Finally, concluded that for an Automatic car for an elderly user / a novice driver (myself), a new car with is better than second-hand.

BHPian dashki recently shared this with other enthusiasts.

Hi,

I made my first purchase of Automatic Hatchback, thanks to the inputs I gathered on Team-BHP. So this post is to share my decision-making process, hoping it helps others.

Background / User:

My father, who is 80+ years old, has been using a 2011 model of Hyundai i10. It was a second-hand purchase. I was looking to get him an automatic instead. Since it is only for local city drives in Chennai/Blore, we were initially considering a secondhand. The idea was that he would use the automatic and I would take his manual i10 for my use. Once he stops driving, I would sell the manual and take over the automatic.

When I asked people for input, I understood that apart from the budget, another decision-making factor would be featured. When I applied those filters, I eventually realized a new car may make more sense.

Decision-making factors for second hand vs new car:

• Only Automatic Hatchbacks (we prefer small cars for city drive)
• Budget: started with ~ 5L for second hand, later increased to <10L for new car
• Non-negotiable features for my father's use and myself: Reverse camera with guidelines, hill hold assist
• Others: Automatic - driving experience, resale value, service centers, NCAP safety rating, etc
• I learned on Team-BHP that for an automatic car that is used for more than 20-30k KM, the clutch plate may need replacement / automatic driving experience may not be as good.

Finally, concluded that for an Automatic car for an elderly user / a novice driver (myself), a new car is better than a second-hand.

Which car?

• When I started looking around, I had the following under consideration:
• Renault Kwid
• Maruti Celerio
• Tata Tiago
• Hyundai Grand i10 Nios

Renault Kwid:
Pros -
1. Really liked the reverse camera with guidelines
2. Look & feel; more spacious for a small car
Cons -
1. My test-drive experience was not good, the brakes felt very jerky even though the car had clocked only 3000 KM
2. I learned on this forum (Should I avoid the Renault Kwid Climber AMT?)that Renault Kwid's AMT experience is not good either.
3. Not so good in terms of safety

Maruti Celerio:
Pros:
1. Value for money, uff! The top minus one variant, with some additions like a reverse camera, made it a great deal.
2. Sales experience: Maruti offered a great discount and I was tempted by it. Overall sales experience was really good and I actually booked the car by paying a token advance (later, got a refund).
3. Automatic driving experience: Since Maruti Celerio has AGS, rather than AMT, the drive was smooth
4. After-sales service & resale value
5. Subscription option available (I was considering this for short-term usage and later decided against it)

Cons:
1. Poor NCAP Safety Rating
2. Look & feel - quite basic

Tata Tiago:
Pros:
1. Best NCAP safety rating in this segment

Cons:
1. Service
2. Resale
3. Automatic driving experience not smooth (as per inputs from this thread (Tata Tiago Vs Maruti Ignis Vs Hyundai Grand i10 Nios | City car for my wife))

Hyundai Grand i10 Nios
Pros:
1. Premium look & feel
2. Service
3. Better NCAP safety rating than Maruti Celerio (my next best alternative in the consideration list)
4. Smooth Automatic driving experience (as good as / comparable with Maruti Celerio)
5. Cruise Control is available in the top minus one variant itself

Cons:
1. Significantly more expensive than Renault / Maruti

Verdict / Decision:
I got my Hyundai Grand i10 Nios Sportz automatic delivered 2 days back. It feels so easy, and casual to drive in this. I'm excited about this purchase and looking forward. I am grateful to this forum for having helped with all the information that influenced my purchase decision. Thank you.

Check out BHPian comments for more insights and information.

An authorized dealer with so many resources couldn't correctly diagnose an issue that a local mechanic fixed in a day!

BHPian NT56 recently shared this with other enthusiasts.

We have the first-gen Celerio AMT as a city-beater car in the family. It is being used in a radius of 5 km from home for running errands and clocked just 20k kilometres in 7 years of ownership. Logging down a recent issue that was faced along with a resolution (that might help others)

Issue:

The car started juddering lightly after running for about 10-15 mins. The issue got worse as the temperatures peaked in the summer and the AC started working hard. Once the juddering started the RPM also started fluctuating rapidly at idle and eventually, the engine would stall. The car would still run fine after a cold start for the first few minutes.

