[Sebring]

The cabin looks beautiful, and interiors are well appointed. I have been eyeing the 'quilt type' leather seat covers. This quality is definitely not available in India and that's the first thing you notice and are impressed with. Wonder where they sourced it from.

[naveen.raju]

Saw a customer car today. Got a premium look and had a good road presence. Unfortunately didn't get to see the front end.

[blacksport]

Originally Posted by spkingsley

Ssangyong is not a Chinese brand , it's a Korean brand which started off with Joint ventures with Mercedes-Benz. It was owned by a Chinese auto major for a short period before being taken over by Mahindra.

My apologies for getting the nationality of the vehicle wrong. If I am to explain why I ended up making that mistake I might end up painting me as a racist - which unequivocally I am not.

However I am mighty amused that a few pages earlier in the thread, people were claiming patriotism as a reason to buy this Chinese (sorry, Korean) brand.

Are we even sure what this new car brings to the scene which the established players doesn't?

Brand image? Luxury? Reliability? Looks? Ride/Handling? Fuel Economy? Nothing?

At least the Price???

Is it at least significantly cheaper to buy? Remember, the XUV came with a shock pricing and all the folks who were criticizing the car for it super-ugly looks took a U turn and started praising the car? Is the Alturas cheap to buy? No?

Then why should anyone buy this contraption when you have three might brands - Toyota, Ford and Isuzu - selling thee very capable SUVs in the segment?

So why do we have to sing paeans for this car?

[mallumowgli]

Originally Posted by blacksport

Brand image? Luxury? Reliability? Looks? Ride/Handling? Fuel Economy? Nothing?

At least the Price???

How did you conclude that they are bringing nothing of the above? In terms of price there are cheaper by a few lakhs compared to Ford or Toyota

Then why should anyone buy this contraption when you have three might brands - Toyota, Ford and Isuzu - selling thee very capable SUVs in the segment?

So this is a contraption. Why?

[prakash_ajp]

Originally Posted by blacksport

Brand image? Luxury? Reliability? Looks? Ride/Handling? Fuel Economy? Nothing?

At least the Price???

From the list you mentioned:
Looks - Subjective and since this is not terrible looking vehicle, check
Luxury - from the few who have actually sat in the car, check
Fuel economy - who cares if you are spending 30L on a car. "check"
Price - depends. If I were in the market, I will take the 3-4L saving and not worry about fuel/maintenance for the next five years - Let's call it a "tie"

Reliability - let's just say "uncheck"
Branch/Image - Let's say "uncheck"
Ride/Handling - we don't know, so, "tie"

So, it's not all dull and gloomy.

Originally Posted by blacksport

Then why should anyone buy this contraption when you have three might brands - Toyota, Ford and Isuzu - selling thee very capable SUVs in the segment?

So why do we have to sing paeans for this car?

I understand you are going along with your "Chinese made" narrative and trying to justify that by calling it a "contraption". But my bone of contention is that you put the Isuzu in that list. In Indian context, Isuzu is just a truck maker and I would say far behind in perceived value comparing with Mahindra.

BTW, if you have ever been to China and ever bought things from them you will appreciate that they make much better things than India. There's no comparison, period.

[avira_tk]

Originally Posted by prakash_ajp

But my bone of contention is that you put the Isuzu in that list. In Indian context, Isuzu is just a truck maker and I would say far behind in perceived value comparing with Mahindra.

That's pretty new, Isuzu has got a great brand booster in the v Cross, modded ones are all over the place. If anything, it's proof you can afford a proper lifestyle vehicle. Isuzu also has a reputation for being rugged and reliable, in the same ballpark as Toyota, the old Tavera sold on the Isuzu engine thing for the longest time.

The brand is ahead of mahindra, except for the weak dealership network.

[vigneshkumar31]

As we all eagerly wait for the official TBhp review., I wonder if the reviewers could organise an exclusive special shoot out for us -between the Fortuner, Endeavour, and the Alturas.

We have been debating if the g4 worth its salt, but there's only one way to find out. It would be interesting to see them battle it out in various aspects/categories befitting the quintessential premium 7 seater 4WD SUV.

Many folks/media houses/vloggers/anybody with a camera out there is a 'reviewer' nowadays. So we must see a slew of comparo videos in this hotly contested segment.

But a high quality unbiased review can come out only from Tbhp. I personally think since Mahindra has taken this huge step and has taken the fight to the incumbents' door in a segment that has been unbreached for all these years, a shootout is absolutely warranted.

The market will respond to G4 in its own way, and maybe it be lukewarm at best. It won't be able to dethrone the reigning monarch. But as enthusiasts, we must be curious about the effort.

For once, lets say- No badge, no lineage, no service intervals, no resale value, no market share, no annual turnover, no prejudice, no baggage. Let the market respond and consider all those factors as part of their buying decision. And all these have to be considered if any of us are planning to put our money on this. But Im curious what happens if its just one car against another- mano a mano.

The G4 is here looking for a fight...it should get a bout in the ring.

[blacksport]

Originally Posted by mallumowgli

How did you conclude that they are bringing nothing of the above? In terms of price there are cheaper by a few lakhs compared to Ford or Toyota

The question was, what does this car bring to the table that its competitors don't. See my quoted post below with the pertinent part highlighted. The XUV at least had the cheap price (more metal per dollar) going for it, but a 2-3L difference in the 30L+ segment is nothing worth considering.

Originally Posted by blacksport

Are we even sure what this new car brings to the scene which the established players doesn't?

Brand image? Luxury? Reliability? Looks? Ride/Handling? Fuel Economy? Nothing?

At least the Price???

[volkman10]

Altura debuts in the November sales chart.

1. Alturas G4 216
2. Fortuner 1475
3. Endeavour 433

Source:Auto Punditz

[PrideRed]

Originally Posted by volkman10

Altura debuts in the November sales chart.

1. Alturas G4 216
2. Fortuner 1475
3. Endeavour 433

Source:Auto Punditz

216 should include demo vehicles. That said, I expect atleast 150-200 customers every month to plonk their money on Alturas. I re-iterate, the car looks competitive however reliability, availability of spares and BRAND is a big concern and I believe these don't need a test drive. It's second attempt from Mahindra, and I don't think people perceive value worth 35lac in Brand Mahindra yet. This is not a bad thing and I think each brand should know its consumer and how much they are valued. Ask yourself a simple question- Octavia offers all features of say Audi A4(More in case of RS). Now at 33 lacs RS is sheer value but will you buy if it was priced 50lacs?

[ralto]

There was a healthy discussion in some previous posts regarding the off-road capabilities of Alturas.
Well seems SsangYong thinks it is good enough as they have launched a UTE (utility version similar to V-cross) spinoff in a few markets.

On top of that, they are throwing in a 7-year warranty.

A recent review by folks at CarAdvice.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LXMbsJ4mLA

[However, presenter's enthusiasm is not much to speak off, IMO.]

[shashanka]

Originally Posted by Superleggera

Slightly Off topic. We had a pure desi name from HM, the "Veer", also the "Gurkha" from Force
Not sure if veer has seen the road ever.
Source.

Hello Superleggera, you have just added a nugget to my collection! I had not heard of the "Veer" from HM. Though of course the Gurkha is a worthy contender in the desi name stakes. Was the Veer a version of the Ambassador or something different?

[vigneshkumar31]

Noticed that the easy ingress feature might get a little annoying or a little getting used to depending on how you look at it. While the entry is nice with the automatic sliding back of the seat, it's weird when you sit on it and it tries to move ahead again. Also while seated if you open the door the seat sliding back again is unsettling..'maybe needs some anticipation and waiting time for getting used to..

[vigneshkumar31]

Stopped by at the showroom with family, to get their inputs.

• Whole family was impressed with the interiors at first look. Agreed it was premium and were impressed with the quilted napa leather treatment.
• Having just stepped off the Storme, they felt that the space and headroom is a little tighter but still seats bolstering and seating was good.
• Mrs. found it very convenient to use the electric seat adjust on the driver seat to find comfortable configuration and save it as memory. Tried switching between my seat height and the saved memory and worked like a charm. The Storme, we are used to doing this manually, so convenience was appreciated.
• The birds eye view camera was new theatric none of them had seen anywhere before.
• Mrs. also remarked that though features was long she felt the dash to have too many buttons and options, so is constantly searching for a specific function. This will need getting get used to of course.
• MIL found it extremely difficult to climb onto the high second row, with no side step. This will be a compulsory accessory for any family.
• Though I discouraged the last dark third row attempts, Mrs. and kid found it just adequate, especially with the reclining option. The second row not being able to slide ahead does make the legroom tight.
• The sunroof was an instant hit with my son as expected, as he popped his head joyfully like a meerkat.
• The black colour display vehicle parked next to XUV looked smashing.

Overall, everyone liked the car and gave a big thumbs up to its interior cabin but once I bleated out the price, there was a brief pause and all agreed it looked like it was well worth the price. But quickly, Mrs. followed: 'We have a Tata already and for the next car why not push for the ford Endeavour, if its just a few lakhs more than this Mahindra?'


I was schooled in brand perception and perceived value right there. These are not enthusiasts or don't care about how much torque the engine makes at low end, but these are a very valuable part of my decision making process..No matter how many quants i rattle off in favour of the G4, they see the brand as an important part of the family car's identity.


...And that is precisely the uphill battle that Mahindra faces.










OT: Everyone in the family gravitated to the shark Marazzo which was parked alongside the G4 and gave it a big thumbs up for sheer practicality and loved its simple neat appointment. True COTY.

[vigneshkumar31]

The activity on this thread reflects the market's response to the product- lukewarm. I have been posting back to back over the past week. :P

But finally managed a test drive of the Alturas G4. Here are some quick points IMHO. The reference I benchmark it against would be my Storme, so please adjust perspective according to the ride you are used to.

Exterior Looks

The car is huge. Looks huge and is huge. It is longer and wider than my already colossal Storme. Looks only smaller in profile because of Storme's height and fuller box back which very few SUVs can match for height.









I personally prefer the international ssangyong grill to this Mahindra grill, but still it manages to look neat. Kudos to M&M for showing restraint on design front and keeping the front bold and imposing. No over the top gashes or chiselling for animal imitations, which IMHO I have felt over the top. Joining the cheetah and the shark is this G4 musso (aptly named, means rhino in Korean, also the name for the pickup which is based on this SUV.-yes pickup based on the SUV and not the other way round, but thats a different story)

The most uninspiring aspect of the car is that alloy wheel. An 18 inch poker face of an alloy wheel. Its an ill fitting mute spectator to the grandeur that hangs around rest of the car. A size too small and a tad bit boring.

The LED cluster and the headlight assembly and the jawbone contours are neat and give a satiating stance to the front. Despite the 244 high GC, the extensive, dropping front black bumpers below the chrome treatment kills the approach angle.

Overall a good looking car which will tick all the boxes for street cred and sheer road presence.



Interior Looks

As already brought out by anyone who has sat in it- It is perhaps one of the best in class. Very well put together and the quilted Napa reassures the feeling of plush in the cabin.



The tan does appeal to the regal narrative that they are trying to sell but I love the white interiors that is offered overseas.











This would have taken up the luxury quotient to a different league. But of course, it would be mighty impractical to maintain in our conditions. There are a few inconsistent hard plastic bits and certain dials feel not consonant with the rest of the high quality appointments, but overall a very comfortable place to be.

<sincere apologies for shooting portrait>

https://vimeo.com/305918946

Features and Comfort

Open the doors and the seats slide back and give you un-clumsy entry into the tall car. Get seated and comfortable, while the seat slides to the last preset memory setting. The one touch memory function is a useful feature, especially if you have to swap the car with spouse/other drivers. Also can be a boon when some inconsiderate valet disturbs your sweet spot setting. Each time you open the door regardless of whether you are seated or not, the seat does slide back. This will need getting used to.

Easter egg : Where's the keyhole on the door handle?

The footboard is sorely missed. At 6feet, Im used to sliding into the storme, so was not much of an issue for me, but for any other passenger in my family it would be quite a climb. I did see a nice looking sidestep in the international version, the SA did confirm that it is available as an accessory. I have attached the accessory brochure which concurs (please skip the first page of accessories offered if you don't like chrome deluge)

The driver seating arrangement for my position conveyed more of a 'sitting in' the car, with the high dash, and the driver well sunk into the cavernous driver seat and foot well area. This is stark contrast for me from the 'sitting on' the Storme with its low window lines and large glasshouse.

I could find a nice sweet spot for me with adequate headroom easily after fidgeting with the electric seat adjust. Steering is tilt and telescopic adjustable.The headroom worries that always loomed dark in my mind are put to rest. It is adequate even with the sunroof contraption, but no where near the skyline that the storme has.


