[suman]

Originally Posted by ST7677

To be fair, let's understand that every mfg does a new launch with some known shortcomings (though not significant)

And, I cannot resist echoing what Amit had said earlier - to be fair, do we tolerate these known shortcomings in any other manufacturer so tolerantly as we do for Honda???????

[goldie_malhotra]

Originally Posted by suman

I think its silly having accessories that do not come as standard fitment on at least one of the variants.

Maybe not in a cost-concious market like India. What if someone down south does not require fog-lamps - it helps save around 18k per car, and part of this is passed on to all customers (though I doubt honda here) . Those who require it, would anyway pay more to get one. Ditto for the leather. Both are easy and convenient to fit.

[goldie_malhotra]

btw - nice reviews, ST and sandeep - u guys seem to have taken over this thread

[suman]

Originally Posted by goldie_malhotra

Maybe not in a cost-concious market like India. What if someone down south does not require fog-lamps - it helps save around 18k per car, and part of this is passed on to all customers (though I doubt honda here) . Those who require it, would anyway pay more to get one. Ditto for the leather. Both are easy and convenient to fit.

That's not what I was pointing out, allow me to elaborate.....what I'm saying is you have two scenarios -

1) Manufacturer launches two (or more) variants, one has bare essentials, the other has all the goodies including fog lamps, leather seats, spoilers etc
2) Manufacturer launches ONE variant only which has no goodies and then sells each goody as an accessory at unjustified prices.

In the Civics case, it appears to be the latter and that is what I'm calling silly. I'm not even debating the merits & demerits of after market fitments as that is an endless debate by itself.

[goldie_malhotra]

Originally Posted by suman

That's not what I was pointing out, allow me to elaborate.....what I'm saying is you have two scenarios -

1) Manufacturer launches two (or more) variants, one has bare essentials, the other has all the goodies including fog lamps, leather seats, spoilers etc
2) Manufacturer launches ONE variant only which has no goodies and then sells each goody as an accessory at unjustified prices.

In the Civics case, it appears to be the latter and that is what I'm calling silly. I'm not even debating the merits & demerits of after market fitments as that is an endless debate by itself.

Perhaps they can bring in the US/EU model of packaging where you the base car at base price and then you get accessories in various reasonable packages like

- Sports package - smaller steering, bigger tyres, go-faster cosmetics
- Winter package - fogs, heated seats, demisters ....
- Luxury package - leather seats, climate control, 12 speaker system .....

(OT: I think they were offering something of this sort on Swift recently.)

Though, the OEM prices are not any lower than they are in India. But, the difference in India is we can get after-market accessories at a much cheaper price.

[normally_crazy]

Originally Posted by suman

to be fair, do we tolerate these known shortcomings in any other manufacturer so tolerantly as we do for Honda???????

Absolutely NOT !! Sad but True !

ps- Im all set for the roasting now !

[RD_dude]

I cant belive nobody is even talking about the 0 to 100 and 0 to 150 specs. Comon guys we know the weight of the car, The torque and the power too, after going through all this see if we can guess how much the 0 to 100 and 0 to 150 kmph will be !! or has any mags released any test drive figures ? For convienince:
MT: - 1210 kgs, torque 17.5 Kg-m @ 4,300 rpm, power 132ps @ 6300 rpm
AT: - 1240 kgs, rest all is same.

[ST7677]

So does Civic needs an additional security system...?
As the car comes with following features...

1. Transmitter integrated key
2. Immobilizer
3. Security alarm (with "answer back" function)

more over the since the head unit is integrated it is not an easy target...
Am I correct?

[sandeep108]

Originally Posted by ST7677

So does Civic needs an additional security system...?
As the car comes with following features...

1. Transmitter integrated key
2. Immobilizer
3. Security alarm (with "answer back" function)

more over the since the head unit is integrated it is not an easy target...
Am I correct?

I do not think so. It is similar to swift zxi/corolla. I do not think I am even going to fit side mirror guards. In Mumbai nowadays nobody has much time and is a big hassle in retraction/view is lost, etc.

0-100 specs? It simply feels quite fast, definitely faster than corolla, definitely not as fast as octy. Where are the roads to drive on man? Even expressway / highway full of nuts who have no driving / civic sense (pun intended!)17.5 is much more than corolla's 16.1. IMHO even 80 speed limit one has to be careful on e/h way. That is why as even ST7677 did, I may just go for that AT.

I still feel that for accessories our tax structure is to blame. It is far easier for dealer / customer both to make money than for mfr. to provide. Customers afraid of warranty can go to dealer and pay 25% more than mkt and maybe 25% less than mfr., others can simply go to market. Just ask for bills in the market and you will see difference vanish.

[pole_position]

Well I would have liked stock HIDs for sure. Sunroof is not important [mumbai].. After getting K&N Filter I have to source those HIDs from US. Main question is for alloys, 16" or 17"??

[sandeep108]

Originally Posted by pole_position

Well I would have liked stock HIDs for sure. Sunroof is not important [mumbai].. After getting K&N Filter I have to source those HIDs from US. Main question is for alloys, 16" or 17"??

I think both K&N and HIDs you should be able to get in Mumbai. Look into Autocar India trade section at back. K&N should be around 7-9k, HIDs, if you want all 4 beams may be around 25k+.

Looking at condition of roads, I would not go beyond 16".

[ST7677]

My shopping list would be something like below. Request BHPians to guide me to best places (and approx cost) to get these done in Bangalore...

1. Putting Stanley Leather Upholstry (Dealer quotes starting from 35k)
2. Putting Sunfilm. Thinking of VKool for front and LLumar, etc for sides and rear
3. Subwoofer & amp
4. Body mods - front/rear bumper, side skirts, boot spoiler
5. Philips Crystal Vision Halogen Headlamps
6. K&N filter
7. Teflon coating
8. Body cover


Am I missing something?

[adarsh76]

Originally Posted by suman

And, I cannot resist echoing what Amit had said earlier - to be fair, do we tolerate these known shortcomings in any other manufacturer so tolerantly as we do for Honda???????

It seems that Honda launches new cars with these shortcomings and experiments it on the initial buyers. When they get the feedback they'll rectify it. Good strategy!!!!

[GTO]

Some interestingly varied opinions on the Civic. Has Honda delivered what the Indian consumer wants?

A contemporary product. Yup
Fuel Efficiency. Yup (Presumably)
Nice interiors Yup
A good brand name. Yup
Appropriate pricing Yup
Gizmos Yup (save for the fog lamps etc)

I can hardly wait to test drive this beast!

GTO

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by adarsh76

It seems that Honda launches new cars with these shortcomings and experiments it on the initial buyers. When they get the feedback they'll rectify it. Good strategy!!!!

Hey Adarsh76, looks like you got the Tatas confused with the Hondas. That's the Tata strategy you mentioned, of using the initial buyers of any of their products as guinea pigs.

And BTW, these are not shortcomings (as in defects / issues with the product), but pricing strategies which is the manufacturer's prerogative, and subject to the buyer's acceptance. A new product being priced high or accessories sold separately etc is a normal marketing practice and a balance will be reached between the seller and buyer as the product matures. For now, the seller would like to skim the max. possible cream from the niche segment that wants to have the product first. And if that market is OK with the premium so as to have the distinction of owning the car first, what's the issue ? Applies to all products - not a Honda thing.