Attempted Fix 1:

The car was given to an authorized dealer whose mechanic suspected an issue with the fuel delivery. So he took the following steps sequentially:

1. Cleaned petrol tank
2. Swapped the fuel pump
3. Swapped the ignition coil
4. Swapped the throttle body

None of the above worked and they concluded that this was an engine issue and gave an estimate of 70k for overhauling the engine. This was refused and the car was taken back after 4 days.

Fix:

To get a second opinion a local mechanic was found who had worked on a friend's car before and overhauled the engine. He suspected an electrical fault and was very confident that it isn't an engine issue.

He changed the spark plugs, ignition coil and MAP sensor. He claimed the car was scanned and it was showing the MAP sensor error. He fixed the car in a single day and it's running smooth now!

The root cause is suspected to be the MAP sensor which was giving faulty feedback to the ECM and that in turn was cutting the power to the engine prematurely.

Note:

I am surprised that an authorized dealer with so many resources and technical expertise wasn't able to correctly diagnose the issue that a local mechanic fixed in a day! I don't think it was a case of deliberate misleading but rather just the incompetency of the authorized garage.

Check out BHPian comments for more insights and information.

The Celerio Classic Edition was showcased at the 2023 Bangkok International Motor Show (BIMS).

Suzuki has launched a special edition of the Celerio in Thailand. It’s called the Celerio Classic Edition and it costs approximately Rs 11.62 lakh.

The Celerio Classic Edition gets quite a few updates even by “special edition” standards. It is based on the previous generation model and comes with a bespoke body kit. It includes a black bumper and fender extensions, side skirts and a rear bumper with quad exhaust tips, which obviously are fake.

The Celerio Classic Edition is finished in a retro paint job with a gold roof, a gold stripe and red ORVMs. However, the standout feature is the chrome wheel hub caps. The interior of the car looks pretty stock, except for the dual-tone beige and brown seat upholstery.

The Celerio Classic Edition was showcased at the 2023 Bangkok International Motor Show (BIMS). It is solely aimed at the Thai market and we aren’t complaining.

Source: Rushlane

The Alto K10, Celerio, WagonR, Swift, Dzire, Brezza and Ertiga is available in the Pearl Midnight Black exterior colour.

Maruti Suzuki is celebrating its 40th anniversary with the launch of its Arena Black Editions. As the name suggests, models like the Alto K10, Celerio, WagonR, Swift, Dzire, Brezza and Ertiga are now available in an all-black colour scheme.

The Arena Black Editions get a new Pearl Midnight Black colour option on select variants, details of which, will be revealed at a later date.

Maruti Suzuki’s Arena range of cars are also available with new accessory packages priced between Rs 14,990 to Rs 35,990. These include seat covers, cushions, mats, trim garnishes, chargers and vacuum cleaners.

Earlier, Maruti had introduced Black Editions of its Nexa range. The Nexa Black Edition is available in Zeta and Alpha variants of the Ignis, all variants of the Ciaz, Alpha and Alpha+ variants of the XL6 and Zeta, Zeta+, Alpha and Alpha+ trims of the Grand Vitara.

The carmaker also sells the Ertiga-based Rumion and the Starlet, which is a re-badged Maruti Baleno in South Africa.

Toyota has revealed its Maruti Celerio-based hatchback for the South African market. It’s called the Toyota Vitz.

The Toyota Vitz looks identical to the Celerio sold in India. Except for the Toyota badges, the car uses the same grille and headlamps. The 15-inch gloss black alloy wheels are also identical to the Indian version.

The Toyota Vitz is powered by a 1.0-litre petrol engine that makes 66 BHP and 89 Nm. The engine is paired with either a 5-speed manual or a 5-speed AMT. 

The Vitz is not the only Maruti-based model Toyota offers in South Africa. The carmaker also sells the Ertiga-based Rumion and the Starlet, which is a re-badged Maruti Baleno. All three models are manufactured in India under the Toyota-Suzuki partnership to be exported overseas.

Source: IOL

9,925 vehicles manufactured between August 3 and September 1, 2022,

Maruti Suzuki has recalled three of its popular models: WagonR, Celerio and Ignis, over a rear brake issue.

