater.

The basic diesel Creta(1.4) equipped with airbags/ABS can be had for about 11 lakhs on road and the 1.6 diesel can be had for about 13.5 lakhs.

[lovetorque]

Honda BR-V gets 9,000 bookings, waiting period of 9 weeks: http://indianautosblog.com/2016/06/h...ookings-234163

This looks bit strange for me. Is that Honda scheduled to manufacture little numbers (less than 2k) per month?

[m8002?]

Originally Posted by lovetorque

This looks bit strange for me. Is that Honda scheduled to manufacture little numbers (less than 2k) per month?

Doesn't make sense to ramp up production to 5000 because they have to ramp it down to 2k in a couple of months.


This thread reminds me of the old jazz thread where honda fans were justifying the exorbitant pricing for quality. It went dead when.honda cut the price. I dont think br-v can sustain more than 1.5k numbers per month in the long run with this pricing. Unfortunately for honda, there are only so many fans ready to plonk their money.

[-xplora-]

Originally Posted by m8002?

Doesn't make sense to ramp up production to 5000 because they have to ramp it down to 2k in a couple of months.


This thread reminds me of the old jazz thread where honda fans were justifying the exorbitant pricing for quality. It went dead when.honda cut the price. I dont think br-v can sustain more than 1.5k numbers per month in the long run with this pricing. Unfortunately for honda, there are only so many fans ready to plonk their money.

I can tell you I am not a big Honda fan, never was. Having said that, I do not understand why pricing issue and missing RevCam etc. is being highlighted so much. Agreed its priced a little higher, but 50k - 75k more than we would have liked for a vehicle you are atleast going to use for 4-5 years, I dont think its a huge issue.

Creta is priced higher than the vehicle it is. Still its selling like hot cake. Simply because it is sitting where there is no exact competition. People are paying that extra 70k premium for it and waiting for it as well. I think for those who are looking at a petrol vehicle will crib about BR-Vs pricing a bit but still will buy it nonetheless.

[searacer932]

Originally Posted by searacer932

Amaze as well gets a 100PS engine and it's the same 100PS engine on BR-V. The only difference being the BR-V gets the 6th gear. Why can't Honda do some differentiation here? Offer more power on the BR-V in comparison to the C1 segment sedan? Too much of an ask for Honda?

Honda seem to have a 1.6iDtec engine option. May be the 1.5iDtec was derived from it. It would have been nice if Honda had launched the BR-V with a 1.6iDtec option. The fact that they have the released BR-V with the same engine and with the same state of tune as in Amaze just shows to me that they are taking the Indian customers for granted. Why not offer 1.6iDtec on the BR-V as a differentiator?

[swiftdiesel]

Originally Posted by searacer932

Honda seem to have a 1.6iDtec engine option. May be the 1.5iDtec was derived from it. It would have been nice if Honda had launched the BR-V with a 1.6iDtec option. The fact that they have the released BR-V with the same engine and with the same state of tune as in Amaze just shows to me that they are taking the Indian customers for granted. Why not offer 1.6iDtec on the BR-V as a differentiator?

Unfortunately, every other manufacturer does that, so why not Honda? Renault with the 1.5 dci although they have a nice 1.6 dci, Maruti with the 1.3, GM also with the 1.3, Ford with the 1.5 TDCi although they have a nice 1.6 in the line up. In a mileage conscious market like ours, the smaller, the better in terms of sales, I'm afraid. That said, my problem with Honda is to launch the 1.5 idtec with the same tuning, from the Jazz to the BR-V, all with the 99 BHP, 200 Nm. That shows utter disregard on their part to ensure appropriate engine specs for the application.

[Doylthippo]

Originally Posted by searacer932

Honda seem to have a 1.6iDtec engine option. May be the 1.5iDtec was derived from it.

Even though Honda launched BR-V from Brio platform, they have plonked in engines of CITY platform. Still if the market feels engines are from amaze, there is no differentiaton that Honda can make in 1.5 or 1.6.
IMHO 1.5 will be enough of an engine in India for all manufacturers. we may dream about 1.6, but mass market won't even think about it. For example, i have come across only one 1.6 S-Cross till now on roads.

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by searacer932

Why not offer 1.6iDtec on the BR-V as a differentiator?

The original 1.6L Earth Dreams i-DTEC mill wasn't compatible with India's diesel back when it was brought to our country for the first time. Hence the original engine was re-bored and downsized to a 1.5L unit which was modified extensively to make it compatible with India's diesel.

Also, the 1.6L diesel comes under a higher excise tax bracket in our country. It would have made all the 1.6L-powered cars even more costlier. (Link (Honda BR-V : Official Review))

[m8002?]

Originally Posted by -xplora-

Creta is priced higher than the vehicle it is. Still its selling like hot cake. Simply because it is sitting where there is no exact competition. People are paying that extra 70k premium for it and waiting for it as well. I think for those who are looking at a petrol vehicle will crib about BR-Vs pricing a bit but still will buy it nonetheless.

Creta had a clear positioning(SUV looks with quality interiors). BR-V doesnt. Even in this thread, for features it compared with Brezza, ecosport but for pricing with Creta!
Personally, I think even Creta is overpriced and wouldnt buy it but many people dont think so. And Creta/Duster/Terrano prices are so high isnt justification for BR-V to be priced high. Maruti learnt that lesson with S-cross pricing and corrected it soon. Will Honda do it? They already have it priced 20% less than the City in Indonesia...the price point where it rightly fits. Why this special treatment for India?

Frankly, even I am in the market for a 7 seater and was eagerly waiting for BR-V. But the product is so underwhelming and overpriced for what it offers. Many (including me) feel that Honda is taking us for a ride(and an expensive ride at that ) with a rebadged Mobilio. They should have priced it a little above Ertiga in current form or build a good platform ( wider with Honda City features ) and then launched at this price.It would have nicely fit in the slot emptied by Innova.

It quacks like a duck, walks like a duck but Honda sharpens its beak and wants me to believe its an eagle? Not happening!

P.S. Duck is just an analogy. No intention on the looks of the vehicle or offend any owners. I really find the BR-V decent in the looks dept.

[arun_josie]

IMO the cars that we can compare BR-V with are Mobilio, Lodgy and Ertiga. These all are 7 seaters within a certain budget. Comparing with 5 seaters like Brezza, Ecosport, Creta doesn't make much sense.

Something that puzzles me is, a top end diesel BR-V at 16L with top speed restricted to 140Kmh is same as Amaze which is 6L+ cheaper, engine tuning is same as well despite the huge price difference between BR-V and Amaze. But Honda city doesn't have this limitation which is at the same price range of BR-V.