[dkamath]

This one was a bit fast for me to catch up. Was walking back home yesterday evening, when a sky-blue coloured Tata Marcopolo passed by. It had sliding windows and was not rear-engined. The rear tail lamp clusters resembles those on the new Marcopolo Starbus series. Will try taking a picture sometime. Anyone else who spots it before i do, please take pics and post here.

[teamveevee]

Originally Posted by dkamath

This one was a bit fast for me to catch up. Was walking back home yesterday evening, when a sky-blue coloured Tata Marcopolo passed by. It had sliding windows and was not rear-engined. The rear tail lamp clusters resembles those on the new Marcopolo Starbus series. Will try taking a picture sometime. Anyone else who spots it before i do, please take pics and post here.

Is it this one? Courtesy: AUTOPEDIA
http://picasaweb.google.com/raghunat...at=directlink#

[dkamath]

Originally Posted by teamveevee

Is it this one? Courtesy: AUTOPEDIA
Picasa Web Albums - Raghu - Marcopolo bui...

Hi, yes it is! Wonder how Raghu (the contributor of these images) seems to catch up with these buses even before they begin plying on the roads . (going by the date of his posting, it's been more than a month since he's spotted it).

Originally Posted by VibrantSoul

Hey Guys
I happened to spot a few of the newly inducted Ashok Leyland low-floor buses in DTC's fleet, and have been seeing quite a few of them on Delhi's roads. I took a short ride in one of them, and here are the pictures:

grt pics mate...real close up ones but i guess DTC has a better service on RE than other STUs

[kadri007]

Originally Posted by teamveevee

Is it this one? Courtesy: AUTOPEDIA
Picasa Web Albums - Raghu - Marcopolo bui...

I have seen this bus thrice in Bangalore. One is plying in 401 route.
Will try to capture its pics soon.

[VibrantSoul]

Originally Posted by santoshnair

grt pics mate...real close up ones but i guess DTC has a better service on RE than other STUs

Thank you
If you mean to say that DTC has the largest operational fleet of RE buses, then yes, and they are MUCH more comfortable than the old ones in the fleet, and they're faster too.

DTC doesn't have Volvo in its fleet yet, since Volvo wasn't offering CNG-powered buses in India till one was unveiled at the Auto Expo in January. Now I'd love to see DTC purchase Volvo CNGs, since Volvo buses are anytime a notch higher than AL or Tata. (Plus I like the new face of the Volvo CNG )

[tsk13]

A small section of Blueline Drivers brought bad name to the entire community BUT these Blueline drivers are the more disciplined than DTC drivers. Their Bluelines are well maintained and their exteriors are in much better condition than DTC's.

Whenever they've to take a turn they give prior intimation (mostly hand signals) and if you honk for space, they'll be courteous enough to give a hand signal to let you go. The DTC drivers on the other hands nowhere practice this and drive as if the road belongs to their Dad. Bruises and dents on account of reckless driving in DTC goes unaccountable hence drivers make a mockery of it whereas Bluelines are answerable to their owners and treat their rides with respect (they earn their bread from it), that's why Bluelines are well maintained. Poor Blueline drivers as because of a miniscule number of Killer drivers (Relatively) the whole community suffers from tag of Killers.

[VibrantSoul]

True, to an extent. However, call it a psychological block or a clichèd mindset, I still get the shudders whenever I have to travel by a blueline. I somehow always prefer waiting for a DTC rather than travelling by a blueline. Maybe this has to do, in part, with the 2 accidents that my dad has had with blueline buses. Bad experiences.

I do agree on one account, and that is, the DTC drivers do not feel responsible for the buses they drive and don't give hand signals, and with these new low-floor buses with the auto-transmissions and the surge of power at their hands, quite a few of them make wrong use of it.
But I guess things are improving. The indicators on the buses work, for once, and they are used nowadays by the drivers, which is a blessing.

i still dont understand why cant TATA and AL make something like volvo we have the best brains and engineering guys .

[r_nairtvm]

Originally Posted by santoshnair

i still dont understand why cant TATA and AL make something like volvo we have the best brains and engineering guys .

