[SulemanP]

I think there is no perfect answer to whether one should hang his boots at a certain age in life.
I would turn 45 in a couple of months, like most of you I am facing this problem on what to do in future. I am equally vulnerable like most of the people on this forum about this subject, but one thing is for certain that i would not like to take any kind of financial responsibility/burden in future.
I don't know if this is right or wrong, but it is really good to have no EMI days in your life.

Just trying to go by the flow...

[theroadrunner]

Ikigai - Purpose of Life

I am late to the party, but hey, here I am. The very nature of our work style is bound to give us anxiety pangs and burnouts. Which in turn leads us to what we broadly call as the Mid-life crisis. I had been wanting to write in detail and separately, but now that we have this relevant topic, let me blurt my mind out.

I have quit my job and I have decided to follow my Ikigai or the purpose of life

I am 39 years young and I have had a rather fulfilling 17 years of IT experience across 2 companies. I have drawn gratuity in both these companies. Been consistent, have always been the troubleshooter and have handled my share of Deep-Red projects. Since 2011, I have been a part of all the major e-Governance programs that our country has seen, right from Passport Seva (my final year biometric algorithm was evaluated for the project) to the current Smart Cities.

All through the 17 years, the following has been my observation:

• Work is only a part of your life, not life itself

• Career, Corner offices, Corporate growth - all of these comes at the cost of some sacrifices like lost time with family, kid(s), parents and most importantly health
• You have continually keep learning - some skill or update our knowledge
• Aspire to do everything in life - nothing wrong in wanting to have a Steady job, make music/design stuff/cook, write a book, learn to dance, drive our cars to the hilt - We have our whole life and we need to learn to enjoy it
• Priorities need to be prioritized - Work life balance is rare and difficult in honest opinion
• Finally, its okay if you as an individual make a mistake, we need to learn to go easy on ourselves and pat our backs!

What I did:

1. Joined India's top IT services company in 2006, after graduating in 2005.
2. Worked without a taking a major break for 12 years
3. Took a month off without salary but surrendering my earned leaves - just to feel that freedom
4. Again worked with a Mid-size services firm for 5 year, 5 months and 25 days.
5. Then, I quit!

Reasons:
1. I wanted to break free (Yes, I am Freddie Mercury Fan!)
2. I love to cook - it started as a need when I was onsite and slowly started loving everytime I was in the kitchen
3. Kitchen is the only space where I realized I didn't look at Outlook or Whatsapp/Insta/FB etc - that defined my space
4. I am passionate, I ran a Weekend Italian kitchen focusing on Vegetarian and Vegan cuisine for a very small audience.
5. Took it a notch above by working my weekends with one the best restaurant chains in the country - The Yellow Chilli
6. I kept learning, experimenting and creating my own recipes which I validated with industry folks.
7. Spoke to the Chefs I idolize and validated if my thinking about food was right.
8.Broke down my inhibitions and wrote to restaurants like Noma, Eleven Madison Park, Gaa, Gaggan Anand - I wanted them to take me in as intern - they denied, but I at least attempted and still attempting.
9. All this, while I was running a Smart city in Maharshtra, from Trivandrum and frequent trips - During Covid, I travelled the most !
10. Finally realized that I am in a space where I could listen to my inner voice and my family supported it.
11. I am the first gen Corporate worker in the family so mom did have her reservations, but finally gave me her blessings.
12. Wife and kiddo understand my passion and they are the my first critics as well as my supporters.
13. I initially quit in 2020, more out of frustration, but reverted and took time to decide. I did my strategy course from IIM and trust me, it gave a solid foundation for the business plan. I presented it at their incubation space and got a 68% rating
14. Summoned courage and I just quit, registered the company and I am setting up the kitchen in the next 3 months.

Summary
It is not easy to take life altering decisions, but, if it is a calculated risk and is detailed, I am confident the plan will work. Now, many people asked why couldn't I just open a kitchen while working. The answer is simple - we may multi-task, but with food, we need to spend every waking minute ensuring the quality and given my job profile, I was 200% sure I couldn't turn one pasta dish out working my day job as well.

