[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

I wasnt talking about the traffic there, i was pointing out to the mess the smokers are making of the road by throwing cigratte butts and papers cups when i know there are enough waste baskets around.

ehm, thats why i put it as OT = Off Topic

Originally Posted by Spitfire

A chronic smoker or any smoker dosent know there is harm in smoking? Whom are we kidding? One needs to be educated for it? I know people who smoke beedis who have not seen a school in their life knowing fully well that beedis are not good for their health. For crying out loud even the cigratte packet has a warning. We still need to educate?

This law came into place because smokers could not be educated any more(tell me how many campaigns against smoking have we not seen - how much money has gone into it) so the government says fine, you(smoker) do not want to have a good health or do not care, good enough. We will get a law that will not harm non smokers and that is all the law is about.

Let me clarify here, i was referring to a more broader public, especially our fellow indians from lower social status, who really dont understand the health hazards and mostly wouldnt have heard the law also. Unfortunately, they are the people who are addicted to Tobacco, which is not discussed by us educated lot.

The educated lot forms only a very small percentage.

Originally Posted by Spitfire

I dont think i have made any personal attacks, i am not attacking any members family here but trying to prove the hypocraisy going on. What you perceive as rude and uncalled for i think are hard hitting statements which even a law and general knowledge dont seem to make sense to a few. I totally disagree with your mark on my etiquette.

Let me again tell you, i am not questioning your intentions with the "Hard hitting statements" here, rather the perception others will have. There is a fine line while debating in public and as a member of our forum, you need to be more careful.

If not it becomes Support Teams responsibility to take care of free flowing emotions

cheers
Jaggu

[PatienceWins]

I welcome this. Great move!!

Hope it will be implemented properly.

[windsurfer]

Should they not do something about pollution then, even that kills (smokers and non-smokers equally).

[discobiscuit]

this is just another rule to create extortion. will it be strictly followed? hell no, but will they come catch you at will to score some money off of you? yes

we need to realize we live in the second most populated country in the world. making new rules can be easy but implementing it over the masses spread wide in or country will be next to impossible. most places are not even ready to incorporate this new rule.

imho this will fail miserably, and all in all will be just another means of extortion for the khaki uniforms around the nation.

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Let me clarify here, i was referring to a more broader public, especially our fellow indians from lower social status, who really dont understand the health hazards and mostly wouldnt have heard the law also. Unfortunately, they are the people who are addicted to Tobacco, which is not discussed by us educated lot.

The educated lot forms only a very small percentage.

We didnt manage to make sense to the small minority(folks from higher social status - who actually are the main customers for the cigratte companies, the money is here) with all the anti smoking campaigns and warnings and what not.

But the lower status folks will be the first one to abide by these laws if they hear about it and that is what is required now. The more educated and higher status you are in India the more you are resistant to laws and will shout out of roof tops for the same. The lower status folks will abide by the law. The anti smoking campaigns will now have a whole new meaning with this law.

Let me again tell you, i am not questioning your intentions with the "Hard hitting statements" here, rather the perception others will have. There is a fine line while debating in public and as a member of our forum, you need to be more careful.

If not it becomes Support Teams responsibility to take care of free flowing emotions

cheers
Jaggu

I have clarified what i meant to say if people thought otherwise. Even after that if folks think it was uncalled for, i rest my case. Please enforce whatever ban you want to. I will get the message.

I am not a person who opens his mouth without understanding the consequences. Since we have such a big community here it gets difficult for me and a lot of others to weigh every word written here minutely. Also the fact that we probably have never met or will never meet makes it that much important to rethink every sentence. There is no going back. I still believe i have not done any wrong. Maybe its time to say adios.

Originally Posted by windsurfer

Should they not do something about pollution then, even that kills (smokers and non-smokers equally).

Heard about BSII, BSIII, etc, pollution under control certificates. Move towards cleaner engines? all the above are required by law now.

And we are not discussing pollution here, we are discussing the ban of smoking in public places law. I know its connected but then a lot of other topics are too.

[blacmagic]

its pathetic that we are in a situation where common sense needs to be fed to people by means of silly looking rules and laws. and pray, how will this idiotic law be enforced?
will we be seeing a Pandu Hawaldar in every street corner waiting to pounce on an 'offender'? I dont think so. and in any case, the enforcement is best left to concentrate its efforts on where they are needed the most, like watching out for bombers, rapists and the like.
if people want to poison themselves, let them do so by all means. but why do they take the people around them for granted? would it really hurt our rugged, manly smokers to show some consideration wimpy non-smokers and light up in a remote corner? or do they want us to sample some of the euphoria they experience?
I have an idea. two ideas, actually.
1. dont fine these people. stick their faces before the exhaust pipe of an RTC bus or a truck until they cry for mercy.
2. make available containers with one way valves where they can exhale all that smoke and keep it trapped. this smoke could probably be recycled in imaginative ways. will be a huge relief for passive smokers like me.
we take our freedom for granted, but conveniently dump the corollary that comes with it. here's my take on the issue:
a person should be free to do absolutely anything he wants: AS LONG AS HE DOES NOT INTERFERE WITH ANOTHER PERSON'S FREEDOM.

[Blue Thunder]

Interesting topic, and something which has always taken a lot of my thinking time. Good to see such diverse opinions being voiced here.

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Educated people dont blow the smoke onto others, and generally move out of others way when they smoke....

quite debatable

I guess education need not be the deciding factor here. I would say that any responsible smoker would ensure that the smoke doesn't bother other non-smokers in the vicinity. All responsible persons are not necessarily educated, and all educated people are not necessarily responsible .

