[great_guns]

Seems like a lot of people are sharing the same problems. I'm at 91000 KM on the Odo. Here are my problems. If anyone has suggestions on how I can improve upon these, please let me know.

1) The brake booster died due to brake oil leakage and the brakes kept getting stuck in. Also I was told the drums were jammed and not rotating freely so basically I was driving the car with half brakes jammed on. Went to Carnations in Pune and after a dozen complaints and around 8 days they gave me the car with promptly messed up A/C knob. Damage - 18K. They got the A/C knob cable replaced for me later.
2) After the above exercise, the steering seems super heavy, almost like the wheels are stuck in quagmire. I'm not sure whether this is due to the 185/70 R13 tires I've upgraded to or because of some problem with the steering. In fact, when the steering is turned all the way on either side, I hear a pretty loud creak and if I try to move the car when the steering is turned all the way, the car shudders as if I'm driving with the handbrake on.
3) The ride now has gotten quite harsh and even rumble strips on the highways throw the Palio into a fit of rattles. The suspension/chassis creaks and groans audibly when going over large bumps or deep potholes. Surprisingly the car doesn't feel out of control and stops in a straight line on hard braking. It also goes over really bad and uneven (non)roads fit for SUVs without stopping or leaning dangerously. So I'm wondering whether I would be able to get a smooth ride with low NVH after getting suspension work done even after spending a truckload of money because I'm not sure the Palio ever had as smooth a suspension as, say an i20 or a City.
4) The whole dashboard and pretty much EVERYTHING rattles. The situation is so bad that it comparatively feels surprisingly peaceful and quiet sitting in ramshackle 5 year old Indica cabs with twice as much on the Odo as me.
5) The rear parcel try rattles and I'm fed up of blocking it with pieces of card paper wedged into its sides. Any suggestions here?
6) The mileage now is consistently 17 KMPL or thereabouts. I used to get 20 KMPL earlier. Not sure exactly what the reason is.
7) Got the EGR valve cleaned and the car feels quieter than before but still no increase in fuel efficiency.
7) The Yokohama A-drives are now 36000 KM old and strangely the front two tyres were a LOT more worn out than the rear ones. Rotated them for the first time since new so the worn out ones are at the back and the better ones are at the front.
8) The high-mounted stop lamp is always filled with water when it rains and due to rust in the contacts, has stopped working. I'm not sure if the water is leaking in through the rear wiper-fluid nozzle which is mounted on top of the lamp or through a leak in the wind-shield seal (I had the windshield replaced a couple of years ago).
9) I've lost 3 tail/brake lights and one headlight within the last 6 months. I'm wondering if the voltage is fluctuating or something.
10) It is IMPOSSIBLE to find a good, reliable service center that does a good job with Fiats. The Authorised service centers are all pathetic and the third party ones don't do too shabby a job at being pathetic either.
10) Though not a specific complaint against Fiat, I wish there was a way you could upgrade the car easily and reliably like you upgrade a computer. You know - add a new sunroof, get steering mounted controls, add a few airbags, squeeze in an ABS system, get 4WD on demand etc.

Honestly, I've come to a point where I would like to let go of this car and move to something which takes less effort to drive - a lighter clutch, lighter steering, lower NVH, softer suspension etc. but I'm faced with the same problem as Architect - pittance of resale value and inflated costs of new cars - some of which are pathetically short on features compared to the Palio.

The things I still enjoy about the car are:

1) Reliability - for 91000 KM, the car has never stopped or stalled (save once when the battery completely died). It has gone over every road, every pothole, every surface unflinchingly. It has ALWAYS stopped when I wanted it to stop. I have ALWAYS overtaken when I wanted to.
2) Power - Though I haven't driven too many larger cars, I've found the Palio to be the most efficiently powerful car I've driven. I've accelerated and overtaken even on steep inclines and I've managed to have enough power to clear a lot of uneven roads.
3) Space - Even with five people in the car, it doesn't feel too cramped though I hear some newer cars like the new i20 have even more space than the Palio. The boot is sizeable for its class but with the seats double folded, it works like a mini pick-up. I've moved a lot of material this way a few times when I needed.
4) The ergonomics are well designed and I don't have to reach out for any control. Also the stalks on the instrument console are stuck the right way (indicator/light stalk on the right, wiper stalk on the left). The fuel cap is also on the right side so I don't need to get out of the car to see what the fuel pump attendant is doing.
5) Ground clearance - after driving my friend's Figo, a City etc. I really appreciate the hassle-free bad road experience I've had on my Palio.

