Team-BHP > Road Safety


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11th November 2020, 17:07   #76
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Kanpur/Riyadh
Posts: 238
Thanked: 536 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

What a shame to have these deathtraps running wildly in huge numbers, with sales of 10K+ every month, and costing 600K to 1.6Mil. that's a lot of moolah.

It's time Indians woke up to safety as top priority for their families, and choose safe cars from the Tata range.
Vinod_nair is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:09   #77
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 15
Thanked: 66 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

As Hyundai/Kia plans to export more and more compact cars from India these results will not augur well in developed markets to buy "made in India" cars. No matter how much they try to differentiate the specs for India and World it still highlights fault in their long term strategy.
agelesstravelle is offline   (3) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:11   #78
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 94
Thanked: 454 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Highest GlobalNCAP ratings achieved by manufacturers -

TATA Motors - 5 stars.
Mahindra - 5 stars.
Hi Crazy driver. Please mention this in your next review of any Hyundai vehicle. For the Korean twins, the review always mentions right panel gaps, superb fit etc, but what is the point of all this, if we miss the biggest factor, safety!!!

Last edited by Sheel : 12th November 2020 at 09:04. Reason: Please quote ONLY the relevant bits of a post. Quoting a full, long post inconveniences our mobile readers. Thanks!
Raghuwire is offline   (7) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:14   #79
BHPian
 
terra85's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: bangalore
Posts: 163
Thanked: 156 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

OK so the seltos is more expensive, less comfortable, has bad brakes as per reports , company differentiate s models sold elsewhere when compared to India. I guess it will still sell cause it's got a good sunroof and some fancy touchscreen. Am sure this wont change a thing.

Off topic but what's the Bharat NCAP testing then. Why can't we have a uniform test for safety, I mean humans are same all over the world quite ridiculous.
terra85 is offline   (7) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:15   #80
Senior - BHPian
 
speedmiester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: bangalore
Posts: 1,890
Thanked: 3,056 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

While I can understand the ratings for Spresso and Nios, very very disappointed with the ratings for Seltos.
Pathetic to say the least. This is a car that sells close to 10K cars every month and the top end variant costs more than 20L INR.
When Tata Nexon can offer 5 star rating with just two airbags, I cannot fathom how can Seltos score so less with 6 airbags.
speedmiester is offline   (3) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:15   #81
BHPian
 
adityak7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 34
Thanked: 131 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

The seltos rating sure is an eye-opener. The spresso and nios ratings are more in line with the expectations.

I understand the dual standards of the manufacturers with different variants of the same model in different countries. For an organization the only metric that matters is profit and they always look to maximize the profit under the local regulations

What I don't understand is why doesn't the government indicate a minimum standard? Similar to how we have governments trying to implement safety measures such as usage of seatbelt, adherence to speed limits from the driver end, why don't they implement guidelines such as a minimum safety standard for the manufacturers? Something along the lines of at least a 2-star safety standard?
adityak7 is offline   (4) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:16   #82
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 155
Thanked: 631 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Whenever I see a person bringing in new Tata car at home, the first thought that comes to my mind is 'He surely loves his family and cares for their safety.'

I don't find this results surprising.

Tata can very well troll Seltos and Sonet with new ads now like they did for i20.
DrCar is offline   (14) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:17   #83
BHPian
 
NFS2024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 795
Thanked: 397 Times
Default Re: Kia Seltos, Grand i10 Nios and Maruti S-Presso crash tested! Disappointing results!

I do not think we need to go overboard in abusing the companies for selling their Cars.

1. Kia - Yes, I guess a majority of car buyers expected a good crash rating for Seltos.
3 stars is a disappointment for sure. I myself was expecting a bare minimum of 4 stars for Seltos. Need to wait and see how the Creta, Venue/Sonet fares.

2. Spresso - Did we already not know what to expect? When a Swift has a bad rating, what more could we have expected from the Spresso?
NFS2024 is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:18   #84
BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: KOTTAYAM
Posts: 68
Thanked: 53 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

I am sorry to say that these test results are going to be ignored by the vast majority of buyers. So why should these companies care as long as their cars are selling plenty in India? When will the Indian buyer ever learn that his life is more precious than kitni dethi hai?
eyeman is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:19   #85
BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 40
Thanked: 50 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

There goes my decision to book Seltos out of the window.
Wait for all new XUV5OO starts.
kkstile is offline   (7) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:22   #86
BHPian
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: --
Posts: 40
Thanked: 95 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

I don't know what to say to this.

