[kpzen]

Originally Posted by Path_Finder

Well, I bought a new set of slippers last weekend and I find the grip improved after one day of walk-in. I guess it could be the same with tires too.

Path Finder
No Offense ! I simply couldn't resist these questions.
1. What speeds did u test your slippers at?
2. How was the braking after one day walk in ?
3. What's the sole pattern of your slippers? Uni-directional/Symmetrical or asymmetrical?
4. What brand? Yoko or Michelin.?

[nitrous]

OT:

Originally Posted by pathfinder

The present day car user manuals also do not talk of any run in – in fact when I asked the service manager, he even said “crap, these cars are not like old Ambys”. But I guess even then it is a generally accepted fact a run in for first 2K is good for a new car.

Go read the user's manual of the latest BMW M3.

[iceman91]

Well a LONG LONG thread,
Tadukuttan nice running into you on saturday !

I think what you experienced with tires was not unusual but at the same time a matter to be concerned about.

In august I put on s drives 205/50/15 on a friends NHC, the next day we left to goa. I would say they were the worst tires ever!! They screeched, spun like crazy and were scary when wet.

Came back and vowed never to get them for my car as I needed new rubber.
I was considering some expensive tires but the budget dint even come close so one fine day I went and got S drives, Thanks vikram.
The tire guy is a friend and swore by them for the price and VFM.

Car rolls out and feels a lot more free and smooth. i dint push it and drove normally for a bit. 100-150km later the car handles bettter than my es-100's
I have pushed it in rain, sand and dry tarmac. IMO it handled best in the rain. I was very surprised and as usual got a I told you so from Vikram!

I wont swear on them as "performance" tires for me/my driving but very very good daily drives.

There you go Anirudh sorry for the delay

[autoenthusiast]

Thanks ICEMAN91

So to summarise if I understood correctly.

When the S. Drives were new, the drive was really bad, but after clocking some mileage the drive improved tremendously.

Would the above statement be correct ?

And what is your opinion of the S. Drives today ? since I'm wondering if I should put them on my new car.

[iceman91]

No not really.
Goa and back I covered 1800km no difference.
My car 150km.
So i have doubts on quality here

[tadukuttan]

Originally Posted by iceman91

Tadukuttan nice running into you on saturday !

That was indeed a pleasant surprise, and I would have never thought I will meet you and Thouqeer in the middle of nowhere! You guys have a good trip?

And next time, hopefully I wont have hungry kids to feed, and I get to see *the* Baleno.

I trust your review of the tires, and I am not surprised at all. I have been doing some surveys and research etc on this topic, and what I have learned is that these tires have a higher chance of misbehaving on cars with unnaturally high braking bite. For eg, for my car, the 80-0 from autocar was some 21.xx meters. That is some mighty high braking power there, even when compared to a Merc/BMW etc at 24.xx meters usually. Most other road going cars are way higher than that. So what was happening is that the brakes grip like crazy, tires cant take it, ABS comes on, and I dont get to stop. So now, I try braking/squeeling etc for couple of times, the tires probably overheat, and loose it completely...

Even with the cheapest Michelins, the ABS almost never comes on, even when braking from 200. I think I payed some 4k each for my last set of Michelins, and those tires were at least 50% better under braking, on my car. Of course, no point in comparing to the PP2 I am on now. My poor car cant even make the bloody thing protest, what ever I do.

Originally Posted by Jaggu

I dont think tyre manufacturer will admit to something like this in the first place, will they???

Probably not in India. But consider the case of a country like the United States where they print silly warning labels on everything. Like a ladder could have a label that goes "Climbing the ladder might make you fall down" and so on. If the running in thingy was as serious, and there was no warning label, sure as hell we would have seen a class action suit by now.

Originally Posted by Path_Finder

Well, I bought a new set of slippers last weekend and I find the grip improved after one day of walk-in. I guess it could be the same with tires too. Over to the tire experts.

Originally Posted by kpzen

4. What brand? Yoko or Michelin.?

You guys are hilarious, and that had me

[nitrous]

Tire Tech Information - Breaking In Your Tires

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by tadukuttan

Probably not in India. But consider the case of a country like the United States where they print silly warning labels on everything. Like a ladder could have a label that goes "Climbing the ladder might make you fall down" and so on. If the running in thingy was as serious, and there was no warning label, sure as hell we would have seen a class action suit by now.

My point was the litigation angle and hence manufacturers will not willingly put up a disclaimer. How many car manufacturer mention engine run in in the hand book?

On the other hand there should be some amount of truth behind this phenomenon, since its widely discussed and accepted in almost all the automotive/racing forums of the world i.e "breaking in of new tires".

Some even goto the extreme of using sand paper to scrape off a layer

More i read more i understand that its not only the top layer but also the whole tire that needs complete bedding in/seating in rim etc. What all one panic braking on a new set off tires can make you do !