According to the company, 9,925 vehicles manufactured between August 3 and September 1, 2022, could have a defective rear brake assembly pin. It is said that the defective pin may break and could impact brake performance in the long run.

Maruti Suzuki service centre will be reaching out to customers of the suspected vehicles. Customers are requested to bring in their vehicles for inspection and get the defective part replaced free of cost.

I'm planning to upgrade, hence, along with Toyota's new SUV, I have also booked the new Maruti Brezza.

BHPian MiKeMo recently shared this with other enthusiasts.

Today we visited Wasan Toyota, Navi Mumbai for HyRyder. Spent about 30-40 minutes there, and here are my initial impressions.

Please note that I'm planning to upgrade from Celerio ZXI AMT and hence my benchmark has been Celerio. I have done booking for HyRyder and new Brezza. New Brezza has already been allotted (as per the SA), but I wanted to see HyRyder first and hence I haven't yet seen Brezza.

Toyota showroom was a crowded place, which shows the interest the vehicle has generated. As per my SA, only one vehicle has been received for Mumbai - the top end, full hybrid, eCVT in blue color. The vehicle will leave for other Mumbai showrooms tonight, so BHPians in Mumbai will have a chance to view this vehicle over the next few days.

What I liked

• Size - HyRyder is quite big. Clearly in Creta league, or bigger. It will have a good road presence for sure. I liked the overall proportion. It looked quite good from all sides, except the rear (my personal opinion).
• Exterior: Overall quality, sheet metal, paint etc all look good and quality much better. Placement of DRLs and LED headlights is quite different from vehicles I have seen/driven yet. We (meaning wifey, princess and self) all liked the new arrangements and lighting overall. No fog lamps, as already mentioned in a few walkarounds here.
• Interior: Fit and finish are way above my Celerio. Due to the rush, I could sit inside only for a few minutes, but it was a nice place to be.
• This one had ventilated seats, which are good. Airflow at the highest setting was not much/or I felt that way, however, I could "feel" cooled seats in just under a minute of starting it.
• Sunroof is quite big, would definitely bring enough sunlight when its opened.
• 360 Deg camera had good resolution, SA could just show it for few seconds, though.
• Heads-up display is also having very good resolution, and well positioned.
• Seat comfort - could not judge much in short time I was inside the vehicle - but felt quite good.
• SA confirmed availability of wireless charging, wireless Android Auto and Apple CarPlay.
• Space - both in front and rear - was very good. The space utilization has been a plus point when I see boot also in tandem. I'm 5'8'' and had enough room at the rear when driver seat was set at my position. I asked my daughter to move the driver seat to the farthest and I still had good legroom available in the rear.

Now, the elephant in the room: boot space. Thankfully, I found it to be adequate, at least not a deal breaker. The battery pack had eaten away some precious real estate there, but we would be able to manage - I'm so much relieved. After having a good look at it personally, and a few videos, I'm of the opinion that it will be able to hold two medium suitcases kept upright and four cabin bags behind - after removing parcel tray and a levelling tray kept at the battery pack level. Rearward vision may get a little bit affected if we load so much luggage, though.

What I did not like

• Keeping the driver seat position at the highest level, still, I couldn't see the full bonnet. Driver seat doesn't get electric seat adjustments - it's manual only.
• Doors have good heft, but still lack in comparison to older Germans. A new crop of VAG cars and HyRyder are the same on this aspect, though.
• Missing pedal shifters. I was quite surprised to know that this doesn't have ANY manual mode, so how to handle situation when you would like to take control of gears? SA had no answers. This being an Automatic, I feel a strong need of this, am I mistaken? I use manual mode in my Celerio AMT often in ghats, single-lane highways etc. How HyRyder will fare in such situations? Any comments from more experienced members would help me here.
• Battery operated boot - boot can be opened ONLY when battery is charged. The vehicle here had low battery, and boot couldn't be opened. Later on they Jump started the car to charge battery and opened the boot. There's no way to open the boot with a key or lever, is that possible? If true, it's strange
•  Headroom in rear - found to be less. Tall people or a normal person with a cap / paghdi, will feel this for sure.
• Plastic-ish air vents of AC looked/felt quite ordinary and flimsy. I thought my Celerio has better vents! Glove box is illuminated, but not ventilated.

