[shashant]

Originally Posted by shabash

No I don't think the prices are announced. But going by what the range is being defined by Autocar and other auto media, it seems to be at par with Cretas and Seltos's of the world.

People are buying anything these days that looks like SUV. Elevate may not be a revolutionary product but it ticks most of the boxes. Same with the brand, it still has better brand pull than Renault, Nissan, VW, Citreon etc.

[pannags]

Originally Posted by shabash

As someone already said earlier, there is no USP for Elevate and Honda is no more an aspirational brand. The only aspect was pricing and that too looks to be on the higher side. So there is nothing that will bring the buyer to the showroom and further buy it.

The vehicle is not even launched, and therefore, all the talk about pricing are speculative. Here is how I think the Elevate fares against competing CSUVs from the respective brands:

Realibility == Toyota, Maruti >= Hyundai, Kia >> Volkswagen, Skoda
Safety < Volkswagen, Skoda > Hyundai, Kia, Maruti, Toyota
Features <= Volkswagen, Skoda, Maruti, Toyota << Hyundai, Kia
Space > Toyota, Maruti, Volkswagen, Skoda >= Hyundai, Kia
Novelty == Volkswagen, Skoda, Toyota >= Hyundai, Kia, Maruti

Design & Performance are subjective depend on perception and wants, so hard to compare.

Essentially, the Elevate scores well as a package, and that is its USP.

[VinsWagen]

Originally Posted by outdoorlover

As much as we ridicule Honda India for waking up from their slumber to realise that India needs a cross-over while still overlooking the other immediate need for a hybrid, if you want to keep your friendship with your friend, please donot recommend him the DSG from VW/ Skoda stable. With its infamous reliability and costing a bomb to replace, it is better recommended to foes

Not sure if it's applicable to someone who seems to have lived with a Skoda Rapid DSG for 10 years. In fact, it is very tough to switch from VAG - Skoda cars to Hyundai or Maruti, or even a Toyota once you have owned a VAG DSG and experienced how it drives.

Honda Elevate has a unique opportunity to fill in for the biggest pain points of the masters of the segment. Skoda-Volkswagen on Reliability and Hyundai-Kia on Safety provided it can top up the City on the safety tests. It already betters Maruti on CSUV brand value.

[outdoorlover]

Originally Posted by true_sedan

Honda has priced the Elevate correct w.r.t to the Honda City. A Rs. 1-2 lakh premium so as to not undercut the City sales is justified. But Honda has not priced it right w.r.t to the segment overall. It is a latecomer that does nothing to excite potential buyers or try to convert people considering other mid-size SUVs. For a powerful and fun to drive car I'll go with Kushaq or Taigun. For features and creature comforts I'll go with Creta or Seltos. Where does this leave the Elevate?

I think they should have called it Honda "Sedate" instead of Honda Elevate, going by the not-so exciting anything that they have to offer. With no offence meant, it will be targeted at buyers who still rely on Honda's old reputation of reliability, notwithstanding the fact that their customer service levels may be at the lowest levels amongst Japanese cars in India currently, old tested engine and gear-box. No turbo engine or hybrid too. So in essence, everything predictable and nothing new to excite- welcome to Honda Sedate!

[Guna]

Originally Posted by VinsWagen

Not sure if it's applicable to someone who seems to have lived with a Skoda Rapid DSG for 10 years. In fact, it is very tough to switch from VAG - Skoda cars to Hyundai or Maruti, or even a Toyota once you have owned a VAG DSG and experienced how it drives.

I don't know how Elevate drives but there are some advantages of a good NA engine mated to CVT in the city driving. There is no initial turbo lag and once you know how to handle the rubber-band effect, CVT feels like a single speed gearbox. Punch my i20 CVT gives at low speeds (<30-40 kmph) is unmatched by my Tiguan Allspace (DSG). Off course it starts screaming if you push it above this speed . Elevate may turn out to be a good city car.

[outdoorlover]

Originally Posted by Guna

I don't know how Elevate drives but there are some advantages of a good NA engine mated to CVT in the city driving. There is no initial turbo lag and once you know how to handle the rubber-band effect, CVT feels like a single speed gearbox. Punch my i20 CVT gives at low speeds (<30-40 kmph) is unmatched by my Tiguan Allspace (DSG). Off course it starts screaming if you push it above this speed . Elevate may turn out to be a good city car.

The Honda CVT is actually quite different from other standard CVTs like Nissan's and other mfrs. Nissan was the original pioneer in CVTs globally, and their rubber band effect is quite pronounced. Honda CVTs are actually a hybrid of belts with gears which tends to eliminate the pronounced rubber band effect that you see with other manufacturers. In fact with the Gen4 City, they introduced it first to India (the earlier City was a Torque converter automatic) and I had done a detailed research on it before buying my City at that time and I have not been disappointed. In a nutshell, Honda's CVT is probably one of the best CVTs there is in the market today and time tested in the Indian market for 9 years now.

[fhdowntheline]

Having used both the Nissan X-tronic and Honda's CVT extensively, I would say that for the small- medium capacity cars (1.2-1.5 litre) there isnt a significant difference actually. The rubber band effect is very much there in the City, and the only way you can mitigate is to keep the car in Sports mode or use paddle shifters to prepare for an overtaking maneuver and hope that the car you are overtaking is not a turbo charged beast acting demurely. It is not exciting to drive CVT NA cars on the market currently.

[motographer]

Originally Posted by Xaos636

Launch details were discussed at Delhi yesterday with most dealer partners in an official dealer meet, conducted just for the Elevate. As per the the discussion, bookings are to start officially on July 03, 2023 and tentative start price is revealed as 11.xx ex showroom and will match Creta SX(O) IVT price for the top variant which is around 22L on road.

