[hemanth.anand]

Originally Posted by CarguyNish

They say, A Picture is worth a Thousand Words.

Although I agree with this, it doesn't hold true in case of still images of an accident. In case of such images, "A Picture leaves a thousand questions unanswered"

Have a look at this Tiago. Structurally intact.

This incident took place on Mumbai Pune Expressway. And according to the owner, a large container Truck driven by Drunk Driver scrapped the left portion of the car. Both the passenger & driver came out unhurt.

If cars could lose their structural integrity upon just "scraping" by other vehicles, our country's population would have reduced further because of accidents.

How did the impact happen? What were the speeds of the vehicles during impact? At what angles did the vehicles collide with each other? Was the car dragged on after the collision? lot many things questions need to be answered before you can imply that the structure of the car is well made and very safe for occupants (your post looks like you are implying that).

[CarguyNish]

Another Tiago bites the dust, this time in Tamil Nadu.







Looking at the pictures, looks like the case of Topple. Experts - Is it so ?

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

In case of such images, "A Picture leaves a thousand questions unanswered"

Oops, I forgot to change the last word. Thanks for correcting.

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

How did the impact happen?

A Container hit the Tiago side on, and scrapped the left side part of the car. Maybe a case where overtaking went wrong which resulted in less space to get back onto Lane.

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

What were the speeds of the vehicles during impact?

Not sure about car, but the owner says the truck was at 80 kmph.

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

At what angles
did the vehicles collide with each other?

Don't have much details on this, but I guess both vehicles were in parallel. It could be a case where either the car was Overtaking and came close towards the container of vice versa.

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

Was the car dragged on after the collision?

Again don't no if the car was dragged or not. I don't see any signs of it. Owner hasn't mentioned much details.

Originally Posted by hemanth.anand

lot many things questions need to be answered before you can imply that the structure of the car is well made and very safe for occupants.

I won't say that Tiago is safe or unsafe. Looking at the damage & the intact A Pillar, I mentioned structurally intact. I might be wrong, I will accept that . It is a heavy car, and although the Heaviness doesn't have anything to do with structure rigidity.

In crash test, the Side On Collision normally has more impact on doors & Pillars. That's for impact perpendicular to the side of the car. Here, it's a different case.

[LoneRidder]

Originally Posted by CarguyNish

Attachment 1626986

Looking at the pictures, looks like the case of Topple. Experts - Is it so ?

Looks like collision with a truck? The car is in a very bad shape. Hope it was ripped open to get the passengers out and not due to the impact of the collision!

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by audioholic

The Biker did stick to the side many times but that is equally dangerous. If he was riding on the edge of the road and due to the space created if the car overtook him, a slight left steering of the car could have again pushed the bike off road. This video explains the scenario well.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

My personal take : dreadknight5 has a point. It might not be a law but a just you can say some common sense or even courtesy. If any other vehicle wants to overtake you and is constantly attempting to do so, why not let it pass ?

I went back and saw the video, and here is my take. I ride a lot, as well as extensively drive cars in city and on highway.

The biker is well within safe limits, if he moves to the center it is to either keep a clean and safe line or to avoid something ahead of him. You will know if you look at the video from a rider perspective, when he sees a slow moving bike ahead he is dropping speed and moving towards center Or while clearing for the turn and that too when he has good visibility for it.

Somewhat in tune with slowing down in a pool of water so that you dont splash water on bystanders and two wheeler riders.

Yes absolutely true, but what makes you assume the biker was even aware of what was behind?

I have faced a very similar situation of rogue taxi driver popping out from my blind spot and pushing me off my lane. He was behind me and i was also hopping he would overtake me when things were clear ahead. Fortunately i had a fast bike and could accelerate away from the situation. Yes when you have fast bikes, you can use its power to get out off such situation rather than brake and land up in trouble. No in this ^ situation that would not have helped.

On the whole, the biker in question did move towards left side of lane once when the car attempted to overtake, but its highly possible that biker wasn't expecting the car to attempt another overtaking when a bus was coming from opposite lane.

Bingo! ^^

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

He's aware of the bike: he's overtaking it.

No. The mistake is on one side. First, he is not in the middle of the road, he is in the middle of his lane. Where he has a right to be.

Originally Posted by Acharya

At the end of the day being alive is more important than being right.

In India, its a jungle out there on roads, survival of the most careful ones.

All very wise points, our roads are one of the worst when it comes to safety. The more we realize and drive / ride, the less chance we are to get into trouble.

[prithm]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

The biker is well within safe limits, if he moves to the center it is to either keep a clean and safe line or to avoid something ahead of him.

Not trying to blame the rider, but he had enough space on his left. But, isn't it a common practice among Indian bike riders (civilized), to move to the side when a big vehicle approaches us especially in bends.

