[mclaren1885]

Originally Posted by khaadu75

At the same time I wonder why Hayden couldn't bat like this at 18 ... ???

Exactly my point. Ricky Ponting has struck his peak form only since 2003. Until then he was like Yuvraj Singh of India. Exceptional talent, but one who would not be consistent & hence not many teams took him as a threat. Every cricketer has this period, sooner or later they will find form. Personally, I don't think Sachin or Ganguly have done that bad in 07 as you people are making it out to be. The figures are there to speak for themselves. Whether they won matches or not is a different scenario. To win a match the team has to play COLLECTIVELY. To think that 1 batsmen can single handedly win you a match is stupidity. If fab 3 didn't play well, so didn't the rest of the team. The sooner we accept this, the better.

[diabloo]

Well, the gist of the whole argument is Fab 3 are not helping the team's cause.

Originally Posted by mclaren1885

To win a match the team has to play COLLECTIVELY. To think that 1 batsmen can single handedly win you a match is stupidity. If fab 3 didn't play well, so didn't the rest of the team. The sooner we accept this, the better.

[mclaren1885]

Originally Posted by diabloo

Well, the gist of the whole argument is Fab 3 are not helping the team's cause.

Thats quite an assumption to make, specially when you are not a part of the team or know whats going on the inside. From where I look at it, they are batting well. They are excellent slip fielders, Sachin does a fab job in the outfield, most batsmen even know don't take chances against his arm. Sourav may not be that agile on the field, but Powar is not either, Gambhir is lazy to get rid of the ball soon. But he had done a good job with the ball when needed in seaming conditions. So, I would say your theory is not true.

[ac 427]

I am totally FOR sledging. For years together we have taken sh** from these Goras. And no one has been able to stand up to them. regardless of them being SA or Aus or England. . .we have been on the receiving end.

Not keeping in mind the result you have to fight fire with fire. I am not thorougly disappointed that we lost. . . but atleast the fire is there. . .the fighting spirit is there. . .

For all those who say let your performance speak and not your tongue. . .take a walk.

Sreesanth and bhajji i am with you guys.

cheers.

[diabloo]

Let it be a gentleman's game either for all or for none. Our media is equally to blame to publish only pictures of our cricketers sledging while conveniently ignoring the sledging by the other teams. Same like ICC. Even one member here published those pictures. Its totally biased. When they do it, its aggression. If we do the same, its stupidity?

Originally Posted by ac 427

I am totally FOR sledging. For years together we have taken sh** from these Goras. And no one has been able to stand up to them. regardless of them being SA or Aus or England. . .we have been on the receiving end.

Not keeping in mind the result you have to fight fire with fire. I am not thorougly disappointed that we lost. . . but atleast the fire is there. . .the fighting spirit is there. . .

For all those who say let your performance speak and not your tongue. . .take a walk.

Sreesanth and bhajji i am with you guys.

cheers.

Note: How about having a coach for sledging, who will teach how to sledge & to getaway with it And this will look aggression to the biased eyes

[mclaren1885]

Originally Posted by diabloo

When they do it, its aggression. If we do the same, its stupidity?

Yes, stupidity when you don't have the same aggression to show while "playing" on the field. The others match it with both, sadly we don't. While the rest walk the talk, we only talk and talk. I am game for some sledging too, but not by chasing after a bowler with a bat or by begging for a run out when the ball is dead. And its funny coming from you about being biased .

[Aditya]

A little bit of sledging is OK, but, Shreesanth overdid it. Sledging is pointless if it's not backed up by good bowling.
Still, it's characters like Shreesanth and Shoaib Akhtar who bring some colour to the game. Man, where's that guy gone?

[rks]

Originally Posted by ac 427

I am totally FOR sledging.
[...]
For all those who say let your performance speak and not your tongue. . .take a walk.

I am against sledging or chattering on the field with the objective of disturbing the batsman's concentration. The constant chatter by wicketkeepers is, in particular, very annoying. If I were the bowler or close-in fielder, I would ask the wicketkeeper to shut up and concentrate on his keeping. I don't think that skilled players who are confident of their own abilities would ever need to use such tactics to win a game of cricket.

[mclaren1885]

Originally Posted by Aditya

A little bit of sledging is OK, but, Shreesanth overdid it. Sledging is pointless if it's not backed up by good bowling.
Still, it's characters like Shreesanth and Shoaib Akhtar who bring some colour to the game. Man, where's that guy gone?

