[StarrySky]

The hike in price of the new Swift has certainly resulted in Swift being compared to more competitors like the Punto. I think Punto compares well with Swift in several areas. Everyone is comparing Swift ZDi to Punto 90HP, however the 75HP E.Pack is also as loaded as the 90HP version (and Swift ZDi) and will probably be available at the same price as Swift ZDi (considering discounts on Punto).

But, I think comparison with Punto is not going to hurt the Swift because 75% of Swift buyers will still anyway buy Swift "because it's a Maruti" (no negative connotations intended) and 24% will not buy Punto "because it's a Fiat". So maybe Swift will lose 1% buyers to the Punto

Originally Posted by RGK

Actually it is not the metrics about boot size. The convenience of carrying more luggage is definitely missing in new Swift (which was highlighted by almost all users of old swift). So MUL should have taken a note of this and rectified in this new car.

I don't think MSIL had any say in the design of the new Swift. Perhaps, the European market demanded better ride and handling from the Swift and it is in that area where Suzuki seems to have concentrated. That, and front seat comfort.

[KarthikK]

Originally Posted by bigvishnu

Pepsi - Coke like ad campaigns... I have never seen a car maker give an "open challenge" to Swift until this morning, when i woke up to my "The Hindu" last page that has a full page Advert where Vista Vx throws an open challenge to Swift VDI.

Open Challenge | New Vista Vs New Swift

Sorry for going slightly OT, but this is a bit over the top. In the interiors section, Black and Beige sahara interiors, and in the exteriors I see this - "Triple Barrel headlamps" What on earth does sahra interiors mean? and "triple barrel", really. They put plus for Vista and "not available" for swift. How does that become a plus point for vista, compared to swift? Those are design principles and not anything which exceed Swift's headlamp functionality. I can't understand how they project such subjective design principles and claim to be superior. On another note, I guess they (tata's marketing team) feel the aam admi may be taken in by such things and go for Vista.

[Daewood]

Originally Posted by romeomidhun

How only in Team-BHP, only a few drawbacks like smaller boot took the centre-stage and comes to the conclusion that the car is an utter disappointment?

Most of the comments about the boot are as if, the earlier Swift had an XL sized boot.

Originally Posted by bigvishnu

Pepsi - Coke like ad campaigns... I have never seen a car maker give an "open challenge" to Swift until this morning, when i woke up to my "The Hindu" last page that has a full page Advert where Vista Vx throws an open challenge to Swift VDI.

Guess the guys at TATA got their inspiration from the Mini Vs Porsche challenge.

[ra'ul M]

Originally Posted by sids911

OK Guys,

I just received a call from my dealer in Pune that my Swift ZXi is getting shipped. It would arrive in 7 days.

He has asked me to arrange for rest of the payment.

With the ongoing labor issues, I heard there were quite a few quality issues. Would it be prudent for me to go for this car at this point of time? Or should I wait just a little more?

With the Jazz commanding a 6 months time for delivery and no other petrol hatch that suiting my fancy - this is the only car that I was counting upon.

I don't think Maruti will pass a car without doing a thorough PDI. That is how all the issues got highlighted in the first place. However, you should do your own PDI before accepting the car. Keep the Team-bhp PDI checklist handy. It's quite awesome

[bigvishnu]

Originally Posted by KarthikK

Sorry for going slightly OT, but this is a bit over the top. In the interiors section, Black and Beige sahara interiors, and in the exteriors I see this - "Triple Barrel headlamps" What on earth does sahra interiors mean? and "triple barrel", really. They put plus for Vista and "not available" for swift. How does that become a plus point for vista, compared to swift? Those are design principles and not anything which exceed Swift's headlamp functionality. I can't understand how they project such subjective design principles and claim to be superior. On another note, I guess they (tata's marketing team) feel the aam admi may be taken in by such things and go for Vista.

Karthik, agree with you on some of the flimsy comparisons, however, some are actually real differences (dual tone interiors, intelligent rear wipers, ABS, music system with bluetooth, electronic levers for AC etc etc ) which we must appreciate tata to bring to the market, at a cost lower than the swifts' equivalent mid variant.

[beast_within]

Originally Posted by bigvishnu

Karthik, agree with you on some of the flimsy comparisons, however, some are actually real differences (dual tone interiors, intelligent rear wipers, ABS, music system with bluetooth, electronic levers for AC etc etc ) which we must appreciate tata to bring to the market, at a cost lower than the swifts' equivalent mid variant.

From our previous experiences with TATA , more the electrical/ electronic controls and gadgets a TATA vehicle has higher are the chances of failure

[GTO]

Originally Posted by opendro

Funny that you say we need a more powerful diesel mill for the Figo. Are we forgetting that Figo has the same diesel engine that powers the Fiesta Classic?

Whoever said the Fiesta was quick? I've always insisted that the Fiesta / Figo 1.4 diesels are under-powered, especially on the open road. They do the job in the city though.

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

Trace back to the WagonR and Ritz review, for instance.