My first basis for choosing a car is safety. Below the INR 15 lakh mark, I'm very wary about safety ratings. I expect all cars above that price to perform acceptably, or at the bare minimum, at least have a crashworthy structure. This news has really opened my eyes. The Seltos is an extremely high-tech car and I expected it to be the same with regard to safety too. Looks like I was wrong.

The Seltos scored 5 stars in the ANCAP tests and a good rating in the IIHS. This really helped my opinion that the Hyundai-Kia group was finally improving on safety. For a low-budget product like the Santro, it is difficult to have a stable structure due to size and price constraints. The i10 Nios--well--it is more expensive, but I really don't think a keyless start system is worth more than one's life. It is the Seltos that I'm appalled at. Notice that no India-spec Hyundai car has EVER had a stable structure in a crash. I always thought that at least their C-segmenters and above would be acceptably safe. This changes everything. Although this might just be being paranoid, this implies that no Hyundai C-segment car, from the first Fluidic Verna and Creta to their latest avatars, can really be trusted with safety.

In comparison, Maruti has been facing a lot of criticism for questionable safety due to flimsy exterior panels. But their Brezza has scored a 4-star rating and its structure held up well(although that might be attributed to the heavier diesel engine under its hood at the time of the test). While I was never really convinced that exterior panels had much to do with safety, let this be a reminder that a car's build quality is not (or maybe marginally) related to its safety. Structural rigidity is way different from the sheet metal's thickness. All thick sheet metal does is resist dents and give a 'premium' feel. Mat Watson's review of the new Euro-spec Toyota Yaris criticises the Yaris for its flimsy doors and thin, cheap sheet metal. At the same time, it was rated the safest car in its segment by the Euro NCAP. The Renault Duster is based on an ancient platform and its structure collapsed in the crash test but even with just a single airbag, it fared better than the Seltos for Adult Occupant Protection (9 points out of 17). The Maruti Ertiga's structure was rated 'borderline unstable' in comparison (although Autocar has inexplicably stated that it is the same for the Seltos while the NCAP report does not indicate anything of the sort)

Why manufacturers continue to behave so irrationally is still a mystery to me. Safety isn't something many customers choose. It is the manufacturer's responsibility to make sure the vehicle they put their customers in is safe. I was applauding Hyundai for providing 6 airbags in the i20 but I'd rather have a Polo, Altroz or Amaze with a well-engineered structure instead. It looks like all Hyundai has been doing is quoting some percentage of HSS used in the car and how many elephants can stand on its structure. This also means that the XUV300 is the only properly safe car one can buy at the price range because the Nexon, Altroz, Amaze and Polo don't have side/curtain airbags even as an option. Even a segment above, only the Rapid/Vento (which unfortunately have a maximum of only 4 airbags) are proven safe, although the Honda City might be too (this is only an assumption based on Honda's history).

One more point I'd like to make is that people on the internet (especially YouTube) need to stop spreading false information about car safety by saying cars are safe just because they have good quality exteriors and have scored well in some international crash test not applicable to us at all, or deeming a particular car unsafe just because its bumper deformed in a minor crash. Structural rigidity is much more complex than what is perceived on the exterior of a vehicle.

I can only hope that we are nearing the era where even 4-star cars are considered unsafe and 5 stars is the only acceptable standard. If the manufacturers don't want to do it, I hope customers change their priorities in order to force manufacturers to change.

I'm going back to recommending manufacturers that have their priorities right, like Tata, Honda and Volkswagen, to those looking for at least acceptable levels of safety at a reasonable price.
ron178 is offline   (22) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:24   #87
BANNED
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 98
Thanked: 556 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (10)
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

People talking about Kia Seltos costing 20L car(with 6 air bags) having a low GNCAP safety rating should also note this :

1. The Global NCAP rating is given to a car and not a variant. So even a base variant of Tiago,Tigor & Nexon,Altroz,XUV3OO get a 4 & 5 star safety ratings respectively. Same is the case with others like ford, Maruti-Brezza that have scored well in GNCAP.

2. Even the base variant of Kia Seltos(3 stars rating) will cost more than top-end variants of Tiago, Tigor, Altroz & possibly XUV3OO,Nexon & Brezza which have better safety(4 & 5 star ratings).

The biggest disappointment is that Seltos has got 4 & 5 ratings in USA & Australian NCAP ratings. This is clearly an informed decision by Hyundai-Kia to give sub standard safety to indians. I say this because they could have at least tried to give a higher safety rating for their top variants and get it voluntarily tested. But the body shell is rated unstable, so there is no chance of them increasing the rating to 5 star whatsoever.