True that. Btw I think Shoaib is likely to be banned for 6 months by the PCB on disciplinary action. Sreesant might well go the same way if he continues this.

Also do remember that very soon we will be visiting Australia at their home. They will give back all this sledging twice fold along with their home support & some serious quick bowling. I won't be surprised if someone throws Sreesant a beamer & take him out of the series. Bucknor & the batsmen seemed mighty p!ssed with him bowling a beamer recently. And the OZ's do give you back what you deserve.

[ac 427]

my whole point to start this conversation was not to start a large debate about FOR sledging or AGAINST sledging. I just wanted to voice my happiness over the fact that we are not another 'doormat' team. No one can come and say things to us and walk away.

WRT to the point of perfromance. . . we are the T 20 world champions, and that is NOT by luck its performance. Agreed the real test is the 50 overs and test match i am an eternal optimist and do believe that we have what it takes to be the best and destroy the rest.

[ac 427]

Originally Posted by mclaren1885

Yes, stupidity when you don't have the same aggression to show while "playing" on the field. The others match it with both, sadly we don't. While the rest walk the talk, we only talk and talk. I am game for some sledging too, but not by chasing after a bowler with a bat or by begging for a run out when the ball is dead. And its funny coming from you about being biased .

we just beat these monkeys in T 20, agreed we lost the Kochi ODI but its not over. ANd i dont agree in we dont back up our bowlers. The face of new indian cricket is not just talented players with excellent flair, but i will add another angle to it. . . VERY VERY EDGY players.

cheers

[Nitin]

Totally agree with you. Its good to see that atleast 2 players tried getting back at the Aussies. I find Shreesanth's approach both amusing & interesting. Amusing,since at times he looks like a joker trying to play with a lion, and interesting since not many Indian bowlers actually look eye-to-eye with the batsman they are bowling too. At times Srinath & Venkatesh Prasad used to do it,but they were not aggressive in their body language. I like the way Shreesanth stands in front of the batsman,even after they have taken a single and the guy's standing at the crease.

I hope all 11 on the field get more 'josh' into them, and portray themselves as tougher opponents.

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[normally_crazy]

Originally Posted by khaadu75

At the same time I wonder why Hayden couldn't bat like this at 18 ... ???

He wasn't selected in the team. The Aussies don't blood young talent (Michael Clarke and Mitchel Johnson being exceptions). They prefer them to play in the local tournaments and hone up their skills and mental make up and then get them in.

[khaadu75]

Originally Posted by normally_crazy

He wasn't selected in the team. The Aussies don't blood young talent (Michael Clarke and Mitchel Johnson being exceptions). They prefer them to play in the local tournaments and hone up their skills and mental make up and then get them in.

And thus him being at his best at the old age of 37 is also an exception to the rule so why expect our Fab 3 to be at the same level ??

[mclaren1885]

Originally Posted by normally_crazy

The Aussies don't blood young talent (Michael Clarke and Mitchel Johnson being exceptions). They prefer them to play in the local tournaments and hone up their skills and mental make up and then get them in.

Not to mention that each of their county teams have training camps with complete scientific analysis equipment where they look into different aspects of a bowlers, batsmen & fielders positions and hone them too. The Australians are probably the most professional of the teams & their performances show that. One odd defeat here & there won't make much of a difference to them. Though the problem with putting in youngsters too early into the game is the danger of having them peak out even earlier, when they totally haven't understood the game or their own abilities yet. Here IMO the Australians score the best, which is why their bench strength is that strong.

Just to give you another example of their professionalism & seriousness in playing even their dresses are state of the art. They keep your body temperatures much cooler amongst many other medical benefits.

And for all those of you supporting Sreesant, I agree one HAS to be aggressive. Fight fire with fire. But, I also found Zaheer Khan, Irfan Pathan, Bhajji also aggressive in the past. They give the batsmen that stare, they even get into a war of words at times. Now, that IMO if perfectly fine. When your captain & senior players come and "drag" you out, its but understood that you are crossing the limits. And that is what Sreesant is doing. Crossing limits. And you don't show your aggression to a batsmen who has scored 87 and stolen the game away from your hands. The aggression you show when Aamir Sohail tonks you for a 4, points out to you how not to bowl & when you get him bowled with the very next delivery. Thats when you show your aggression.