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Old 24th July 2021, 19:23   #706
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by HimuraKenshin View Post
This is incorrect i think the Spider Timing advancer model is compatible with this model.
Thanks. Have you seen or used a city zx with the same installed ?
Also, what is SPIDER timing advancer. Is it different from the ones installed by the CNG guys in India. ( I think these two are the ones most commonly installed ).

Advice on CNG Conversion-screenshot-182.png

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Old 24th July 2021, 19:27   #707
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

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Originally Posted by self_driven View Post
I've finally decided to go ahead with CNG installation in my 7 year old Swift.

As per my calculations, I'll be saving around Rs. 5 per km. Monthly running is around 1300 kms.

Can anyone point me to some really good installers in Delhi NCR area? Not worried about initial cost but want the kit to run reliably for the next 5-6 years.

I've heard good reviews about Tara Dutt Automobiles near Defence Colony. Any experiences?
Here are some based on my research

1 easy drive auto serices,Ghaziabad

2 Zuby ustad ( search his youtube channel )
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Old 26th July 2021, 11:01   #708
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderinNomad View Post
Thanks. Have you seen or used a city zx with the same installed ?
Also, what is SPIDER timing advancer. Is it different from the ones installed by the CNG guys in India. ( I think these two are the ones most commonly installed ).
The two most commonly used crank based timing advancers in India are COBRA and SPIDER> Bother are designed by AEB, Italy but in India most of the ones you get are clones (nothing wrong with that)
Cobra (referred to ad 510/710)is for cars with an inductive crank sensor. if you plot this signal on a graph it will be a sine wave

Spider (referred to at 511/711) is for cars with a hall effect type sensor, which when plotted on an oscilloscope will have a square wave output.

Both of the above only advance 1 sensor signal(crank), so for cars with vtec or variable timing you need slightly advancer TAPs which advance crank signal along with the cam signal so that there is no error code thrown.
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Old 26th July 2021, 12:02   #709
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by HimuraKenshin View Post
The two most commonly used crank based timing advancers in India are COBRA and SPIDER> Bother are designed by AEB, Italy but in India most of the ones you get are clones (nothing wrong with that)
Cobra (referred to ad 510/710)is for cars with an inductive crank sensor. if you plot this signal on a graph it will be a sine wave

Spider (referred to at 511/711) is for cars with a hall effect type sensor, which when plotted on an oscilloscope will have a square wave output.

Both of the above only advance 1 sensor signal(crank), so for cars with vtec or variable timing you need slightly advancer TAPs which advance crank signal along with the cam signal so that there is no error code thrown.
Thank you for the clarification.
My car is a 2006 Honda city ZX with an iDsi engine. I think that installer has less experience in installing kit in such an old car hence he has said that advancer is not compatible in the car. I have contacted another installer and will be visiting him today for the installation.

Let's see if the performance issue can be resolved by installing an advancer and tuning. If not, the next action step would be to check ignition coils or spark plug wires.
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Old 26th July 2021, 12:43   #710
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Friends,

I am looking to convert 2019 (Oct) Swift VXI AMT from petrol to CNG kit. Went through multiple threads and found its somewhat tricky on BS4/BS6. Also, my Swift is with Extended warranty till 2023.

Called up few installers in BLR.

Bangalore AutoGas
Ecotech Solution - Lovato
Shine Car Gas
CarOGAS

Most of them are quoting 38-47K for Lovato/BRC/Mijo with reducer/advancer included.
They confirmed it suits well for K12 engine of marutis and throttle response would be similar to that of petrol. RTO updates extra.

As per MASS, 2019 Swift VXI is still BS4. Same is mentioned in insurance letter as well.
But, i hear that Swift Petrol engines were BS6 right from Jun 2019.

How do we find out if the engine manufactured is BS4 or BS6. As per installers, if the car is manufactured from Apr 2020, then its considered BS6 else its BS4.

Need some advice on this.
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Old 28th July 2021, 10:53   #711
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderinNomad View Post
Here are some based on my research

1 easy drive auto serices,Ghaziabad

2 Zuby ustad ( search his Youtube channel )
I checked with Easy Drive but they're quoting 65k for Lovato OBD2 kit which I feel is too high for an aftermarket install. The latter seemed to be a shady guy from his way of conversation.