All inputs appreciated.

[Black_Beast]

Originally Posted by great_guns

Went to Carnations in Pune and after a dozen complaints and around 8 days they gave me the car with promptly messed up A/C knob. Damage - 18K. They got the A/C knob cable replaced for me later.

I was forced to change my Condenser because of negligance shown in Carnation Chennai, and few other minor problems got introduced by those guys. Not sure if all Carnation could be the same or not, but better check with the community on reliable/good service center for Fiat.
Only the servicing guys can screw this Car, otherwise this Car goes good.

Originally Posted by great_guns

2) After the above exercise, the steering seems super heavy, almost like the wheels are stuck in quagmire. I'm not sure whether this is due to the 185/70 R13 tires I've upgraded to or because of some problem with the steering. In fact, when the steering is turned all the way on either side, I hear a pretty loud creak and if I try to move the car when the steering is turned all the way, the car shudders as if I'm driving with the handbrake on.

I have this Spec tyre from Michelin for atleast 25K - 30K kms, i don't see this issue. This might not be because of Tyre.

Originally Posted by great_guns

4) The whole dashboard and pretty much EVERYTHING rattles. The situation is so bad that it comparatively feels surprisingly peaceful and quiet sitting in ramshackle 5 year old Indica cabs with twice as much on the Odo as me.

Probably I guess, service folks would have removed and assembled this dash. If it's so you should get it refit from good hands.

Originally Posted by great_guns

7) The Yokohama A-drives are now 36000 KM old and strangely the front two tyres were a LOT more worn out than the rear ones. Rotated them for the first time since new so the worn out ones are at the back and the better ones are at the front.

I faced this problem couple of years back, from then-on with my new Michelin I rotate the tyres for every 6000 - 7000 Kms. All is good now, hopefully in future as-well :-)

[planet_rocker]

Originally Posted by great_guns

8) The high-mounted stop lamp is always filled with water when it rains and due to rust in the contacts, has stopped working. I'm not sure if the water is leaking in through the rear wiper-fluid nozzle which is mounted on top of the lamp or through a leak in the wind-shield seal (I had the windshield replaced a couple of years ago).

Where have i seen this before? - I remember, it happens in my GTX.

The Third brake light cluster remains filled with water and seeps through the rear windshield (cabin side). When i opened the boot lid, the rain water poured out of it. I thought it was the rubber gasket around the tail gate / weather strip - but it stays dry

it must be the nozzle above the third brake light. Will keep you posted, if i find a solution. for the time being, after every shower, i lift up the tail gate to drain the water out.

[great_guns]

Thanks a lot for the suggestions, guys. I'm trying to find someone in Pune who does a good job with Palios or rather with any car and is dedicated enough to really try and solve problems rather than just suppressing them temporarily just to get away with some quick money.

[rohanjf]

An update on my Palio.

For the last one year or so, there used to be a rattling sound coming from front right side wheel. I got both the lower arms replaced, but the sound remained. Next, mounting pads were replaced. Sound still remained. KHT Motors were not able to locate the source of the rattle. They even dismantled the whole suspension assembly (right in front of me) and said suspensions are fine.

When I drove to Mangalore and then to Goa (where sections of national highways are much worse than village roads), the rattling sound increased. Earlier, it would come only on bumpy stretches, but now it was coming all the time.

So I took the car to a local mechanic in Ponda (Goa). He inspected the front right wheel for 5 minutes. Then he told me he'll solve the problem in next 5 minutes.

He accessed the brake calipers, removed the caliper pins (screws), then wrapped a tape around the screws and put them back. After that, I have driven the car for over a thousand kilometres, no problem! The mechanic has told me to get the caliper pins replaced if the problem persists.

However, the RPM fluctuation has become more apparent. So, there has to be a connection between brake caliper pins and RPM fluctuation. Would replacing the caliper pins solve the problem?