No use challenging idiots in front and back especially on highways when we know they will not follow any rules. Looks like the car was loaded too with passengers. Low GC in the back indicates to it.

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by prithm

Not trying to blame the rider, but he had enough space on his left. But, isn't it a common practice among Indian bike riders (civilized), to move to the side when a big vehicle approaches us especially in bends.

Blind spots, keep that in mind. A two wheeler rider with helmet on has huge blind spots near to him even with rear view mirrors. If the vehicle is little behind it will show up but diagonally approaching close is at a disadvantage. If you ride a bike do observe while standing at signals, you will understand what i am talking about.

In this case, it happened at least expected moment.

[prithm]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Blind spots, keep that in mind.

True, I ride too. But the car did try to overtake him earlier in the footage, that should have given enough signal to the biker to watch out for the car to attempt again.

Like Bernard Shaw's response to GK Chesterton's challenge "I give way".

And there was no leeway for anyone who might try to peek from behind the bus to see an opportunity to overtake. It would have been head on had someone peeked from behind the bus.

But he is just too damn lucky to have survived the head bang on the asphalt and few inches, he would have been under the rear left tyre. At that speed, his right hand would have instinctively extended to support on road, but he kept it on the bar.

[gkveda]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Blind spots, keep that in mind. A two wheeler rider with helmet on has huge blind spots near to him even with rear view mirrors. If the vehicle is little behind it will show up but diagonally approaching close is at a disadvantage. If you ride a bike do observe while standing at signals, you will understand what i am talking about.

In this case, it happened at least expected moment.

I beg to disagree here. Even if the car is assumed to be at blind spot at nth moment, almost 2-3 mins(Per video), the car tail gated the bike. So, it is very unnatural to assume that biker did not know a car was tailgating him.

From biker's point of view, If not, to allow car to overtake, the biker could have gone to left for his own safety when he saw a Bus coming from opposite side.
From Cab driver point of view, he could have just waited till the bus passed over the meeting point. This is the most basic lessons of all overtaking lessons

For me, it looks like,
1. Classical ego clash between two drivers.
2. Cab driver knowingly overtook biker and wanted to "teach him a lesson" since biker did not give way in earlier attempts
3. Biker knowingly did NOT give way PROBABLY because, he wanted to "defeat cab driver ONCE again"

Consequence is quite evident to both of them

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by prithm

True, I ride too. But the car did try to overtake him earlier in the footage, that should have given enough signal to the biker to watch out for the car to attempt again.

Originally Posted by gkveda

I beg to disagree here. Even if the car is assumed to be at blind spot at nth moment, almost 2-3 mins(Per video), the car tail gated the bike. So, it is very unnatural to assume that biker did not know a car was tailgating him.

Let me clarify, when i say blind spot i never meant the biker was unaware of the car being behind. What i meant is, the biker would not have expected the car to overtake when the bus was coming opposite, and at that point he would not have even seen the car approaching sideways (blind spot) even if he looked at the mirrors. Infact maybe he would have even assumed that the tail gaiter has pulled back and stopped.

As far as him holding to the lane and not moving back, in India one should Or all such things can happen. But how many of us ride with paranoid mindset? Well i do and i would have slowed / moved out OR accelerated far away, if the car guy was attempting risky maneuvers with me. Find a safer spot and let him overtake and keep his ego intact. But well that's just me and i am termed as captain slow by my riding buddies. LOL

Still all this does not take the responsibility away from the overtaking person, he / she needs to be careful and keep ample buffer, especially in a two lane undivided highway.

[ariesonu]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

As far as him holding to the lane and not moving back, in India one should Or all such things can happen. But how many of us ride with paranoid mindset? Well i do and i would have slowed / moved out OR accelerated far away, if the car guy was attempting risky maneuvers with me.

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

On the whole, the biker in question did move towards left side of lane once when the car attempted to overtake, but its highly possible that biker wasn't expecting the car to attempt another overtaking when a bus was coming from opposite lane.

A NEWS involving somewhat similar issue is trending from US
http://www.khou.com/news/local/texas...ison/428463526

A Somervell County man caught on video running a motorcycle off the road in 2015 has been sentenced to 15 years in prison, the Stephenville Empire-Tribune reports.

William Sam Crum was convicted of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon, this after a grand jury indicted Crum on two felony counts of intentionally hitting a motorcycle, leaving two people injured.

Video of the Oct. 17, 2015 crash quickly went viral on YouTube.

The Associated Press reported another motorcyclist wearing a camera taped the crash that sent rider Eric Sanders and Debra Simpson tumbling. The video shows Crum pulling over and the second cyclist yells: “What were you doing? You hit them.”

Crum responded: “I don’t care.”