A few local installers around my area have quoted 35-45k for other brands such as Mijo, mSequent, BRC and Zavoli. However, these kits do not come with filter (learnt the importance of these in a recent thread on Team BHP) so I'm only left with Lovato as an option. Again, availability of these filters when it's time for a replacement remains a big question mark.

It seems the price of kits, particularly cylinders, have gone up in recent months as petrol prices inched closer to and ultimately went past Rs. 100/litre. Also, there's news of a new type 4 cylinder that will be made available in the next 4-6 months. It'll be substantially lighter (around 17 kg IIRC) than the current tanks available in the market. I've pushed the install to a later date and might go in for that if the new cylinder's premium is reasonable. Let's see how things unfold.

Last edited by self_driven : 28th July 2021 at 10:56.
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Old 28th July 2021, 22:16   #712
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Hello everyone, so I installed the Lovato Sequential Kit a couple of months ago on my 2012 Honda City, and so far it has been performing nicely and with a lot of savings on the running costs.

It's only lacking in the pick up, in the D mode. In S mode it's fine.

I haven't installed the timing Advancer Kit, on the advise of the installer. Can I now install the Advancer Kit?

The engine bay has become very shabby, so how is the ideal way to have a clean engine bay with all the hardware installed? I'm afraid of using the usual pressure wash done.

Please advice.
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Old 29th July 2021, 00:45   #713
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManasN95 View Post
Hello everyone, so I installed the Lovato Sequential Kit a couple of months ago on my 2012 Honda City, and so far it has been performing nicely and with a lot of savings on the running costs.

It's only lacking in the pick up, in the D mode. In S mode it's fine.

I haven't installed the timing Advancer Kit, on the advise of the installer. Can I now install the Advancer Kit?

The engine bay has become very shabby, so how is the ideal way to have a clean engine bay with all the hardware installed? I'm afraid of using the usual pressure wash done.

Please advice.
Please get the advancer installed, it will solve your pick up issues.
The engine bay shouldn't be shabby if the installer was competent.
Do not get any pressure wash done on the engine in a CNG installed car, also as a precaution cover the electronic parts of cng with a plastic bag so that the service centre accidentally doesn't spray water on the engine bay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by self_driven View Post
I checked with Easy Drive but they're quoting 65k for Lovato OBD2 kit which I feel is too high for an aftermarket install. The latter seemed to be a shady guy from his way of conversation.

A few local installers around my area have quoted 35-45k for other brands such as Mijo, mSequent, BRC and Zavoli. However, these kits do not come with filter (learnt the importance of these in a recent thread on Team BHP) so I'm only left with Lovato as an option. Again, availability of these filters when it's time for a replacement remains a big question mark.

It seems the price of kits, particularly cylinders, have gone up in recent months as petrol prices inched closer to and ultimately went past Rs. 100/litre. Also, there's news of a new type 4 cylinder that will be made available in the next 4-6 months. It'll be substantially lighter (around 17 kg IIRC) than the current tanks available in the market. I've pushed the install to a later date and might go in for that if the new cylinder's premium is reasonable. Let's see how things unfold.
Focus on a good installer rather than the brand of kit. All branded kits are good if the installer has done his work well.

The filter is actually a small component which can be installed in any kit before reducer. You can talk to a couple of installers and ask them to install the filter at extra cost. I saw a video by Zuby that he had installed the filter on special request of a customer in a ciaz. You can also search Mijo on Indiamart, they have filter as an accessory and you can ask them to ship a filter to you. The customer service is quite responsive.

Regarding the prices, they have gone up but you shouldn't bank on them to come down in near future because of oxygen cylinder shortage due to covid as well as high petrol prices. Also CNG kit has an ROI of hardly 9000 km in today's scenario, so even higher prices makes sense.

The lighter cylinder is already in market but it costs Rs 38k-42k ( compared to 12k for the current cylinders) so do the math and the kit cost will easily touch 70k.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackstallion76 View Post
Friends,

I am looking to convert 2019 (Oct) Swift VXI AMT from petrol to CNG kit. Went through multiple threads and found its somewhat tricky on BS4/BS6. Also, my Swift is with Extended warranty till 2023.