[greatDrive]

I have 205/50/R15 S drives on my petra (Put them last year Sept).
Have done 15K after that of which 10K purely on Highways( on Delhi- Agra highway).
Driven with all kind of speed ( Ranging to maximum of 160kmph).
Driven in all Kind of weather ( temp less than 10C to more than 45C and even monsoon when it rained heavily). Have never had any complains till now. Everything was just perfect. I was amazed by the performance at high speeds and specially when turning on curves. I have never had any complains about braking. (Can compare to only MRFs which I have used till date)

Best thing which I liked was even with wider profile ( stock was 175/65/R14), My mileage didn't suffer, Actually it increased by almost 1kmpl which is hard to explain (May be because of the OZ Alloys were put at the same time).

Michillin with the same profile was Rs1200 more than Sdrives, so I look ate Sdrives more of a VFM product.

Cheers

[Mohan Uthappa]

Originally Posted by theMAG

Tadu,

There have been scattered reports about "inconsistent manufacturing quality" of the S-drives here. If your tyres are under legal warranty, this problem might be something worthwhile pursuing with Yokohama India.

I would like to know what is the "inconsistent manufacturing quality" that you are talking about. Pls update......

[tadukuttan]

Originally Posted by Mohan Uthappa

I would like to know what is the "inconsistent manufacturing quality" that you are talking about. Pls update......

You want to buy these tires?

[autoenthusiast]

Originally Posted by tadukuttan

Thanks dude, but these are just like you or me writing, on blogs, forums etc. What I was saying was that, I cant seem to find absolutely no "official" information on this from the manufacturers themselves?

Well my new Fiesta user manual definitely does have a reference to the running in period for new tyres. If any of you would like, I can paste a photograph of the page.

Ford Fiesta User Manual Page 8.
Quote: "New tyres require a running in distance of approximately 500 kms, during this period the car may exhibit different driving characteristics. Therefore, avoid driving too briskly during the first 500 kms.

[kuttapan]

Originally Posted by tadukuttan

Never realized car "bibles" is into manufacturing both Michelin and Yokohama.

Please guys, read before posting. I did Google myself, and found these and more links.

What I was saying is - I cannot find a statement from the tire manufacturers about the need for running in of tires.

Maybe this helps, but you can always say that the guy is a hoax.

Scrubbing in new tyres. The Answer(1)

However, there is also this -

Avon Tyres Motorsport - User Advice

There seems to be obvious disadvantages to take a tyre to its limits straight out of the showroom. Even the F1 guys scrub their tyres to reduce graining. Maybe there is fire behind the smoke, after all?

Before you dismiss the above as racing tyre talk, maybe you can look at this as well ->

I quote -

Here are the main rules for managing tyres for 'safety driving' :

• Check the pressure with the tyre cold, at least once a month , including the spare wheel.
• Never reduce the pressure if the tyre is hot.
• Keep to the pressure values indicated on the use and maintenance manual of the vehicle for the different positions and for the type of use foreseen.
• Make sure that the tyre valve always has its cap and that it is only tightened by hand.
• With new tyres drive at a moderate speed for the first 300 kilometres (188 miles). Particularly for class H/V/W/Y/Z tyres, limit the speed for the first 50 kilometres (32 miles).
• After fitting the tyres, make sure the wheel bolts are correctly tightened after the first 100 kilometers.
• Violent blows against the pavement, potholes, and various obstacles may lead to internal tyre damage, which is not immediately evident or visible; in this case, have the inside of the tyre checked by an expert.
• Have the wheel balancing checked periodically.
• Regularly control the tread depth and the uniformity of wear.

I believe Pirelli from whose site I have quoted the above, is a respected tyre manufacturer.

PIRELLI - Driving safely

So there..

[tadukuttan]

Found another guy who did a lot more testing, on a better car, here - New Tire Contender: Yokohama S.drive - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community

His experience is more or less mine, although what made me dump the tires were their scary performance under braking. As he was saying, these tires just break loose...

Originally Posted by autoenthusiast

Ford Fiesta User Manual Page 8.
Quote: "New tyres require a running in distance of approximately 500 kms, during this period the car may exhibit different driving characteristics. Therefore, avoid driving too briskly during the first 500 kms.

Originally Posted by kuttapan

• With new tyres drive at a moderate speed for the first 300 kilometres (188 miles). Particularly for class H/V/W/Y/Z tyres, limit the speed for the first 50 kilometres (32 miles).

PIRELLI - Driving safely

Thanks guys, now we know at least some of the responsible manufacturers warn users about the danger of new tires!

And since we are discussing running-in/scrubbing tires a lot here, maybe it would make sense to move the related posts out?

[kuttapan]

Yes, they should move these posts out in a new thread called - "Tyre scrubbing - Method to this madness".