Another very useful feature is the surround view camera. While reversing in tight spaces, the multiple views that the ICE screen shows is useful. I Have no such contraption in storme, except a rear view camera, and have been simply winging it over these blindspots. But this 360 degree view does make you well aware
of everything around you. For a first timer, I found it too much information to absorb and couldn't get my orientation right as to which is showing what. The video below shows me reversing to park the Alturas in front of my storme and alongside a platform kerb. The split screen in the display shows the side clearance to the pavement and the birdseye view which is pretty neat. The display in the speedometer console, shows a proximity alert and an audible alarm like a conventional reverse sensor. Once you slot into R, the ORVMs automatically slant downwards giving you a better view of the road just behind you. And if you have time amidst all this keeping you busy, please look at the IRVM also, which by the way is manual, not auto dimming.

https://vimeo.com/305917790

The 360 view camera can also be activated while driving, for a quick look around, but only at low speeds, (which seems logical)

The aircon works well and not noisy. Couldn't test it too much given Delhi winters. The ventilated seats are a huge welcome for me personally and would love to see them work and check out its effectiveness in summer.

Sunroof has a manual blind. Slide the shade back and the transparent glass ceiling, makes the otherwise darker shade cabin open up suddenly to a much welcome ambient light influx. The first row only sunroof has an slide-open and a slant-up option all operated by the same switch placed overhead. Though well intended, its no match for the ford endeavour's panaroma.

The cabin is well insulated and I would rate it high in NVH attributes. Road noise and engine noise are kept well outside, where they belong. Slot into tiptronic and go manual and the motor is audible if you hold gears longer. The manual gear selector is irritating, hard to operate and hard to find by feel as its tiny, and oh so counter intuituve.

Drive

Though this is the smallest engine in the segment, I was impressed with the power it juices out. The pickup and acceleration were a sure upgrade from my Storme, but not brutal like the 3.2 Endy churning 200bhp/470Nm. My storme which is a 2.2 varicor unit, and the only comparison I can benchmark unfairly against, puts out a modest 140bhp/330Nm, in comparison this G4 puts out a T fort matching 180bhp/420Nm. The other 2.2 in the neighbourhood is the base variant of the Endeavour which spews 158bhp/385Nm. The numbers might not tell the full story, but this is not just another paper tiger either, the performance is surely tangible. Most urban based drivers like myself, will surely come back from the drive impressed.

The car doesn't feel that heavy and is an easy driver. But I felt the steering to be a little too -carefree light-for my liking. Overall it does make the car easy to manoeuvre through heavy traffic, and that tight turning radius actually translates on the road to some smiling U turns. The car feels planted and tackled bumps and broken patchy roads effortlessly. From the drivers seat, i found the ride to be sorted and wouldn't call the body roll excessive as reported elsewhere. Have to ride in second row to give an opinion on overall ride quality. Don't even bother about the third row, its a dark nook, only for distant relatives, whom you shove there and forget. Second row not sliding, will ensure their knees are bunched and they are humbled. They get a dedicated AC vent with adjustment to give them some hope to live.

My Humble Opinion

As one who is emotionally invested in this segment, and hopes to be financially invested soon too, this is how I see it:-

First there was the Fortuner monopoly. The Jap reliability supergiant from the East, commanded a premium for what it offers and sells more than all other competition put together. Their sway over the market continues and rightly so, because they offer exactly what the market values at this price point, and the market is always right. But we always paid up whatever they asked for, didn't have a worthy scale to hold it against. Toyota wanted our soul, and we gladly gave it to them...the price was never negotiated.

Then came the Endeavour, infusing the Western angle.Big, butch, americana, with all that it offers, it tilted the scales for those who looked closely and dug deeper. Its true value for where it sits. Offers what the discerning buyer wants, if he has overcome the binding spell of the mighty fortuner.

The G4 to me, completes this triad of perspective, and answers what if there was a middle ground? Not east or west, but what if a home badge throws their glove in?

If you, like myself, always wondered if the premium we pay for the Toyota badge and associated reliability/resale is actually worth it, this car will amplify that emotion.(The fact that we will go ahead and pay that premium anyway is another story)

If you,like myself, always wondered what a complete package the 3.2 Endeavour is in this segment, well this car will amplify that emotion too, interestingly.

Overall, after an unprejudiced test drive, I came back pretty impressed with the car.

If you look beyond the M on its nose, or the double dragons under the hood, this car attempts to rub shoulders with the best in the segment and perhaps would ruffle a few feathers even above its weight. The car is surely worth its asking price perhaps in a 'sum of parts' sense. With the CKD and all it offers I doubt if its even possible to price it lower.

But honestly, if I had to sink money into this segment, I would still pick the Endeavour 3.2.

But that's just me.