On the engine/engineering side low expertise in Mettalurgy and lack of R & D in Heavy Engineering segment are two obvious reasons pointed out time and again.

The same reasons make a normally used Indica engine (or any other engine developed without a foreign tie-up), for exmple, to be in need of an engine rebuild at around 1 Lakh KM on the odo, whilst a Suzuki Diesel or any of the new tech engines come to that state well over 2- 2.5 Lakh KM on the odo.

About the body/interiors/safety etc only now India is begining to flaunt its taste for the class, convenience and Safety, we need to give the Tata and AL couple of years more to catch up.

Just my thoughts

Best Regards & Drive/Ride Safe

Ram

[Ashley2]

Originally Posted by santoshnair

i still dont understand why cant TATA and AL make something like volvo we have the best brains and engineering guys .

Its the same reason as why Hindustan Motors and PAL were not able to make cars like Toyota and Honda.
But they cant be literally compared with TML/AL as these two companies have made several efforts tobe in line with the market changes unlike the former and they are doing a better job too.
Until 2002 or so AL was making only about 30K vehicles/annum.But now they have crossed 80000 and they are going stronger.
If you could take the case of TML they had good technical partners like Cummins,ZF,Marcopolo and even their Korean arm Tata Daewoo.
With them they are coming up.
- Understanding the Market .
- Closer to Customer.
- Appropriate products and services
are few positives they have.
I am sure they dont have the Engineering Edge or technological advancements of their global counter parts, but still they can fairly peform well.
Lets give sometime for them to reach those heights.

[teamveevee]

Originally Posted by santoshnair

i still dont understand why cant TATA and AL make something like volvo we have the best brains and engineering guys .

If you think about it, Volvo is in a niche segment that sells < 1000 per year and this segment is already crowded. TM and AL sells >30,000 vehicles per year. I think it is better to use the R&D money on this segment instead of go after the Volvo/MB segment. I think it is a wise decision, in case they needed to enter the premium segment, they could partner with Iveco(TM) or Nissan Diecel/UD(AL) instead of going on their own.
Why do you think Volvo tied up with Eicher? They realized to survive in India, they need to make cheaper/less quality buses, but at the at same time with out damaging the Volvo brand across the world.

[vharihar]

Originally Posted by santoshnair

i still dont understand why cant TATA and AL make something like volvo we have the best brains and engineering guys .

Excellence in manufacturing calls for a totally different expertise than excellence in software. India is generally well known for excellence in IT s/w devp, where we are, crudely speaking, "servants of the world", aka great at delivering on outsourcing. I have been in software devp as well as manufacturing. Trust me, mfg expertise calls for something far, far greater, in terms of technical knowhow as well as capital expense. To give you an idea, just visit www.tsmc.com (it is the world's leading semiconductor foundry manufacturer), click on About TSMC->Company Profile->Executives. Out of 18 corp executives, 13 are PhDs. I have interned in this company, and happen to know that it is flooded with PhD's and state of the art equipment.

Coming back to the point at hand, the engine design is the heart of the design. In the companies that succeed in such core areas (Toyota, Honda, GM, etc), the R&D grps are staffed with a huuuge many reputed PhDs. They participate in international conferences, publish scientific papers in internationally refereed journals, frequently come up with patents, etc. They work in labs (in their company) that are equippied with state of the art (and usually expensive) equipments. Huuuge amounts of research effort are required to even come up with 5% improvement in some characteristic (such as Torque-speed, or FE, or emission, or reliability, etc). Also, their work practices are matured to a point where they dont make repeat mistakes.

We have to be proud of Tata and M&M (and AL, but to a lesser extent) in that they have speeded up in these R&D areas in the last one/two decades. But they have a long way to go compared to to the likes pf Volvo, Toyota, etc.

I dont have the same respect for Maruti and Volvo *in India*, where they are essentially screwdriver technologists. They just shift/replicate in India the mfg assy line of one of their already-proven models. I have a lot of respect for Suzuki and Volvo in their countries of origin (Japan and Sweden), where they indeed do the kind of research that I mentioned above.

Thanx
/Venkat

[Trapezio]

^^

Very true. You nailed it with 'screwdriver technology'!

i agree so does this call for a more professional and quality approach?