[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by A350XWB

shankar.balan, you are not alone here. I travel on ORR during morning hours (~07:00) to my office in Kundalahalli and there is a signal at the place where Sarjapur road branches off from ORR. The signal will be ON by the time I reach there and I stop if the signal is red. Most of the time, seeing me stopping, some cabbies also stop till the light turns green. But the so called educated lots care a damn and drive through at high speeds. Education cannot put culture into the heads of these people and that's a hard fact

Education? Book learning alone does not make education.
On the other hand, if everyone were to wait nicely,then everyone may get there earlier actually.
However, being India, we may actually end up there later!
The main problem is the population and the terrible, excessive competition for everything!
It is a sad state that our country has deteriorated to. Sometimes I really feel Sanjay Gandhi's ideas should be adopted!

[evilshantanu]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

Education? Book learning alone does not make education.
On the other hand, if everyone were to wait nicely,then everyone may get there earlier actually.
However, being India, we may actually end up there later!
The main problem is the population and the terrible, excessive competition for everything!
It is a sad state that our country has deteriorated to. Sometimes I really feel Sanjay Gandhi's ideas should be adopted!

Very true, I have seen this Red light being not followed mostly by personal cars, that again brings me back to the statement, "Thermometer is not the only thing which has a degree without education, there are some more people around us in that category"

[narayans80]

Originally Posted by esteem_lover

^ That is what I presumed too until one day a traffic cop educated me that unless there is a board that says "Free Left Turn", all left turns are by the signal(meaning no free left turn).

Have you seen a single 'Free Left' board ever in Madras? Even major junctions like Mount Road to Chamiers Road left turn, Chamiers Road to Mount Road left, Adyar SP Road to OMR don't have 'em. And these are the junctions have have barricaded left turns.

[JoeMichael]

Originally Posted by evilshantanu

Very true, I have seen this Red light being not followed mostly by personal cars, that again brings me back to the statement, "Thermometer is not the only thing which has a degree without education, there are some more people around us in that category"

Very true - But that fact is that , such attitude comes not from lack of education ,but lack of civic sense. Witnessed a very interesting glimpse today. There is a skywalk on old airport road , near Leela Palace.

There were a group of people , techies from "a chinese networking and communications" company , as their access cards suggested , trying to cross the road , right under the skywalk,causing vehicles to break and honk , and there was this pack of stray dogs , who calmly took the skywalk to cross the road. Was an amusing sight..

And as the Savage Garden song goes - Which one is more human !!!

[bharat4ever]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

Yesterday morning and again this morning I had stopped at a traffic signal which was red, with my indicator light on, because I wanted to turn there.
These signals do not allow free left turns.
Despite that, there were several vehicles who jumped the lights. First came three or four lorries all of whom went blithely past. One was pulling a cement mixer and one was a water tanker. Ok, these were probably piloted by some halfwitted un educated underpaid hireling who lacks the capacity to think.
What really got my goat were the following:
An alto driven by an obviously educated lady with a child in tow - possibly on the kindergarten run.
A VW Jetta driven b a rich looking exec type
A Fortuner driven by someone who could have passed off as a gangster. Dressed in white and all.
Three or four Swifts, I 20's and suchlike, all driven by executive types.

And there I was, like a prize idiot, waiting for the signal to turn green!
Is there any point in living in such a lawless society amongst such creatures?
You tell me!

Let me guess, is this the signal from HSR layout going to Jakkasandra?

[RajaTaurus]

Originally Posted by JoeMichael

Very true - But that fact is that , such attitude comes not from lack of education ,but lack of civic sense. Witnessed a very interesting glimpse today. There is a skywalk on old airport road , near Leela Palace.

There were a group of people , techies from "a chinese networking and communications" company , as their access cards suggested , trying to cross the road , right under the skywalk,causing vehicles to break and honk , and there was this pack of stray dogs , who calmly took the skywalk to cross the road. Was an amusing sight..

And as the Savage Garden song goes - Which one is more human !!!

Those are the people that I used to refer to to my friends as EI's - Educated Idiots. We have millions of those on the road everyday.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by RajaTaurus

Those are the people that I used to refer to to my friends as EI's - Educated Idiots. We have millions of those on the road everyday.

Please change that term to Literate Idiots. Looking at how people drive, I am beginning to believe more and more that literacy doesnt equate or translate into education.
It does translate into arrogance at times.

The need if the hour is sensitivity and that cannot be taught anywhere, it has to be imbibed.

[RajaTaurus]

Originally Posted by selfdrive

Please change that term to Literate Idiots. Looking at how people drive, I am beginning to believe more and more that literacy doesnt equate or translate into education.
It does translate into arrogance at times.

The need if the hour is sensitivity and that cannot be taught anywhere, it has to be imbibed.

Agree Literacy does not translate into education. IMHO,
Literacy = Ability to read and write.
Education = Learn and apply what you learnt. (much more than Literacy I suppose)

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by narayans80

Have you seen a single 'Free Left' board ever in Madras?

We will have seen No Free Left signs. From this, we can interpret that free left is, in fact, the default. UK has no free-left rule, and Indian law often dates back to British law, but I believe USA and other countries have equivalent (free-right when appropriate) rules that India must have picked up along the way.

My interpretation of how to recognize a no-free-left situation:

--- There is a No-Free-Left sign (Duh...)

--- The arrangement of signal lights reveal that there will be a green arrow for left turns.

The latter is debatable, as it depends on interpreting unlit signals.

Regularly, at traffic-police-controlled junction, the policeman makes it clear that, even if it says no-free-left, he wants you out of the way as much as the guy behind you does. Thus, for instance, I've learnt to ignore the no-free-left sign at Thiruvanmiyur. But, one day, I might encounter a policeman with a different world view.

[vineethvazhayil]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

We will have seen No Free Left signs. From this, we can interpret that free left is, in fact, the default. UK has no free-left rule, and Indian law often dates back to British law, but I believe USA and other countries have equivalent (free-right when appropriate) rules that India must have picked up along the way.

My interpretation of how to recognize a no-free-left situation:

--- There is a No-Free-Left sign (Duh...)

--- The arrangement of signal lights reveal that there will be a green arrow for left turns.

The latter is debatable, as it depends on interpreting unlit signals.

Regularly, at traffic-police-controlled junction, the policeman makes it clear that, even if it says no-free-left, he wants you out of the way as much as the guy behind you does. Thus, for instance, I've learnt to ignore the no-free-left sign at Thiruvanmiyur. But, one day, I might encounter a policeman with a different world view.

As much as I know, left turn is free unless explicitly called out as no free left turn. I have often waited for left turn signal under the adyar flyover to turn towards gandhinagar only to be honked/shouted at by everyone including vehicles behind to the cop at the signal! So YMMV. You can wait for signal to turn green and be safe or follow the herd mentality and get caught when you do that just the one time ever!

[shankar.balan]

Wow!!
That was fantastic.
Supports my view all along then - Dogs are certainly superior to the average human!
I wish you had been able to take a photo of this - that would have been a clincher. You could have actually made it go viral!!

Originally Posted by JoeMichael

Vtheir access cards suggested , trying to cross the road , right under the skywalk,causing vehicles to break and honk , and there was this pack of stray dogs , who calmly took the skywalk to cross the road. Was an amusing sight..

And as the Savage Garden song goes - Which one is more human !!!

Yes. At Agara junction near First Choice Motors.
Same goes for the signal which is to regulate traffic going under the HSR Flyover near that HP Petrol Pump. In fact the lazy crud-heads actually go onto the extreme right side of the road with their headlamps on, to fill petrol at this bunk, instead of going ahead and making an U Turn back. Ridiculous!

Originally Posted by bharat4ever

Let me guess, is this the signal from HSR layout going to Jakkasandra?

[A350XWB]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

Education? Book learning alone does not make education. On the other hand, if everyone were to wait nicely,then everyone may get there earlier actually. However, being India, we may actually end up there later! The main problem is the population and the terrible, excessive competition for everything! It is a sad state that our country has deteriorated to.

Education, in my book, refers to more than just the ability to read, write and converse. The education system should be able to polish a person, to become a better citizen. But in our case, from childhood, we are taught to compete with others rather than living as a society. In one word, this behaviour can be termed as selfishness - "Me me and me, then others".
In many signals and blocks, I've seen people not yielding and blocking the paths of everyone including themselves. In the process, they make everyone late, but he/she's not ready to give up the ego.

[bharat4ever]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

Yes. At Agara junction near First Choice Motors.
Same goes for the signal which is to regulate traffic going under the HSR Flyover near that HP Petrol Pump. In fact the lazy crud-heads actually go onto the extreme right side of the road with their headlamps on, to fill petrol at this bunk, instead of going ahead and making an U Turn back. Ridiculous!

Oh that's a major nuisance. Especially the auto guys, who don't put on their headlamps, nor do they have any indicators to tell us what they intend to do. And you come in their way, they glare at you like it's their right of way.

Come to think of it, HSR Layout needs a lot of Traffic cops posted.

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by A350XWB

Education, in my book, refers to more than just the ability to read, write and converse. The education system should be able to polish a person, to become a better citizen. But in our case, from childhood, we are taught to compete with others rather than living as a society. In one word, this behaviour can be termed as selfishness - "Me me and me, then others".
In many signals and blocks, I've seen people not yielding and blocking the paths of everyone including themselves. In the process, they make everyone late, but he/she's not ready to give up the ego.

I was watching a program on Sweden, Stockholm and the Skerries yesterday.

Exemplary community behaviour, community spirit and highly civilized, polite society.

Yes, Economic strength has a lot to do with it, as has a relatively small population, better governance etc etc.

Will India ever get there?

I actually remember an India which was like this, in the 1970's, 1980's upto the mid-late-1990's. It is only post the mid-late-1990's that things have deteriorated so horribly.

The filth has risen to the top, instead of the cream.

[drmohitg]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

I was watching a program on Sweden, Stockholm and the Skerries yesterday.

Exemplary community behaviour, community spirit and highly civilized, polite society.

Yes, Economic strength has a lot to do with it, as has a relatively small population, better governance etc etc.

Will India ever get there?

+1. A lot of the frustration and lack of etiquette that we witness on our roads can be blamed to some extent on the ever growing population and the resulting chaos. Lack of jobs, dissatisfaction, frustration and the never ending struggle to jostle with the crowd and move ahead/survive has lead to a general feeling of hostility having crept in most of the people. And then in no time this becomes a way of life with everyone blaming the rest of the road users for there unruly behaviour. People don't take a second before abusing someone blocking there free left turn but the same guy would sheepishly grin and shout back at people to learn to wait for 2 minutes at the next signal when he ends up blocking there free left, knowingly or otherwise.

And this is basic human psyche. A lot of times I have been left amused in USA. All my uncles and cousins there can go on for hours praising there road manners and law and order and the driving etiquette being observed by every driver on the road, regardless of there economic background. But to my surprise the same people start honking, gesturing and signaling with there fingers, when they enter the crowded and busy streets of Manhattan. You can see a lot of drivers changing lanes constantly trying to squeeze ahead of the traffic. So basically then the whole driving etiquette line is a myth. If you have open roads and very sparse traffic then everyone seems to be following the rules. But put them in a chaotic bumper to bumper traffic situation and they turn aggressive in no time!