Wouldn't agree on the WagonR; its a phenomenally practical car at a cheap price. And most comments were in favour of its positioning. And yes, the Ritz did have a rather slow start in the market too.

Originally Posted by RGK

As far as Diesel hatches are concerned, Swift is the best to drive. No second opinion on that.

No doubt on that. It isn't the engine alone either; the sharp steering & sorted suspension greatly add to the "fun to drive" factor.

Originally Posted by HammerHead

Apart from 'Balanced ride' what else has significantly improved in new Swift?

Ride quality (the biggie really)
Refinement
Equipment (Z aside, even V gets some more goodies now)
Interior fit & feel
Back seat space
Lesser turbo-lag
Fuel efficiency (either engine is claimed to be ~5% more efficient)

That's quite a lot for a "same formula, only improved" package that looks nearly identical to the outgoing car. Remember, with the previous Swift's resounding success, Maruti wouldn't want to do things differently. You want more practicality? Buy the Ritz.

Originally Posted by Rigid Rotor

Regarding the difference in brakes -
I'm not sure whether this has been pointed out earlier.
Check out GTO's engine bay pics of the diesel (L variant) & pertrol (Z variant)
Zoom into the top left area near the brake reservoir.

I am not sure whether the Diesel L variant has a vaccum brake booster whereas the circular Black vaccum booster is clearly visible in the petrol Z variant (lower pic).

You got an eagle eye man! Thanks for sharing your observation.

Originally Posted by manesh_nambiar

The use of hydraulic engine mounts which gives this car(especially the diesel) its new found smoothness(NVH).

Moderator Jaggu insists that his diesel Swift (previous gen) also has hydraulic engine mounts. That's why I haven't added it to my review, though the same has been discussed.

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

BTW, I looked up the boot-space in the comparo and it is 204 for Swift vs 232 for Vista, which does not seem that big a difference. Are we really making a big deal of the Swift's boot

The Vista's smaller boot can still be forgiven, considering the spacious interiors. Heck, it can beat most sedans from a higher segment and is currently the most spacious hatchback in India. Also, the Tata's boot is more useable (space aside). But the Swift is neither spacious, nor has a useable boot. A failure in packaging, really.

Originally Posted by sids911

With the ongoing labor issues, I heard there were quite a few quality issues. Would it be prudent for me to go for this car at this point of time? Or should I wait just a little more?

Don't worry about it; go get your car home and share an ownership report with us

Originally Posted by StarrySky

But, I think comparison with Punto is not going to hurt the Swift because 75% of Swift buyers will still anyway buy Swift "because it's a Maruti" (no negative connotations intended) and 24% will not buy Punto "because it's a Fiat". So maybe Swift will lose 1% buyers to the Punto

You have just cracked me up! Superb, and very witty, reasoning. Hope we can meet at a Team-BHP do sometime.

[RGK]

Originally Posted by StarrySky

I don't think MSIL had any say in the design of the new Swift. Perhaps, the European market demanded better ride and handling from the Swift and it is in that area where Suzuki seems to have concentrated. That, and front seat comfort.

Sorry to differ. Even though MSIL did not disclose anything till the launch, it was an expectation by many buyers that the new model will have a large boot. A great hatch designed for highway driving need to have a decent boot capacity to fulfill the dream of long drives.

PS: During long drives, now a days these things have become common.
1. Mineral water
2. Camera/tripod
3. Pillows
4. Individual bags for kids
5. Laptops

So boot usage is more now a days and one need to push some things inside the rear seat or under the front seats if the boot does not have enough space.

[arun_josie]

Originally Posted by RGK

Sorry to differ. Even though MSIL did not disclose anything till the launch, it was an expectation by many buyers that the new model will have a large boot. A great hatch designed for highway driving need to have a decent boot capacity to fulfill the dream of long drives.

Very true, all this cry about boot space is just because that despite increasing the length of the car they didn't bother to increase the boot instead they reduced it by 26ltrs. At least the 60:40 split would have helped to a certain extent. For those who go on frequent long drives, this boot space is not going to be enough when the number of travelers is 4 adults.

[opendro]

Originally Posted by GTO

Whoever said the Fiesta was quick? I've always insisted that the Fiesta / Figo 1.4 diesels are under-powered, especially on the open road. They do the job in the city though.

I wouldn't want to argue whether Figo/Fiesta TDCi is underpowered or not, because that is a relative term. I'm only comparing with Swift's power. Here I'm quoting some figures from ACI. For instance, Swift VDI (earlier BS III days) does 0-100 in 13.87 sec and 0-120 in 22.42 sec. Ikon TDCI does 0-100 in 14.79 sec (equivalent to what the new swift does) and 0-120 in 21.57 sec (which is in fact 2.3 sec quicker than DZire DDiS). Apologies for the cross reference of the Ikon/Figo, I couldn't get the complete acceleration figures for Figo. I believe Figo might be just a bit slower than Ikon TDCI.

So, I don't understand where this conclusion of Swift DDiS being powerful and Ford 1.4 TDCI being underpowered for cars of equivalent segments.