Some additional info

Test rides only after 10 to 12 days, so mostly in the last week of July. Pricing also in some two weeks. SA reconfirmed his understanding - 18 to 20 Lac, ex-showroom for strong hybrid top model. Soft hybrid would be below this range (in range of new Brezza?).

I am attaching a few snaps I could take in a sea of people. On my way back, I was wondering if I have missed a few points today, and yes, seem many.

Check out BHPian comments for more insights and information.

The Maruti Dzire is offered with a discount of up to Rs. 19,500.

This month, Maruti Suzuki is offering discounts of up to Rs. 54,500 on the Celerio, WagonR, Swift, Alto 800 and Dzire. 

The Celerio gets the highest discount, which includes a cash discount of Rs. 35,000, an exchange bonus of Rs. 15,000 and a corporate discount of Rs. 4,500. 

The WagonR 1.0L comes with a cash discount of Rs. 25,000, an exchange bonus of Rs. 15,000 and a corporate discount of Rs. 4,500. Offers are available on the WagonR 1.2L and Swift as well. Both cars are available with a cash discount of Rs. 15,000, an exchange bonus of Rs. 10,000 and a corporate discount of Rs. 4,500.

The S-Presso gets a cash discount of Rs. 15,000, an exchange bonus of Rs. 10,000 and a corporate discount of Rs. 4,500, while Alto 800 customers can avail of a cash discount of Rs. 10,000, an exchange bonus of Rs. 15,000 and a corporate discount of Rs. 4,500.

The Maruti Dzire is offered with a cash discount of Rs. 5,000, an exchange bonus of Rs. 10,000 and a corporate discount of Rs. 4,500.

The fuel efficiency of the Tata Altroz is better than that of the Maruti Celerio at speeds of 80-100 km/h.

BHPian PrasannaDhana recently replied this to BHPian sumitj71's query.

BHPian sumitj71's query

I have a request for you. Can you do a comparison of Altroz diesel and Celerio?

Even a quick comparison would be very useful because I am thinking about upgrading from Nano. My heart is over Altroz diesel but my mind is towards Celerio. My daily driving is 70km (85% Highway) and once in 3-4 months a long drive of 1000-1500km. I always dreamed of a diesel car, I almost booked a Tiago diesel before BS6 norms but then the COVID struck and got no response from Tata.

Now I'm confused if I should go for Altroz diesel XE+ (can make upgrades later, if required) or Celerio ZXI due to budget constraints. (Looks don't matter to me. Though in the case of Altroz it's added bonus).

My wife only requires the car to be comfortable and has a good AC (Nano's AC is of no use in a summer afternoon with 4 adults). And yes, I also want good drivability.

As you own both of these cars, can you please compare these points?

Thanks in advance.

Altroz diesel and Celerio K10C are 2 very different machines.

Celerio is extremely frugal. Easy 20+ kmpl on the highway.

If your usage is high enough, go for a diesel. That being said, Celerio is extremely frugal too. Easy 20+ kmpl on the highway.

I will suggest Altroz diesel over the Celerio if:

• You like enthusiastic driving, including triple-digit cruising on highways
• You want more space (cabin as well as boot)
• You want a sturdier, safer, well-built car
• You like responsive steering & excellent high-speed manners
• Better fuel efficiency than the Celerio at speeds (80-100 kmph)

I will suggest Celerio over Altroz diesel if:

• Your budget is tight. Altroz base diesel is still 1.5 lakhs more expensive than the top-end Celerio ZXI(O). If you opt for ZXI, the difference becomes a good 2.1 lakhs!
• You are going to be doing a lot of urban usage/ slow highway usage (like KL highways)
• You don't want to put up with Tata A.S.S.

Running cost-wise, the Altroz is still cheaper than the Celerio by 0.5 Rs per km.

Altroz running cost per km

Celerio running cost per km

Driveability wise, both are good.

Altroz diesel can be a much better car for long journeys, effortlessly doing 120 kmph all day and still being fairly quiet in the cabin (2600 rpm in 5th). Celerio feels strained beyond 90 kmph and the NVH is bad beyond 100 kmph.

When you drive gently, Altroz diesel can deliver excellent fuel efficiency. This is from my today's workload - 120+ km usage, mostly driven under 90 kmph except for a few instances of 120 kmph overtaking manoeuvres. 24.1 kmpl.

