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Old 11th November 2020, 19:03   #136
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Default Re: Kia Seltos, Grand i10 Nios and Maruti S-Presso crash tested! Disappointing results!

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Originally Posted by Carma2017 View Post
Interestingly, I thought GNCAP used to test the highest selling variant. In India they test the least safe variant only. Sounds a bit sensationalist. The body instability and footwell comments are copy-paste from Santro test report!!
Umm, it isn't sensationalist, in my opinion. The idea is that any variant of the vehicle should have a minimum safety standard. Is someone who buys the base variant - for whatever reason - more expendable?

"Global NCAP chooses the entry-level version of each model." - from GNCAP article on the XUV300 here

That having being said, I am now a little more confused. As someone with no engineering background, I usually used to observe the corresponding warping of the top of the A-pillar and the structure around it, when other cars got the unstable comment in the past. On watching the video of the Seltos, I see no such warping - at least not with the naked eye, does this mean the area near the firewall has been identified as the issue? I would really appreciate it if someone could so throw some light on this. Please note, I'm not questioning the result at all, just want to understand how it works. The fact is, for whatever reason, if a newly launched car is not achieving 5 stars, it's something that is extremely disappointing.

Last edited by da_lowrider : 11th November 2020 at 19:26. Reason: added content.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:06   #137
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Hmmm.... let's see. A built-to-a-cost hatchback built on a proven-unsafe platform by a manufacturer that has repeatedly dismissed the importance of safety in budget cars fails miserably in a crash test...in other news, water is said to contain molecules of Hydrogen and Oxygen.

More disappointed by the performance of the NIOS. This, and the results of the Santro pretty much says it all about the platform: Just another Heartect, but with smokescreens to fool people under the guise of "quality". And that pretty much sums it up about the Venue and the Sonet... these aren't exactly cheap or budget-grade cars for god's sake. Quite a while ago, 7-8L would've got you a decently equipped Polo with actual build quality....are we going backwards?

But boy oh boy, here comes the storm. A 15-20 L car being absolutely outclassed by a sub 10 L hatchback from a company without even half the global recognition in terms of basic build quality standards.

This is our car of the year 2019, folks.

The one we, the responsible motorists chose to be the best of the best. We all totally fell for the features while owners who heeded our advice had their lives put in jeopardy over failure of one of the most vital mechanical functions; the damn brakes.

Looking over how both the sister companies have seriously compromised on safety even for their "top-tier" offerings, I think they deserve the "tin can" label more than Maruti who atleast had the decency of building their premium offerings like the Brezza and S Cross on a global platform. Much appreciated.

And that just leaves us with the sales dud Tucson and the Verna. If the latter is just as worse, that leaves us with a company with absolutely no safe offerings but can deceive people with cool features and gimmicks, which is a massive slap to the face of the buying public in general, not that they give an ounce of concern about that.

I won't blame the BHPians for their love of it, none of us had the slightest idea of Hyundai/Kia playing us when we held the polls earlier. We all trusted the brand who let us down. That thread on quality lapses was indeed the straw that broke the camel's back.

I'm sorry if this sounded like a crazy rant, and I'll apologize sincerely to the current owners if my tone sounded hostile or hurtful. I'm just....enraged. The fact that big companies have the audacity to rob our hard earned money by fooling us into accepting such "false" products and then get away with it easily by trickery is just so....sad.

Out of all the car makers in India, we're at the mercy of a grand total of 2 manufacturers for making safe budget cars....and they did it without any strict legislation like the European Union. Them doing well atleast gives me a ray of hope.

In my eyes, this is just as scandalous as the emission fiascos that make up the headlines.

In my eyes, this car just doesn't deserve the award bestowed upon it by us anymore, on the basis of safety alone. I'm not implying that safety matters less in lesser segments, of course it does, but for such an expensive car it really is, an acceptable level of safety is the bare minimum it should provide among other gimmicks and features the salesmen are willing to flaunt.

Absolutely convinced that the new i20 is gonna fare just as worse...

End of the rant. Once again I'll apologize if my words seemed to be too harsh on one brand alone. I have nothing but mad respect for the Koreans when it comes to commitment to our market with consistent car launches,.but this...is just too much.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:06   #138
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Default Re: Kia Seltos, Grand i10 Nios and Maruti S-Presso crash tested! Disappointing results!