Crum, who is 69, will be eligible for parole after serving half of his sentence, reported the Stephenville Empire-Tribune.

Regards-Sonu

[for_cars1]

Originally Posted by CarguyNish

Another Tiago bites the dust..

Looking at the pictures, looks like the case of Topple. .

Came across another online article that the Tiago collided with a truck while overtaking and the car rolled down the side of the road along with the truck. The passengers are reported to have suffered no critical injuries.

[CarguyNish]

Originally Posted by for_cars1

Came across another online article that the Tiago collided with a truck while overtaking and the car rolled down the side of the road along with the truck. The passengers are reported to have suffered no critical injuries.

This might be that same car you are talking about. Car has indeed rolled onto a field and other vehicles can be spotted in background.

Condition of passengers wasn't mentioned, good to hear no critical injuries. These images were shared by fellow Tiago owner in ATOM Club Group. Today morning he has shared these.

[prithm]

Originally Posted by CarguyNish

This might be that same car you are talking about. Car has indeed rolled onto a field and other vehicles can be spotted in background.

Certainly not CarguyNish. Look at the mangled frame and left side is "ripped" and "shredded" like rag and looks like the truck might have climbed on the frame at that side.

[dreadknight5]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

NO!!! Seriously?! This is absolutely wrong info you have!

ABC of driving would teach you to always check if everything is clear before overtaking. It is the responsibility of the vehicle trying to overtake to keep all the safety margin and not that of vehicle being overtaken. The above case is a clear fail.

Even if you have attempted an incorrect overtaking, you are supposed to back out and not try to push on to the other vehicle on the side. Just imagine if that was a truck instead of a bike there, the getz would have got munched up!!

Last but not the least, the car is in the classic blind spot of the bike. Even if the biker was constantly checking the mirror he might miss that car till about it was too close to the bike. And bike is being ridden well within his right of the lane.

This is a classic case of poor road etiquette and rash driving from the car drivers end.

Yes, check everything before overtaking is absolutely fine. And thats where it is the car drivers fault. Like i mentioned before it is fault on both sides.

The Biker knew the car was trying to overtake him. If he is a biker , he should be aware of the blind spots he has. Every vehicle has blindspots. IT is the responsibility of the driver to account for the blindspots when on road.

The Bike driver should have allowed the car to overtake him. What do yellow boards do when they try to overtake ? They honk like nobody's business. I get the feeling that the biker purposefully moved to the center of the road because he probably got peeved of the honking ( kind of a road rage moment)

Originally Posted by sgmitr13

Seriously?

In fact, I never move over to my left or to the road shoulder for a bigger vehicle to squeeze through until I find it safe for me and the overtaking vehicle to do so.

Share the road is the motto.

Sir, if you are in India, please don't ride like that if you are on a bike. We have plenty of Idiots on the road. Makes no sense to lose your limbs/life because of the idiots. Just blindly think that every one on the road except you is a BAD L Board .

Originally Posted by arjithin

A bike or car or a truck has equal rights to a level road. There is no rule that in a 2 lane road biker has to keep on the left. But to be safe in India road conditions, yes a biker be on left end if he/she is slow

There may not be any rule in stone, but we indians are an impatient lot. Think about it, when the plane lands in the airport. People immediately standup and start pulling the luggages. The door doesn't open for 10 minutes, but people stand impatiently. Many of them rush through the door and then stand in the luggage claiming section.

So when you ride on indian road, do apply the line of thinking that every indian has. Its better to be safe than sorry. If it means you slow down and allow the car honking behind you overtake you, you should do it.

secondly its the responsibility of the overtaking vehicle to overtake when there is enough space and time to safely complete the overtaking. The vehicle on the front cannot do that for the vehicle in the back. Had this incident happened in USA, I am sure the car driver would have been awarded few points in his driving record.

Yes I see that the biker was all over the road, but that doesn't meanthat the car driver miscalculated his overtaking plan.

In USA, there is a rule that if someone is tailing you and doesn't have space to overtake, you pull over and allow that vehicle to go through. In that aspect itself, the biker is at fault.

The car driver miscalculated and was careless in his overtaking approach. No doubt about it.

[n_naik]

Originally Posted by gkveda

For me, it looks like,
1. Classical ego clash between two drivers.
2. Cab driver knowingly overtook biker and wanted to "teach him a lesson" since biker did not give way in earlier attempts
3. Biker knowingly did NOT give way PROBABLY because, he wanted to "defeat cab driver ONCE again"

Consequence is quite evident to both of them

Perfectly summed up.

I feel, well developed shoulder lanes with clear markings would have given more space for both the biker as well as the car. I drive on both varieties of roads and can tell you that the presence of shoulder lanes makes the road more easy for a four wheel driver since the bikers will tend to move towards the shoulder lane and the car will get more space on the road.