I have another problem. While driving on the highway at about 5 AM, I was blinded by an oncoming truck's 4 lights and hit some animal. It was not a big animal, probably a cat or a pup.

The lower part of the front grille (black piece) has come off. I am unable to fix it back, as it requires dismantling the bumper first. The same Ponda mechanic used feviqwik to fix it, but that didn't last the journey from Goa to Bangalore.

The radiator is exposed, so I need to put the black part back in place. Is there any "jugaad" I can do?

[pareshraheja]

Originally Posted by rohanjf

Would replacing the caliper pins solve the problem?

I doubt if the two are related. Sometime back I had mentioned about the same being related to the brake switch. I did get that cleaned. The problem only seem to reduce marginally.

Last year (Dec 2012) I had the complete caliper assembly changed under warranty due to the metal grinding noise coming from the brakes, Prerana (Vecto) struggled to get to bottom of the issue for 8 months. Finally, after replacing the assembly, the problem was solved. But, neither before or after the replacement, did I get the issue of RPM fluctuation. Instead it started sometime in April 2013. So, I suspect it may be related to the timing belt. The same is already due for a change in my case as I have crossed 75 K.

Whats the mileage on your car. Why I ask this is coz who ever has mentioned about this problem seems to have covered at least 60 K on their MJD.

Cheers

[rohanjf]

Originally Posted by pareshraheja

Whats the mileage on your car. Why I ask this is coz who ever has mentioned about this problem seems to have covered at least 60 K on their MJD.

Cheers

Right.
It is 98600 KMs.
The timing chain was replaced at about 49000 KMs. Do you suggest I get it changed? Considering that the current timing chain is now as old as the stock one, my regular Fiat ASS (KHT) should have suggested this when I got the car serviced 3 weeks ago, but they did not. Even I forgot to ask about it, or to check the manual. And the manual is always in the car

[funkykar]

Brake caliper noise is common across any car brand. My Palio MJD has had it almost 90% of kms I have driven so far (54k on 2010 model). It has got nothing to do with RPM issue you are facing. Also, a simple test of hitting the tyre with your fist and observing the sound that comes out of it can tell you if there is caliper pin noise. You get a metallic kind of sound instead of the rubbery sound. AFAIK, with the sound, it can only cause irritation and nothing can go wrong with brakes system. Even with new caliper pins, the sound came back just after a few thousand kms. The work around done by the mechanic is a good one and many MASS mechanics do it. They even cut a layer of a cool drink tin, wrap the insides of caliper pin and put tape on top of it. Getting this done say every service may give some peace of mind.

I sincerely doubt if any mechanics at FASS can really diagnose the not so common issues. You need to take it to some mechanic with a zeal to fix issues, just like the one you mentioned in Goa.

Timing belt replaced so early and you are considering to replace again within 1L? I feel shocked. What was the reason to change it at 49k? I know of many MJDs who bought along with me who have done between 40k to 85k, none have got the timing replaced as yet. IIRC, its at 1L you need to replace. I may be wrong though, but thats my gut feeling.

EDIT: Just read the owners handbook. The timing belt replacement seems necessary every 60k kms. I will need to check on my friends why it wasnt replaced in their cases.

[lejhoom]

Originally Posted by funkykar

EDIT: Just read the owners handbook. The timing belt replacement seems necessary every 60k kms. I will need to check on my friends why it wasnt replaced in their cases.

Palio MJD has a chain. Belt comes in petrol cars.

Chain doesn't require changes that often.

[paragsachania]

Originally Posted by rohanjf

However, the RPM fluctuation has become more apparent. So, there has to be a connection between brake caliper pins and RPM fluctuation. Would replacing the caliper pins solve the problem?

Hi Rohan, I am very sure that there is absolutely no connection between the Brake Caliper Pins and the RPM fluctuations you are facing.

Most of the cars have this parameter called "Desired RPM" set in the ECU that ensures engines to maintain a steady RPM during Idle. There are also cars where the RPM would increase by 50-100 depending on whether the AC is turned ON (Or even when compressor is Cutting ON-OFF). At least in the Ertiga I have seen the RPM increase by 100 when I turn the AC On (MJD Engine again) but have verified the same in funkykar's Palio MJD on many occasions and the RPM stays steady even with the AC on.