I agree that Ford diesel may not be as rev happy as Swift diesel. But to say that Swift's power is sufficient, but not the Fords is totally wrong. They even do the same top speed in spite of having a difference of 6ps in peak power.

Conclusion is that if one finds home with the power of the new Swift, one should fine home with the power of the Figo diesel.

[GTO]

Originally Posted by opendro

For instance, Swift VDI (earlier BS III days) does 0-100 in 13.87 sec and 0-120 in 22.42 sec. Ikon TDCI does 0-100 in 14.79 sec (equivalent to what the new swift does) and 0-120 in 21.57 sec (which is in fact 2.3 sec quicker than DZire DDiS). Apologies for the cross reference of the Ikon/Figo, I couldn't get the complete acceleration figures for Figo. I believe Figo might be just a bit slower than Ikon TDCI.

Since you quote ACI, the Figo does 0 - 100 in 16.26 seconds! That's like 2.5 seconds slower and a massive difference by any standard. 2.5 seconds is about the difference between the acceleration of a Civic and an i10 Kappa2.

[normally_crazy]

Originally Posted by normally_crazy

Where is the Skoda Fabia ? It's a pretty competent performer as well and sales have been steady if not spectacular !

Why isnt anyone replying on this query ?

The Fabia is not considered competition to the New Swift ?

[opendro]

Originally Posted by GTO

Since you quote ACI, the Figo does 0 - 100 in 16.26 seconds! That's like 2.5 seconds slower and a massive difference by any standard. 2.5 seconds is about the difference between the acceleration of a Civic and an i10 Kappa2.

Point taken, 2 sec is significant. Out of curiosity, what is the figure for 0-120 for Figo (somehow I'm unable to get anything on Figo on net)? I'm sure it must be around that 23 or 24 secs which the DZire DDiS also takes. I leave the rest to Figo TDCi owners to defend or throw some light

Comparing the power figures and acceleration times of Civic and i10 Kappa2 is a wrong example though. That would be like saying an alto K10 is much more powerful than an Octavia 1.9 TDI (in terms of 0-100).

[StarrySky]

Originally Posted by RGK

Sorry to differ. Even though MSIL did not disclose anything till the launch, it was an expectation by many buyers that the new model will have a large boot. A great hatch designed for highway driving need to have a decent boot capacity to fulfill the dream of long drives.

In India, yes. What I was trying to say is that Suzuki (not MSIL) designed the Swift with European demands in mind - where a family going on a highway trip will probably use their big car or rent one for the purpose.

[RadiantKarma]

I see the new Swift giving rise to zillions of conflicts between Mr. Head and Mr. Heart.

In some cases, Heart is a clear winner on account of limited practical applications that can be found by the Head. Head may even side with the Heart. In certain cases, the Head will easily overrule the Heart for overwhelming practical considerations. But there would be large number of cases with tug of war between these two peculiar entities. A typical case can play out like this.

Heart always craved for a hot hatch with the fabulous combination of ride quality and handling of a Punto. Head would rule out citing it was from Fiat and there would be practical issues. Poor Heart would meekly give in holding on to his precious dream for some brighter day.

Swoosh! The launch of Swift 2011 changed all that. The almost unreal combination, even better, was now suddenly available with the looks and spunk of an improved Swift. That too from Maruti! Whoa! All the excuses of the Head - reliability, FE, A.S.S. blah blah - would now be taken care of. The practical Dream Car had finally arrived! Heart lost no time in putting forth the demand for the new Swift with total confidence of approval by the Head.

Only he had not reckoned with the ability of the Head to look into impossible corners to find issues! Head said the car was now pricier, still not enough space at the back, and what, they have cut down on the boot space for this price?! No way! Heart was absolutely taken aback! He looked up the figures. What? He shot back. For mere 26 litres of boot, all my dreams are going down the drain?! Head was merciless in his practicality. If 26 litres don't matter to you, sacrifice another 24 litres and go for Brio, will at least save heaps of money! And for a sacrifice of ride quality, you'd also get the H badge! Heart accused Head for his unreasonability. Earlier you'd talk about reliability, FE, A.S.S. etc. Now, I give you all that you asked for, you bring up this silly issue of boot just to boot out my dream! Head smiled back saying these are no longer the sole preserve of Maruti, equal or even better offerings on these aspects are now available from its bigger Janpanese brothers, and they offer lots of space too, which is more important. Go look for one of them. Heart was persistent - but none offers the dream-like combination of ride quality and handling. Head argued back that he had to take care of the entire family needs which meant sufficient boot space would be a pre-requisite. The fight went on and on.

In some case, the ebullient Hearts emerged victorious. The dominant Heads won in certain cases. There were bruised Heads and broken Hearts too. The word has that the battle is assuming epic proportions!

The number of successful munities by Heart over Head will determine the success of this hot hatch! Or is the entire news of battle just a blown-up rumour?!

On my part, I am happy that I am presently not in the market looking for a car for my family!