Things cannot be black and white always, right? It is not binary either - yes/no - there is always a path which we need to tread before finally taking that yes/no call which is called let me try. That in short is, my friends, what I am attempting. My life as an entrepreneur has just commenced and I will keep the updates coming!

There are no mid-life crises, probably they are all mid-life chances.
Cheers!

[Sanjunair5]

I love Team-BHP! Beyond the obvious love for Automobile topics, the love for Team-BHP is also because of the sheer diversity of topics available here.

And one day when you are thinking, you have seen all the topics (giveaway threads, home makeovers, fish keeping/woodworking hobbies, mattress threads....endless list), you chance upon this thread! A gem of a thread!

I prefer not to write about life frustrations, as I think, once you write them down, they become real. Else it is a passing thought and you revert to who you are deep inside.

But if I were to write, I would have written exactly what @airguitar wrote!

Originally Posted by airguitar

I'm probably going through that phase now. I have done reasonably well professionally .....

.....PS I read somewhere: "The only people who remember that you worked really late on your job are your kids".

[OffRoadFun]

Originally Posted by airguitar

PS I read somewhere: "The only people who remember that you worked really late on your job are your kids".

Very aptly put. May I add my own (quoted by ex-Goldman CEO)?

Graveyards are full of people who thought they are indispensable for their organizations.

In the long run, we are all DEAD.

In my opinion, life is a "constrained optimization" problem. One wants to maximize happiness (accomplishments, comforts(=money to some extent) within the constraints (time, youth).

Midlife crisis: To see the writing on the wall that projected model of increasing happiness with age due to increased earnings, achievements is FALSE due to many factors which show up in mid-40s.

I won't go into narcissistic exercise of what went well for me (or not!) but suffice to say, I am happy with what I got till now. But I am happy I have played badminton every alternate evening on an average for last 15 years or so.

A few incidents have shaped my thinking about how to optimize happiness.

1.A Russian colleague, seeing us Indians slogging in the US mentioned once:
Being a communist, I don't believe in second life, so it has to be enjoyed in this birth unlike you!


2. A decade back, visited my paternal uncle. He told me he regrets running so hard in life for things which eventually did not matter. He mentioned if he had known the outcome in advance, he would have taken the life at its pace and enjoy! He died a month after that meeting and his words were etched in my memory forever. Don't be lazy of course, but enjoy the journey also is my lesson

3.While playing badminton in a complex (in HYD) few years back, I conversed with a (then) middle aged man who was playing with his teen aged daughter. Without asking, he mentioned he just wants to spend maximum time with his daughter who will be leaving for college soon. He regretted spending all time away from his daughter partying and sucked up in real estate business (developer). Now facing headache of litigation, headache of dealing with rowdies in the business, told me he sold his properties and the Mercedes, rented out his 7k sqft Villa in Banjara Hills (I think partly got to do with lenders haggling) and moved to the apartment complex and he is happier. Ultimate happiness is in relations and that's where your "investments" should go along with material well being.


I believe hobbies, sports etc. are very important in overall happiness and once a certain monetary threshold is reached, things like health, relationships (esp with kids, spouse, siblings) are key to happier life, which many seem to take for granted. Luck, as much as I would think does not play role, DOES play important role in some of these.


Personally thinking of picking up Vamana Vruksha Kala as next hobby!

[DasAuto1985]

Had been wanting to post in this lovely thread for sometime, and now have the perfect dilemma to post I am 37 and mostly might get a chance to move onsite long term (read minimum 2 years). Financially, this move will be a boon considering the tight existence now. But will miss my daughter, 4 years old, like crazy. I am full time WFH and every break i spend with her and she with me. Cannot imagine missing out on her growing up. Really not sure what I ll regret the most 10 years down the lane - Not making enough money or missing few years with my daughter.

[sassid]

As someone on the verge of 50 and meeting both the criteria of Midlife and Crisis this is one thread that I feel well equipped to contribute to

It’s funny how small things make a big impression on you. In my case it was hearing a song - Cats in the cardle by Harry Chapin. I heard it in my college days and the lyrics went over my head - but the tune was catchy and it made an impression.

Fast forward a few years, I joined my first job and needed to drive nearly two hours a day with a cassette deck as my only companion. That’s when I ran up against the song again. The catchy tune reminded me of days gone by but the lyrics still didn’t make as much of an impression.

A few more years down the line, I got married and we were expecting our first child. In the euphoria of being a new father, I listened to this song again on one of my drives to the hospital and this song finally hit home!

For folks who have not had a chance to listen - here are the lyrics.

“My child arrived just the other day
He came to the world in the usual way
But there were planes to catch, and bills to pay
He learned to walk while I was away
And he was talking 'fore I knew it, and as he grew
He'd say "I'm gonna be like you, dad"
"You know I'm gonna be like you"
And the cat's in the cradle and the silver spoon
Little boy blue and the man in the moon
"When you coming home, dad?" "I don't know when"
But we'll get together then
You know we'll have a good time then
My son turned ten just the other day
He said, thanks for the ball, dad, come on let's play
Can you teach me to throw, I said-a, not today
I got a lot to do, he said, that's okay
And he, he walked away, but his smile never dimmed
It said, I'm gonna be like him, yeah
You know I'm gonna be like him
And the cat's in the cradle and the silver spoon
Little boy blue and the man in the moon
"When you coming home, dad?" "I don't know when"
But we'll get together then
You know we'll have a good time then
Well, he came from college just the other day
So much like a man I just had to say
Son, I'm proud of you, can you sit for a while?
He shook his head, and they said with a smile
What I'd really like, dad, is to borrow the car keys
See you later, can I have them please?
And the cat's in the cradle and the silver spoon
Little boy blue and the man in the moon
"When you coming home, son?" "I don't know when"
But we'll get together then, dad
You know we'll have a good time then
I've long since retired, my son's moved away
I called him up just the other day
I said, I'd like to see you if you don't mind
He said, I'd love to, dad, if I can find the time
You see, my new job's a hassle, and the kids have the flu
But it's sure nice talking to you, dad
It's been sure nice talking to you
And as I hung up the phone, it occurred to me
He'd grown up just like me
My boy was just like me”

I came to an understanding of what my long hours and commitment to work could bring. I also understood that as a son my circumstances were not too different in that I had a busy father who was missing from my childhood for months on end owing to his work.

Over the past 20 years or so, this song ensured that I never missed a single birthday, annual day or sports day for both my sons. I have played all manner of games with them and taught them most subjects till the classes went beyond my ability to teach - so 9th standard!!

It ensured that I never left the city where my parents were based in despite the very obvious rungs i could climb on the ladder if I was willing to relocate to head office. It ensured that I treated work as work as a contract where I give my time and energy and get cash in return while being off service and building things of value. It also ensured that I was available to my wife and family through good and bad times.

The power of a song or the wisdom inside

It’s also ensured that I’m not the fastest track employee in my company even if I have worked here for 23 years. I am not the first person my boss thinks of when he needs someone to push the corporate agenda. I am not the star employee of the month, year or decade - nor am I ever going to be the CEO. I’m ok with all that.

I know in return I have had a “good time” most days and maybe just maybe my kids will also turn out to be like me!!

[V.Narayan]

Originally Posted by DasAuto1985

Had been wanting to post in this lovely thread for sometime, and now have the perfect dilemma to post I am 37 and mostly might get a chance to move onsite long term (read minimum 2 years). Financially, this move will be a boon considering the tight existence now. But will miss my daughter, 4 years old, like crazy. I am full time WFH and every break i spend with her and she with me. Cannot imagine missing out on her growing up. Really not sure what I ll regret the most 10 years down the lane - Not making enough money or missing few years with my daughter.

Allow me to address this question {highlighted by me in bold}. Children miss the absentee parent but do not know how to express it or come to terms with it. So, they develop their own unique defense mechanisms to balance their pain of 'missing' and later in life it becomes an uphill task to cover that up. My father served a lifetime in the Indian Navy. When I was a child till about age 12, he was out sailing quite often or posted to small bases where I did not move to manage some stability at school. This limited my interaction with him. As I grew older, I wouldn't spend time with him even when he was in town because as a 7 or 10-year old he was out of the circuit of my life. Children have a way of blanking out pain of missing near and dear ones and getting on with their young lives. It was only from age 12 or 13 onwards that he became senior enough not to be at sea often and I started to get to know him as a person but that was a long arduous bumpy process. Things did turn out well once I was an adult earning & working but it could easily have gone south too. For you 2 years is about 5% to 6% of your lifetime. For that 4-year old it will be 50% of her lifetime. Of course, today video calls can bridge some of that gap. Best of luck with your decision.

[condor]

Originally Posted by DasAuto1985

But will miss my daughter, 4 years old, like crazy. I am full time WFH and every break i spend with her and she with me. Cannot imagine missing out on her growing up. Really not sure what I ll regret the most 10 years down the lane - Not making enough money or missing few years with my daughter.

To add to what @Narayan sir said - your daughter is 4, and just now begining to understand things. This is a very important time for you to be with her. Else she will be with half her parents.

My brother is in the US with his family. No matter how many whatsapp video calls his kids and my mother have, the lack of regular in-person interaction means that the grandmother-grandchildren relationship is a virtual one.

Would you want a virtual relationship with your daughter? Your daughter having an absentee father? Please remember - between the two parents, daughters are said to look up to their father more than their mother.

While you do you have the responsibility to provide financially for your family, and your daughter - I think you are more required than what material support you bring in.

Please think over again. And again.

[neeravnaik]

Everyone cannot just quit their jobs and start following their passions etc. Bills have to be paid and retirement planning is needed. But what can be done is gradual “phasing” of corporate life. Set more limits on your work and personal time and focus on self and family. It is difficult because as you grow in your career you get more responsibility and more pressure to deliver.

Few things that come to mind to “phase out” the work life.
1. Be in a workplace that values individuals relatively more than others. Everyone want to maximize their resources but some organization do have better work culture. It helps to work in Places which gives good number of leaves and with reasonable working hours
2. Finding your niche - While is it good to keep taking newer challenges but after a time in your career it is good to figure out what you are good at and comes easily to you. Someone specialized trying to be people leader will be stressful and vice versa. People in west are happy to do one type of job they like for decades. It makes your job feel easier and takes less time. You can explore youth to try different things but by 40s if you can figure out what comes easy to you it is good.
3. Delegate - don’t be power hungry and let others do something when you grow in your role. Not everything needs your attention. This is again related to 1&2.


Again all of this is easier said than done but possible if you set that goal for you and work for it.

[Jaguar]

Originally Posted by theroadrunner

I have quit my job and I have decided to follow my Ikigai or the purpose of life


14. Summoned courage and I just quit, registered the company and I am setting up the kitchen in the next 3 months.

Congrats and all the best for your venture. Do post on the forum when your kitchen is open. Will pay a visit.

[libranof1987]

Originally Posted by DasAuto1985

I am 37 and mostly might get a chance to move onsite long term (read minimum 2 years).

Having seen people undertake such assignments and the benefits/compromises that come with it, here are my thoughts:

1) What country are you moving to? This will play a big role. If it is Poland (the current flavour of the season, given it is a "near shore" - same time zone, but much cheaper than cities such as Zurich, London), it may not be worth it, because the savings aren't that great. I have several friends there, and this is a consistent message. If it is a mainstream city/country such as Zurich, London, or the US, you will see significant financial benefits.

If this is some country in the Gulf (non-Dubai / Abu Dhabi), I'd advise against given the restrictions they bring about. Financially - they're insanely good (so I've heard) but a disaster from a personal/family point of view.

2) Have you spend time abroad - working or studying? If not, this will provide a very significant exposure. And this bode well for your future - both professional and personal. Working in other geographies brings about a lot of tangible and intangible developments.

3) Considering your daughter is just four, can they not travel with you. For parts, if not the whole duration. Assuming this isn't some ME city as in point 1.

What would be your main motivation in moving - money? career advancement? the experience of staying abroad?

While I agree with replies to your post on the importance of being "present", I also do feel there are certain risks / steps you should take, and at 37, you are relatively capable of taking them. This will become more difficult as your daughter grows older and has formal school and other curricular activities.

Depending on the positives of this move, I'd suggest taking it up, and finding a way to maximize the time your wife/daughter can stay with you.