[discobiscuit]

There are several systems developed to eliminate the smoke from cigarettes. Countries in other parts of the world actually shell out money to invest in such infrastructure. we on the other hand can't afford to. so what do we do instead? ban it all together outrightly, without even giving a chance to resolve the problem using better equipment. That's thinking in a very shallow way.

why not ban booze which people consume and drive like maniacs and get away with their irresponsibility?

think if rules like this came about in the middle east... people would freak out. smoking hookas and other tobacco product is a part of their culture. we need to be more open about things and try to resolve the best way possible, instead of creating rules which would practically not work in a country like ours creating more problems on the other hand.

[mobike008]

The dreaded time has begun.

No smoking rules everywhere, but i doubt if they will seriously enforce the first few months since as of now they neither have the budget to advertise this rule in a larger scale nor for even printing the challan books.

Also, man-power without saying is already below requirement levels.

So smokers, make hay ( or is it smoke hay?) until the budget gets freezed for the above activities only then we can start seeing seriously the Rs.200 slap

[harry10]

Let me enlighten a bit on this.
Yesterday i went for a stroll with my cousin to nearby market and my cousin started smoking. Incidentally 2 cops on a bullet were passing by, saw us, took a U-turn and came speeding towards us. We were kinda apprehensive what had gone wrong (as the common perception no one likes a cop being around).
The junior got down and said you are smoking in a public place which is banned and you need 2 pay 500 bucks as challan. (law states only 200)
Shocked and surprised we told him we are standing on a road side and thats not banned. But he was adamant. Luckily i had thought of this situation the movement had heard about this law so had kept TOI edition in which law was given in car. Showed him the newspaper which clearly states you can smoke on a road or park. Still he didnt budged and wanted to issue challan(when he had no Challan book with him or anything to book). Was clearly evident he wanted money and we were in no mood of giving. So my cousin took the name of a high official who lives near our house and then only he budged.

I really welcome this ban on public places but incidents like this leaves a bitter taste as this is gonna turn only into another bribe opportunity for the cops. Nothing else will change.

[DCEite]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Educated people dont blow the smoke onto others, and generally move out of others way when they smoke.

Food for thought: Why do "Educated people" have to start smoking in the first place. Specially given the widespread awareness of the dreaded effects of smoking ?

[blacmagic]

Originally Posted by DCEite

Food for thought: Why do "Educated people" have to start smoking in the first place. Specially given the widespread awareness of the dreaded effects of smoking ?

because education is quite different from wisdom. there was an incident a couple of days ago where somebody had spread a rumor that ICICI bank was about to disappear and many of the people swarming the ATMs to withdraw as much money as possible were 'highly educated'.

on the other hand, Ive seen many 'illiterate' people with such wisdom that it would put us all to shame.

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

We didnt manage to make sense to the small minority(folks from higher social status - who actually are the main customers for the cigratte companies, the money is here) with all the anti smoking campaigns and warnings and what not.

But the lower status folks will be the first one to abide by these laws if they hear about it and that is what is required now. The more educated and higher status you are in India the more you are resistant to laws and will shout out of roof tops for the same. The lower status folks will abide by the law. The anti smoking campaigns will now have a whole new meaning with this law.

My personal opinion: the so called campaigns had very poor penetration. I havent come across any major campaign out there, while the law was being debated and approved. Saw Mr Ramdoss walking around distributing flyers yesterday on TV, thats all. I wonder what happened to the images on packs idea also, that really make sense.

Regarding lower status folks, more than abide by laws they are going to be harassed by corrupt enforcers. Just made a trip around Koramangala, it was nice to see that not many educated lot were around the pan shops BUT came across people from low economic back ground carrying on with their tobacco habits as usual.

What about other stuff like paan and gutka, is the Gutka clan stronger than Tobacco that Govt doesnt want to interfere? Or is it because, there is no passive gutka chewing effects and can be given second priority?

Originally Posted by Spitfire

I have clarified what i meant to say if people thought otherwise.

Thank you for clarifying, hope you have a smoke free day

Originally Posted by Blue Thunder

I guess education need not be the deciding factor here. I would say that any responsible smoker would ensure that the smoke doesn't bother other non-smokers in the vicinity.

All responsible persons are not necessarily educated, and all educated people are not necessarily responsible .

Brilliant and i share the same thoughts.

Biggest question that arises in my mind is that will this stay, or is it going to just fade off in couple of weeks/months time.

[Sam Kapasi]

Originally Posted by Mayavi

I read that Sam and interpreted it differently (and probably correctly). I think the law means that if there are designated smoking area's, the owners should not offer services which non-smokers are likely to use in that area. For example the Bar where drinks are served should not be designated as smoke zone as a non-smoker will also get his/her drinks from the same bar. So the smoking zone should be away from the bar. This is the same reason why smoking areas should not be near and entrance or exit.

Even if my interpretation is wrong, still it doesn't mean that services are banned in smoking area. The owner of the facility may be banned from serving me but no one can stop me from eating my food or drinking my beer in a smoking area.

Even if we go by your interpretation, designating the entire pub as a smoking area will then require you to bring your beer from home, no?

[DCEite]

Originally Posted by DCEite

Food for thought: Why do "Educated people" have to start smoking in the first place. Specially given the widespread awareness of the dreaded effects of smoking ?

Originally Posted by blacmagic

because education is quite different from wisdom.

I wanted to hear the exact answer from a smoker.