If this information is true, I feel it's bad news for Elevate enthusiasts and aspirants and ultimately for Honda. 22 lacs OTR is too high a price. Since 1.5 NA is the only engine option available, it should be compared with only 1.5 NA options of others in the segment(mild hybrid of Grand Vitara/Hyryder) and probably to 1.0 TSI of VW/Skoda.

These are the prices of others (OTR fir Delhi):

Creta SX(o) 1.5 CVT:
Ex SR- 17,53,500
OTR- 20,32,230

Grand Vitara Alpha 1.5(MH) AT:
Ex SR- 16,91,000
OTR- 19,75,395

Hyryder V 1.5(MH) AT:
Ex SR- 17,11,000
OTR- 19,91,805

Kushaq Style 1.0 AT
Ex SR- 15,79,999
OTR- 18,40,497

For the sake of reference, also mentioning price of Kushaq 1.5 and Honda City

Kushaq Style 1.5 DSG
Ex SR- 17,59,999
OTR- 20,48,397

City ZX 1.5 CVT
Ex SR- 16,05,000
OTR- 18,70,135

Point to be made here is that Elevate would be a value proposition only if it's priced equivalent to or maybe 40-50 k above City. It doesn't deserve a premium of 2-3 lacs over City at all. If the price for top variant is 22 lacs as mentioned, it will be priced much higher than it's competition.

Till when will Honda earn out of it's old reputation of reliable cars when other offerings weren't as good. Now competition has improved leaps and bounds. Why is Honda not offering newer technologies which it already has in it's arsenal and is offered in other countries. Why is Indian market not deemed worthy of newer technologies by Honda?

[ravigupta000]

Originally Posted by shashant

People are buying anything these days that looks like SUV. Elevate may not be a revolutionary product but it ticks most of the boxes. Same with the brand, it still has better brand pull than Renault, Nissan, VW, Citreon etc.

But Honda and Elevate won't compete with anything from Citroen, Renault, and Nissan, so having a better brand pull than them is meaningless. Their real competition is the Koreans, and the fellow Japanese brands and their offerings.

[bijims]

Originally Posted by motographer

Point to be made here is that Elevate would be a value proposition only if it's priced equivalent to or maybe 40-50 k above City. It doesn't deserve a premium of 2-3 lacs over City at all. If the price for top variant is 22 lacs as mentioned, it will be priced much higher than it's competition.

Till when will Honda earn out of it's old reputation of reliable cars when other offerings weren't as good. Now competition has improved leaps and bounds. Why is Honda not offering newer technologies which it already has in it's arsenal and is offered in other countries. Why is Indian market not deemed worthy of newer technologies by Honda?

The point to note is that it is 22 lakhs OTR Kerala, not Delhi, Kerala has one of the highest road taxes in India, and the top-spec Creta SX(O) IVT costs around 21.5 lakhs here without discounts, the top-spec City ZX CVT costs around 19.6 lakhs on-road, so in a way, the price is similar to the Creta, but its far more expensive than the City and I don't feel it is justified as well.

[motographer]

Originally Posted by bijims

The point to note is that it is 22 lakhs OTR Kerala, not Delhi, Kerala has one of the highest road taxes in India

Thanks for the info. I didn't know this. And you're right, Elevate doesn't command a premium of 50-60k over Creta and around 2 lacs over City, when it even misses out on a few important convenience and safety features from City which I personally felt didn't needed to be cut down.

[84.monsoon]

Originally Posted by Xaos636

Launch details were discussed at Delhi yesterday with most dealer partners in an official dealer meet, conducted just for the Elevate. As per the the discussion, bookings are to start officially on July 03, 2023 and tentative start price is revealed as 11.xx ex showroom

Honda generally equips the base variants well. Even the base variant of the City used to come with 4 airbags etc. So it is possible that the Elevate base variant if priced at 11 lakhs, may offer a good VFM package, with all essential features present.

That is one of the very few ways this car can compete and differentiate in a crowded segment, where most offerings have more power and torque, better powertrain technologies and variety of propulsion options (NA Petrol, Diesel, Strong Hybrid, Turbo petrol) and a huge number of transmission technologies including iMT, CVT, TC and DSG. Honda is walking into a gunfight with a knife!

[steadfast]

Originally Posted by outdoorlover

As much as we ridicule Honda India for waking up from their slumber to realise that India needs a cross-over while still overlooking the other immediate need for a hybrid, if you want to keep your friendship with your friend, please donot recommend him the DSG from VW/ Skoda stable. With its infamous reliability and costing a bomb to replace, it is better recommended to foes

Well DSG issues are not documented in current lineup of cars. So please refrain from broadcasting this past baggage and better talk to owners of India 2.0 cars about any current DSG issues. Such misleading speculations only lead to wrong advice to prospective buyers.
If any India 2.0 car owners have shared any DSG complaints with you then I welcome your comments on DSG issues.

[outdoorlover]

Originally Posted by steadfast

Well DSG issues are not documented in current lineup of cars. So please refrain from broadcasting this past baggage and better talk to owners of India 2.0 cars about any current DSG issues. Such misleading speculations only lead to wrong advice to prospective buyers.

Oh, I hope it didn't touch any personal affiliation to VW/Skoda. You dont have to be a research scientist to know about their record with DSG reliability, nor is it difficult to hide. There are many horror stories; just citing one from T-BHP itself here...https://www.team-bhp.com/news/my-tig...ability-fix-it

[shabash]

Originally Posted by pannags

Essentially, the Elevate scores well as a package, and that is its USP.

I beg to differ my friend, seeing the features that has been listed in the media, I don't think it really make a compelling package. Only time will tell, I presume.