If this helps: in a prior organization, one of our clients was generous to regularly having team members travel to their offices in Europe on short/long-term engagements (four months / two years). People traveled very regularly, both men and women alike, and when mothers traveled, they often took the kids along, managing schooling remotely (schools also being accommodative).

[Capri89]

Originally Posted by libranof1987

If this is some country in the Gulf (non-Dubai / Abu Dhabi), I'd advise against given the restrictions they bring about. ............but a disaster from a personal/family point of view.

Would totally disagree on this point.

Except Saudi Arabia which have some restrictions for women (even these are being phased out), there are no restrictions in other countries. Yes, there is also prohibition in Saudi Arabia and Kuwait. But, if one has a saatvik lifestyle, that is again not a problem.

Savings rate are high in these countries with nil income tax. Dubai and Abudhabi would be an exception with relatively higher cost of living.

Upto +2 levels education is also not lagging behind and one can get all curriculum (cbse, icse etc).

If OP has niche skillset, he can negotiate a really good deal without sacrificing the nearness to family.

[libranof1987]

Originally Posted by Capri89

Would totally disagree on this point.

Except Saudi Arabia which have some restrictions for women (even these are being phased out), there are no restrictions in other countries. Yes, there is also prohibition in Saudi Arabia and Kuwait. But, if one has a saatvik lifestyle, that is again not a problem.

From what I've heard from the Immigration team in organizations friends/myself I've worked in, and people who've travelled there, companies prefer that only the employee travel in some of the countries in ME, while keeping the family based in India. They are allowed a week's holiday every three months (some visa formality apparently). Again, this may not be universal, hence the question regarding the country he's travelling to.

[DasAuto1985]

Originally Posted by libranof1987

Having seen people undertake such assignments and the benefits/compromises that come with it, here are my thoughts...

1. It will either be Budapest or London, depending on the project finalized. 2. Yes, i have spent time in Europe studying as well as onsite professionally 3. No, as my wife is also working and she cannot do remote work.
My main motivation right now is money and career development. Like you said 37 feels like a right age as little older, I may lose the appetite and the company too will look for someone younger.

[autocrat]

Interesting stories and most of them that I can relate to so easily

Having crossed forty half a decade ago, I will share my story here. May make sense to some, or may not make sense at all, but it feels nice to give advise

1. Contentment is not settling for less.

Like many friends here point out, we will need to make decisions in life where we need to give up things we love, or things we identify ourselves with, for family and peace of mind. This is a conscious decision to part with quantifiable things like money, position and what comes with them, for intangibles like time with kids, family, and hobbies. We all have limited time here. We have already spent at least half (or more) with our pursuits. Use the rest to be happy and keep our loved ones happy. Money is essential but not everything.

2. Less is more.

There was a time in my life, where my hobbies kept me as busy as my job, or more. I was a good photographer, a mechanic maintaining my cars, enjoyed doing plumbing and electrical work around the house, cooking and some gardening.

I had 2 Ambassadors, 2 Padminis, an RX which I bought from my salary after joining my first job, a bunch of scooters and a couple of modern cars.

Over the years, I enjoyed restoring a padmini, a couple of scooters. Although its immensely satisfying, its also profusely draining (apart from money, dealing with procuring parts, losing them at workshops, delays, so on).

Eventually, I realized that I was spending so much time with all these vehicles, I was missing out on weekends with friends and family.

I decided to trim my garage to what I can use regularly and enjoy, rather than several of them sitting around in various stages of incompleteness.

I sold or gave away most of my stash - including my beloved RX - It was in pristine condition, but I decided that I wouldn't ride it the way I did in my 20s. It needed someone else to keep it running at its best.

Looking back, I feel this is the best decision I made. I have fewer things to worry about and waste my energy. What I have, I maintain well with very little time being spent.

Minimize distractions. Focus improves drastically.

3. Time and Money are transient. Leave a legacy.

Engage with kids. Carpentry, Photography, Gardening, Fixing cars, or in any other way, even just playing and goofing around. Build character.

I have sadly lost a few friends on this journey. Fate is unforgiving and unstoppable. This is the time we need to prepare our kids for the world. One part is earning a livelihood. The rest is to lead a happy and fulfilling life, being good citizen and contribute positively in some way to the society we live in. Make them good human beings.

Wish you all happy years ahead