This is probably how it would have played out :

Hyundai/Kia Marketing team : Sir, TATA and Mahindra are coming out with campaigns to advertise their car's 5-star GNCAP ratings. What should we do? Launch safer cars?

Hyundai/Kia Mgmt : No. Just add more features like bigger touch-screen infotainment system, Connected Car, Ventilated seats etc from our global portfolio. Indians will get brain-washed with gimmicks and buy more of our cars. Just look at Maruti. (Laughs).

How is this different from Dieselgate?

I completely agree that we should not make any assumptions about the safety of Harrier until it is crash tested in GNCAP. But I would rather trust a company which has got 4 & 5 ratings in their other smaller & inexpensive cars then other companies who dont even a single 5 star ratings car and most having 3 or less stars.

GNCAP is a non-profit organisation. BTW, these tests are conducted by buying random vehicles from market after significant sales are done. Harrier might not have sold 1/10th the volume of Seltos+Creta since launch. I hope they test harrier soon.

Tata Altroz was given a rating before launch by testing its pre-production prototypes because of TATA's track record of improving their cars safety after every GNCAP tests like they did with
1. Zest : 0(stable body shell, but 0 airbags) to 4 star(adde 2 airbags as standard).
2. Nexon : 4 to 5 star. First Indian car to get 5 star in GNCAP.
3. Tiago & Tigor got 4 stars. etc.
Napalm is offline   (22) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:26   #88
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 58
Thanked: 79 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

There you have it- all the AHSS lies ripped apart!

Nothing unexpected, given the pedigree of Hyundai, and now Kia in India.

In fact, we had a related discussion in another thread where the underlying platform of Sonet was discussed at length, and I had stated there that I would NOT recommend any Hyundai/Kia car to anyone whom I hold close to my heart- I consider myself vindicated now even without GNCAP testing the other cars from their stable!

Let's at least give credit to Maruti where it's due- they neither loot us with exorbitant pricing nor give us a false sense of safety/security with all the dubious marketing stuff like AHSS, African elephants etc.

As for Tata and Mahindra, take a bow!!
vivek_lm is offline   (17) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:28   #89
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Bombay
Posts: 102
Thanked: 378 Times
Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinn View Post
On the other hand, Isn't Venue a 4-star car in GNCAP?

The Venue scored 4 stars on the ANCAP (Australia). At this point of time, we don't know if it's the same Venue that's being sold in India. For eg. Seltos scored 5 stars in both US IIHS and ANCAP, where it's on a different platform (Kona platform, to accommodate AWD. Indian one is apparently on the Verna platform).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinn View Post
I wonder how better are even Ford cars? Ford pricing is also on the higher side and their tests also seemingly happen on the 4-air bag versions (correct me if i am wrong). ESP, TCS with 6 airbags is fine but what about the lower variants (like Figo titanium) that don't have these? Isn't Altroz 5 star from very basic variant level? Or should one take comfort in Ford service quality plus the FTD factor?
The Figo tested had 2 airbags. Here's the link : http://www.globalncap.org/wp-content...-2-Airbags.pdf. Only the base models of cars are picked by GNCAP for testing.
saur95 is offline   (3) Thanks
Old 11th November 2020, 17:31   #90
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: KL 7
Posts: 1,534
Thanked: 2,962 Times
Default Re: Kia Seltos, Grand i10 Nios and Maruti S-Presso crash tested! Disappointing results!

Quote:
Originally Posted by NFS2024 View Post

2. Spresso - Did we already not know what to expect? When a Swift has a bad rating, what more could we have expected from the Spresso?
True, no one in their right sense or with any concern of safety would buy one,

BUT zero stars in this day and age?! They have designed a death rap and that too an ugly one at that.

Maruti is the primary reason why the Indian car industry despite all its potential is still a laggard in the global automotive space. It's market dominance and engineering mediocrity has meant that most Indians have set such a low bar when buying cars. What is worse is that by fully utilising its early mover advantage they have monopolised half the Indian car market, thus suffocating rest of the competition who then invest very little into the Indian auto industry.

I keep ranting about how Suzuki Japan never really put any effort in making India an export base and help grow the local industry. How can they? Except for a handful of countries in Africa or South America, such substandard products cannot be put on sale in most markets! A 1-2 year ban on Maruti would be the oxygen the Indian car industry needs to break out and grow.
shortbread is offline   (6) Thanks
Closed Thread

Most Viewed
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Copyright 2000 - 2021, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks