[Sutripta]

Originally Posted by srishiva

Should India move away from democracy to grow economically

Loaded question, meant to provoke a flurry of responses. Which somehow has not happened. I also take it that the question is rhetorical, in your mind you already subscribe to the authoritarianism leads to better economic performance. It's a belief shared by millions, if not billions. Not just in India, but in democracies over the world. Not just now, but through times in the past.

China's is a once in history case. It is an outlier. However its numbers are so humongous that if it's data is pooled in along with all the others, it totally drowns out the others. If on the other hand we exclude China, I think we'll find no meaningful correlation. If anything, maybe slightly on the negative part.

Regarding authoritarianism , of late we are not doing too shabbily. Regarding economic performance during the same period (ie till March 2020, excluding Covid induced pain) I don't think we are doing happily.

Sutripta

[v1p3r]

In other news, the GST AAR is now deciding that parathas are not rotis. https://twitter.com/panix68/status/1...254891520?s=09

[alpha1]

Originally Posted by srishiva

Should India move away from democracy to grow economically

Its difficult to set right the systemic deficiencies that are now formally part of it. There is no accountability and people will not change since its not necessary in the current system.

For me, atleast I will as much as possible buy non-chinese products Haven't even bought a Hyundai yet so I wont be buying a Chinese car for a long time.

I would be extremely skeptical with the line of thinking that move away from democracy will improve the deep set systemic deficiencies. In fact I would vouch that things will get worse with an authoritarian regime.

If you see a lack of transparency and accountability in a democracy, what do you expect will happen in an autocratic state? Remember the people are the same.

Regarding authoritarianism , of late we are not doing too shabbily. Regarding economic performance during the same period (ie till March 2020, excluding Covid induced pain) I don't think we are doing happily.

Sutripta

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

In other news, the GST AAR is now deciding that parathas are not rotis. https://twitter.com/panix68/status/1...254891520?s=09

Shhhh! This is a secret route to simplification of GST. But don't tell anyone. The babaus are working over time on the distinction between not just roti versus parantha but finer nuances such as mouli ka parantha, 18% ; aloo ka prantha 28%, with extra butter surcharge of 5%; then kulcha 28%, but if Amritsari kulcha then a new slab of 38%. Why not. It is a top secret plan to fund the Rs 20 lakh crores.

[ashokrajagopal]

Originally Posted by alpha1

I would be extremely skeptical with the line of thinking that move away from democracy will improve the deep set systemic deficiencies. In fact I would vouch that things will get worse with an authoritarian regime.

If you see a lack of transparency and accountability in a democracy, what do you expect will happen in an autocratic state? Remember the people are the same.

Extremely skeptical; I am sure you used that phrase because you couldn't find a harsher one.
I cant believe there is such stuff being discussed. Why would any one want to move authoritarian so that GDP or some such accounting improves is beyond me

[Sutripta]

^^^ (VN and Viper)
Some months back didn't the GST authorities slap a penalty of crores on an (apparently humble) eatery? (Don't know what ultimately happened).

Now I'm in two minds. The outflow from the state coffers is nowhere near 20 lac crores. So we should stop at the 18% level. On the other hand, Aloo Parathas are definitely a sin. The resulting obesity of the population puts a strain on the health infrastructure and resources of the State. Much like smoking.

On a more serious note, where do we stand wrt directors remunerations?

Sutripta

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by Sutripta

On a more serious note, where do we stand wrt directors remunerations?

Directors sitting fees is GST paid in their hands that is to say the director does not need to separately deposit GST/file returns. The company pays the GST on his fees and deposits with the Govt. This to best of my knowledge. There was talk of removing GST from directors fees altogether. If you need serious details I can check with companies I am associated with

[Sutripta]

^^^
Thanks.
I believe there are different advance rulings. On how the 'remuneration/ fee' is structured, and for part time/ full time directors.

Sutripta

[FrozeninTime]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Shhhh! This is a secret route to simplification of GST. But don't tell anyone. The babaus are working over time on the distinction between not just roti versus parantha but finer nuances such as mouli ka parantha, 18% ; aloo ka prantha 28%, with extra butter surcharge of 5%; then kulcha 28%, but if Amritsari kulcha then a new slab of 38%. Why not. It is a top secret plan to fund the Rs 20 lakh crores.

Thats absolutely funny but true. How do you feel attitude of current of bureaucracy compared to early liberalized economy bureaucracy?

[RM Motorsports]

In an interaction with CNBC-TV18, Maruti Suzuki and Bajaj Auto, two of India's largest automakers have stated that the ongoing call to boycott Chinese-made goods is not a good business decision.

Maruti Suzuki's chairman RC Bhargava said that while his firm directly doesn't need to import components from China, Maruti Suzuki's vendors are dependent on Chinese imports. He went on to say, "It is not easy for these vendors to find alternative sources or develop alternative sources. It takes a lot of time. What is more important is it will take a lot of cost penalty on the side of the vendors which ultimately means a cost penalty to the consumer."

Rajiv Bajaj, MD of Bajaj Auto, said his firm directly imported components worth approximately Rs 600 crore from China. The two-wheeler maker's Tier-1 suppliers also import components worth a similar amount from the nation. The overall import bill for Bajaj Auto amounts to around Rs 1,000 crore from China.

"The reason we source components from China is simply that China is more competitive. I do not mean that our Indian suppliers are dumb, they are not; we are handicapped. The issues of land, labour, logistics, legislation, and electricity – it is because of this unease of doing business that for components like these, which in our language are called non-proprietary components, we find that the Chinese source is more competitive," Bajaj further added.

http://overdrive.in/news-cars-auto/m...-not-feasible/

[Spinnerr]

Intresting read.

How one Indian industry beat China at manufacturing and created a global footprint

I connected to this bit, I remember reading in TBhp, by entrepreneurs, about the "employability" of our college graduates today.

And that’s how Bajaj Auto built its research and development—batch by batch. Making designing and manufacturing of motorcycles sexy and paying for it. The selection ratio was 1:15. Most of the IITs, RECs, and VJTIs had toppers who were absolutely useless. They could not draw a Carnot cycle, could not tell the difference between a diesel and petrol engine. Give them an elevation and plan they could not draw the side view. Most of them were focusing on writing code. But we found gems, we found guys who were passionate and knowledgeable but could not express in English. I started conducting interviews in Hindi, Marathi, Telugu, Tamil and so on.

There was another company using the same approach—TVS. Based in south India, they also built a great R&D department.

End of the day, a well designed, quality product along with a good network to maintain it speaks for itself, will have loyals who stick to the brand. On second thoughts, India is still a price sensitive market, so maybe finding the right balance is the key.

[DigitalOne]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

The babaus are working over time on the distinction between not just roti versus parantha but finer nuances such as mouli ka parantha, 18% ; aloo ka prantha 28%, with extra butter surcharge of 5%; then kulcha 28%, but if Amritsari kulcha then a new slab of 38%.

Taxes and Babus are made for each other .

There is a very famous example. Quickly, what do you see below? Edible oil or Hair Oil?



5% GST or 18% GST? The company packaging calls it Edible oil to attract lower GST but subtly advertises as hair oil.

My work is GST related. I had attended a session where the speaker was giving many more such examples in the pre-GST era. Apparently there was a ruling by one of the state tax tribunals that Electricity was goods and not services since there is "transfer of electrons" . True story !!

With GST we have come a long way from that, but Babus will not let go of the complexity and discretionary powers so easily.

Another example, I could recall was software. Exactly the same software sold using CDs was taxed as goods (there is material transfer!!) but via internet downloads was taxed as services.

Topic of taxation is way off-topic to the thread.

[neeraj0272]

https://indianexpress.com/article/ex...ained-6465949/

Excellent article. Must read for those who shout before thinking through.

[DigitalOne]

I had written this in this thread earlier

Originally Posted by DigitalOne

The government should immediately make a rule stating the Country of Manufacture

- should be prominently made visible in all products.
- should be prominent in the first page search results of all e-commerce platforms. E-Commerce platforms can also make it part of their filters

In case of composite products, a formula can be worked out with industry bodies how to arrive at (e.g a weighted %) a Country of Manufacture.

and in "India-China Rivalry!" thread

- Government should make it a rule that country of manufacture should be labelled more clearly in all goods.

- For composite products like automobiles or electronics, with industry bodies inputs/knowledge, I believe it should be possible to come up with a percentage figure (e.g. 70% China, 20% Taiwan, 10% India). This is difficult but not impossible. Government can make it mandatory to publish top 3 countries of manufacture in the product, and rest in product websites.

- Government should strive to inform the consumers and then let the consumers wallet speak.

Somebody in the Government seems to be listening. They are implementing this concept in the Government procurement portal GeM.

Source

From the article:

The government procurement portal GeM has made it mandatory for sellers to mention 'country of origin' on products they wish to sell through the platform...

Government e-Marketplace (GEM) has also enabled a provision for indication of the percentage of local content in products ..

...the Make in India filter has now been enabled on the portal. Buyers can choose to buy only those products that meet the minimum 50 per cent local content criteria.

Good start! . They should also enforce this in e-Commerce sites. Let consumers make informed decision.

[iamswift]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Shhhh! This is a secret route to simplification of GST. But don't tell anyone. The babaus are working over time on the distinction between not just roti versus parantha but finer nuances such as mouli ka parantha, 18% ; aloo ka prantha 28%, with extra butter surcharge of 5%; then kulcha 28%, but if Amritsari kulcha then a new slab of 38%. Why not. It is a top secret plan to fund the Rs 20 lakh crores.

It was about the packed parathas. The TRP hungry media gave the usual twist and made as though when you order food at restaurant you will be taxed different for roti and paratha. No that is not the case. Same tax rate of 5% in restaurants.