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Originally Posted by John316_WRC View Post
I now know for sure our second family car will be from Tata or Mahindra or Honda.

Heck even the Amaze scored 4 stars!

I wont buy any car from Maruti or Hyundai/Kia.
Just wanted to clarify that Honda Amaze for the Indian market is never tested by GNCAP. So far only Honda India specific model tested by GNCAP is Mobilio, and it scored Zero for the base variant and 3 star for the variants with Dual airbags. Hope Honda won't give us any surprise when, eventually their current models are tested by GNCAP
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:14   #139
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Regarding Seltos:
I feel in isolation 3* isn't too bad a score. But given its price Seltos' crash rating is underwhelming at best.
But who is to blame here? How many people (even BHPians) give high priority to safety or crash ratings? The market gets what it deserves. Forget voting with ones wallet, how many even ask an SA about crash ratings while shopping for a car?

I have a few colleagues who are planning to buy their first car by year end. When asked for my advice, I'm pretty sure I'll tell them to consider safety as a top priority but they'll anyway go for brand with better resale or bling or a model with sunroof (has happened before).

My humble Zest (2016 model) which cost 7lakh on-road in Bangalore scored 4* in GNCAP. I cannot believe that I'm in a position to ask a 20-lakh Seltos owner "Crash ratings dekha kya?"

A quick list of Indian cars tested by GNCAP which scored more than 0 stars.

Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly-picture2.png

Last edited by srvm : 11th November 2020 at 19:22.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:16   #140
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Default Re: Kia Seltos, Grand i10 Nios and Maruti S-Presso crash tested! Disappointing results!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carma2017 View Post
Interestingly, I thought GNCAP used to test the highest selling variant. In India they test the least safe variant only. Sounds a bit sensationalist. The body instability and footwell comments are copy-paste from Santro test report!!
Had read it somewhere on Team-BHP that if safety features are same throughout the range, the top-end variant is crash tested as it is the heaviest. That's why top end Nexon,Tigor and Altroz were crash tested whereas the base variants of XUV300(which still scored 5 star rating) and Seltos were tested.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:20   #141
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Quote:
Originally Posted by AutoConsultant View Post
Honda Amaze has scored a 4-star rating in Global NCAP. Although it was for a model manufactured in India but exported to Africa, the Indian-spec model is not too different from that.
We can not assume that Indian-spec model is different or not. Unless Indian spec Amaze is tested, we will not get to know if Honda also did any cost cutting or not.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:20   #142
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Default Re: Kia Seltos, Grand i10 Nios and Maruti S-Presso crash tested! Disappointing results!

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Originally Posted by Neeraj1903 View Post
Had read it somewhere on Team-BHP that if safety features are same throughout the range, the top-end variant is crash tested as it is the heaviest. That's why top end Nexon,Tigor and Altroz were crash tested whereas the base variants of XUV300(which still scored 5 star rating) and Seltos were tested.
Global NCAP picks the lowest variant when it picks up models from the market for testing. These cars are usually picked up from the showrooms.

Higher end variants can be submitted by the manufacturer voluntarily for tests. TATA obviously has volunteered to get the tests done, since the tests actually were also conducted before the models could be picked up from the general market.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:23   #143
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

It seems no one is surprised to see S-Presso scoring 0 stars, which is sad when you think about it. A car from the biggest manufacturer in India, and people have 0 expectations regarding safety from it.

Seltos scoring only 3 stars is a surprise. That's poor from Kia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deadpool View Post
So, the BAD A$$ Design has been beaten badly by GNCAP.
Going by their recent dig at i20, I think Tata should take this opportunity to highlight the Nexon's 5-star GNCAP rating with a "Who's the badass now?" ad campaign

Last edited by StarrySky : 11th November 2020 at 19:24.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:25   #144
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

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Originally Posted by GipsyDanger View Post
This is our car of the year 2019, folks.
.

Exactly my thoughts. Sad, disappointed and frustrated.

Even after so many seasons we are proving the companies right who love to put more preference to Daytime running Light than protecting the lives and safety of their customers.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:28   #145
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Now that we have the official crash test rating and with the other thread around issues with brakes in the Petrol Seltos, can the official reviews please be updated to stay unbiased and present the complete picture to prospective buyers.