And then there is the looks factor, which is totally subjective.

You should pick which you find better.

Or

If you ask me which car I like better, here is the answer from the mileage I have clocked on both.

Time since purchase and Km driven:

• Altroz diesel - 6.5 months 17,700 km
• Celerio K10C - 5 months 1,500 km

Clearly, if you love driving, get the Altroz eyes closed. Also, be cautious about DPF issues if you have more urban usage than highway usage. Celerio steering is typical Maruti - vague and lifeless.

If your need is just practical point A to point B transport on a rigid budget, Celerio is a good car (Ignis is also a good choice in that budget, with a much better engine).

Check out BHPian comments for more insights and information.

Previously we had bought Maruti Brezza diesel for the managers & Swift petrol for the executives. Now the team is expanding & we need to have more cars.

BHPian TallBoy recently shared this with other enthusiasts.

I manage a company in the agri-input sector. We have pan-India operations with the majority of our Sales team based out of B & C towns across the country. They travel extensively and their work takes them to villages and farmlands. Most roads that they travel on are fairly motorable and even if there is an odd plot of land that seems inaccessible, they can easily park at a distance and walk down.

We now need to augment them with some vehicles as the team is expanding. In the earlier instance, we purchased diesel Brezzas for the managers and petrol powered Swifts for some of the executives. We now have to buy 12 vehicles in the next quarter - 3 for managers and 9 for executives.

These will be self-driven vehicles and a five-seater is more than adequate. The average usage of these vehicles is around 4,000 kilometers per month for the managers and about 2,000 kilometers per month for executives. The first Brezza that we bought in November 2016, has done around 2.35 lakh kilometers and is acting up quite frequently of late.

While I wish there was a Toyota CSUV that I could go for blindfolded (I have used Innovas in succession from 2007 till date), there is none!

Which vehicles would you recommend for the managers and which ones for the executives, considering the total cost of ownership over a 4-5 year period? Our budget is a maximum of around 12-14 lakhs for the managers and 7-7.5 lakhs for the executives.

For executives, we also give them an option of using their own car and reimbursing them at a rate of Rs.9 per kilometer. If you think that would be a better option instead of the company owning a 7 lakh asset and bearing all the running costs, please suggest so. For managers, we have decided to give company-owned cars.

Thank you for the patient reading and advice.

Here's what BHPian Turbanator had to say about the matter:

Foremost, you must understand that the asset you will give to employees has to be cared for the same way they will do their own. But unfortunately, it does not happen, and you will find new cars turning into shambles down the lane.

I suggest you consider buying these in your company name and deduct the basic amount, for example, Ex-showroom prices divided into 60 instalments, without any interest/road tax or insurance. Cars will be run in the company name and maintained by the company but transferred to employees after completion of instalments. If they find EMI a little higher, they can keep a balloon payment at the time of sale. If an employee leaves early, they can pay company overheads and take the car, or in case they don't want to take the car, you can pay back a portion of the monies they paid.

This helps maintain the cars in great shape and keeps the employees engaged with you. In addition, they can use the vehicle for personal use without any hindrance and will feel proud socially.

Now, coming to what car, I don’t have much experience in this segment but can recommend you to stick either with Toyota or Maruti only. Both have strong work ethics and very tight control over the dealers.

Here's what BHPian BlackPearl had to say about the matter:

Mahindra Bolero for executives and Bolero Neo for managers will be good I believe.

Here's what BHPian AkMar had to say about the matter:

Given the usage, diesel makes sense. For the managers, you can go for Nexon or Altroz Diesel. Nexon has been in the market for long enough, so there is less to worry about Tata reliability issues.

Getting a diesel in the Executive budget will be difficult. So you can look at the Marutis here. Ignis/Swift/WagonR, you won't go wrong with any of these. If CNG is available in the areas where the vehicles are used, WagonR, Celerio CNG are your options.

Here's what BHPian chinkara had to say about the matter:

In cars, I would suggest Wagon R for executives and Bolero, Nexon or Brezza for managers. Wagon R is a very comfortable car for long drives and reasonably ok on rough roads given the price band. 20 years back I did a lot of rural marketing in the old Wagon R.

Check out BHPian comments for more insights and information.