Secondly, if the fluctuation is happening when you are already at a certain throttle position (say driving at 60-70kmph) and increases/decreases, it would be a faulty throttle position sensor ( assuming Palio MJD is also Drive by wire).

I am sure you would also rule out clutch slippage here as you would be the best judge to tell us about this aspect.

You will need to consider all the mechanism responsible for Diesel Injection in this case.

[rohanjf]

Originally Posted by funkykar

Timing belt replaced so early and you are considering to replace again within 1L? I feel shocked. What was the reason to change it at 49k?

My car was under my then employer's lease plan when timing chain was changed, and lease was about to end. The maintenance was paid by the leasing company. So I utilised the facility to the maximum by getting some wear-n-tear parts changed

Originally Posted by paragsachania

Secondly, if the fluctuation is happening when you are already at a certain throttle position (say driving at 60-70kmph) and increases/decreases, it would be a faulty throttle position sensor ( assuming Palio MJD is also Drive by wire).

I am sure you would also rule out clutch slippage here as you would be the best judge to tell us about this aspect.

RPM fluctuates only when the car is moving in neutral gear (which I do only to test this), or when I press the clutch fully when the car is moving (sometimes it so happens that you want to shift up and so you press the clutch, but some mental case biker/pedestrian appears out of nowhere, which forces you to slow down).

Clutch was replaced about 15k KMs ago, because I thought the RPM fluctuation was because of worn out clutch. After dismantling the clutch, the FASS mechanic at KHT said the clutch still had a life of another 10K KMs. I still have that clutch with me, because I might be able to use in future

[architect]

Originally Posted by rohanjf

RPM fluctuates only when the car is moving in neutral gear (which I do only to test this), or when I press the clutch fully when the car is moving (sometimes it so happens that you want to shift up and so you press the clutch, but some mental case biker/pedestrian appears out of nowhere, which forces you to slow down).

If you are facing RPM fluctuation when you suddenly move to neutral in emergency braking or while downshifting, check your clutch pedal sensor switch. Mine was broken and I had the same problem. Its a 200-rupee part.

[antorquetik]

Hi all

My palio's condenser got hit again and is punctured.I do not wish to buy a new OE fiat condenser for 19k. Has anyone tried compatible condensers? Any made in taiwan ones? or any subros stuff available?
I do not want a refurbished condenser from kava either. Hoping to find some solution.

I have also been experiencing faster tyre wear on front wheels. Looks more like a camber wear where inner shoulder is getting eaten up faster. My car does continuous highway runs and alignment every 3k KM is ensured.I am running 14" yoko A drives. I have done about 20k km on these tyres and just change the direction of rotation (tyre face inside out and vice versa) expecting another 15-20k of life.


My car had a frontal hit recently and lost the radiator, intercooler, condenser and a fan motor along with a headlamp. I was able to find all parts from scrap leaving the condenser. It would be great to keep everyone updated if one comes across any palio mjds getting scrapped.

[h14]

Another option on the caliper pin noise is to get the same brass welded! The caliper noise in Stile is comparatively lower than in the older 1.2's. During the 1.2 days TVS would use the insulation tape juggad in every service. My current MJD hardly had the caliper noise until recently (59k on the odo now).

Few months back, my S10 had the calier noise and my mech suggested a better way than the insulation tape which was to get them welded with brass.

This he told lasts longer without noise. Unfortunatley I was not in town when this work was done and so have no pics to share. Car has done around 4k kms after this so no idea on the logetivity of this fix. Will keep the same updated in my onwership log.

[Black_Beast]

Originally Posted by antorquetik

Hi all

My palio's condenser got hit again and is punctured.I do not wish to buy a new OE fiat condenser for 19k. Has anyone tried compatible condensers? Any made in taiwan ones? or any subros stuff available?
I do not want a refurbished condenser from kava either. Hoping to find some solution.

I had similar problem, got a new (not OEM) one from AC shop. Got it fitted probably an year ago for 9K and its working good no issues.
You can check with some local Car AC mechanic shop