I think we have discussed this multiple times, and this crash test result also reiterates that

1. We cannot assume a crash test rating of any car, given its international counterpart has got a great rating. Unfortunately most manufacturers (if not all) do cost-cutting to focus on the "visible" features than the inherent attributes of their product.

2. Let us not refer to any kind of unscientific tests like sheet metal feel, door closing thud etc. to be a jugaad method of determining safety. All that matters is safety equipment (which can help perhaps in minimizing the chances of a crash) and a crash test rating. Almost everything else is only a distraction.

3. It is not just the crash-test rating that we need to look at, but more importantly on the Structural Integrity. Note that these cars are crashed at 64kmph. Most highways and even broad city roads people drive at higher speeds. Not all structures you crash into are flat structures but could be of various sizes and shapes. Focus on structural integrity if the structure just survived the crash at 64kmph or had inherent strength to withstand a higher impact.

As consumers, we need to spread the word around automobile safety and only when inadequate safety will adversely impact sales, will these so called "reputed" and "market-leading" manufacturers mend their ways.

Meanwhile, a note to moderators to update the official reviews, now that we have concrete information.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:29   #146
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

As already stated in the thread multiple times, these results are hardly going to affect the sales. But the only good thing to come out of this is, that auto enthusiasts like us will definitely take notice. And hopefully people will choose something safe keeping in mind the rapidly expanding high speed expressways in India but equally stagnant and unimproved driving ethics of the ‘aam junta’. The people who ignore crash rating are also the people who ignore to wear seat belts or who jump red lights, so it’s only upto enthusiasts to take proactive steps and keep themselves safe on the road with others.

Honestly, this news was totally unexpected considering that it was a car from the Korean duo, and that too in 2020. The Japanese had already let us down, since Suzuki never bothered with safety, Toyota is sharing the same cars with them now and Honda isn’t much of a confidence inspiring manufacturer because probably they are doing this stuff too. Such a shame, really.

Guess it’s just the Indian manufacturers left now. Heart warming to see Mahindra and Tata working with safety as a priority in mind for the mass market.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:33   #147
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Notwithstanding the results of the crash test, it is the right time for Tata to offer a proper auto box ( CVT or TC) in the Nexon. The only thing holding me back from Nexon is the AMT. Else it ticks all the boxes, in particular safety.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:37   #148
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Statement from Maruti Suzuki India as tweeted by Sirish Chandran just now.

Seems they are happy to direct the entire blame on govt & wash their hands off. I feel the government is equally responsible for adopting and maintaining such sub-standard regulations.
Attached Thumbnails
Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly-screenshot_20201111_193149.jpg  

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Old 11th November 2020, 19:37   #149
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

Quote:
Originally Posted by sachinayak View Post
Now that we have the official crash test rating and with the other thread around issues with brakes in the Petrol Seltos, can the official reviews please be updated to stay unbiased and present the complete picture to prospective buyers.
I would seriously doubt about T-bhp agreeing to your suggestion. I have been following this forum for almost a decade now; only crash test rating will be discussed in seperate threads but nothing will update on the official review page except when it is a case of good performance, which could well be for XUV 300, Altroz etc.
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Old 11th November 2020, 19:40   #150
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Default re: Global NCAP tests Kia Seltos, i10 Nios and S-Presso. All three perform badly

This thread is exploding as if each and every Hyundai and Kia cars would crash.
Oh sorry!! I take back my words. All of them are prone to crash because while giving blings and features, Hyundai and Kia decided to cut corners in providing reliable brakes.

I don't understand why people are still hesitant to buy Tata cars. The other day, my friend's dad was discussing about buying a CSUV or MUV. He evaluated all options and finalized on XL6 just because it is a Maruti. He didn't need that extra row of seats. He found Seltos and Sonet bit expensive.
I suggested to check Nexon. Straight away he told me " I don't want to go anywhere near Tata vehicles." I asked him whether he owned a Tata vehicle before or whether he checked the current crop of Tata cars? He said 'No' for both. I decided not to argue further.

People still feel that buying a Tata or Mahindra car would be a like buying a lemon tree. All cars will be a lemon.

Anyways, after us owning an Etios for years, we are targeting Altroz as our next car post turbo petrol variant launch. Why we didn't look for any other options is because once you get a taste of safety (which our Etios gives) there's no looking back.
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