Called up few installers in BLR.

Bangalore AutoGas
Ecotech Solution - Lovato
Shine Car Gas
CarOGAS

Most of them are quoting 38-47K for Lovato/BRC/Mijo with reducer/advancer included.
They confirmed it suits well for K12 engine of marutis and throttle response would be similar to that of petrol. RTO updates extra.

As per MASS, 2019 Swift VXI is still BS4. Same is mentioned in insurance letter as well.
But, i hear that Swift Petrol engines were BS6 right from Jun 2019.

How do we find out if the engine manufactured is BS4 or BS6. As per installers, if the car is manufactured from Apr 2020, then its considered BS6 else its BS4.

Need some advice on this.
check your RC as well as parivahan site by entering your car details. You will find out whether it is BS4/BS6.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HimuraKenshin View Post
This is incorrect i think the Spider Timing advancer model is compatible with this model.
I contacted two reputed installers in Delhi and both of them told me that advancer is not compatible with City ZX.
It can be installed in the next gen Honda city I-Vtec.
Also, visited two installers but they were not that knowledgable.

Can you shed some light on this ? Do you or any of your acquaintace use a City ZX with advancer installer ?

Last edited by vb-san : 29th July 2021 at 08:58. Reason: Back-to-back posts merged. Please use multi-quote option when replying to multiple posts. Thank you!
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Old 29th July 2021, 08:23   #714
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderinNomad View Post
.
The engine bay shouldn't be shabby if the installer was competent.
.
No, what I meant was, shabby because of the dirt and dust, the installer was an official Lovato one, so the installation was good & tight.

Thanks, I'll keep in mind about the pressure washes.
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Old 29th July 2021, 08:57   #715
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderinNomad View Post
check your RC as well as parivahan site by entering your car details. You will find out whether it is BS4/BS6.
In RC no mention of BS 4 or BS 6. Checked in VAHAN site, it mentions this "BHARAT STAGE IV/VI". Does it confirm as BS6 only or both BS4 & 6.
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Old 29th July 2021, 09:54   #716
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackstallion76 View Post
In RC no mention of BS 4 or BS 6. Checked in VAHAN site, it mentions this "BHARAT STAGE IV/VI". Does it confirm as BS6 only or both BS4 & 6.
What's the issue with CNG and BS4/BS6?

Irrespective of BS4/BS6, as long as your car has 4 injectors, I don't see why any competent installer would have a problem fitting a CNG kit. The newer variants that came with 8 injectors (DualJet engine) can be tricky for installers to work upon.

Yours could be a BS6 model because BS6 Swift & Dzire were launched a few months after Baleno BS6 which came in mid-2019.
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Old 29th July 2021, 12:24   #717
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by self_driven View Post
What's the issue with CNG and BS4/BS6?

Irrespective of BS4/BS6, as long as your car has 4 injectors, I don't see why any competent installer would have a problem fitting a CNG kit. The newer variants that came with 8 injectors (DualJet engine) can be tricky for installers to work upon.

Yours could be a BS6 model because BS6 Swift & Dzire were launched a few months after Baleno BS6 which came in mid-2019.
thanks sir. Actually, the installer is making me confused to fit imported advancer setup. He is saying the tuning for BS6 may not be good as compared to BS4. For BS6 version, he is saying that he has to import some device and its costs more than 5-7K. Totally, he is quoting 55-60K for full fitting and tuning but not guaranteeing on the response similar to that of BS4 engine.

Will check other installers and find out correct info. Thanks.
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Old 29th July 2021, 20:15   #718
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackstallion76 View Post
thanks sir. Actually, the installer is making me confused to fit imported advancer setup. He is saying the tuning for BS6 may not be good as compared to BS4. For BS6 version, he is saying that he has to import some device and its costs more than 5-7K. Totally, he is quoting 55-60K for full fitting and tuning but not guaranteeing on the response similar to that of BS4 engine.

Will check other installers and find out correct info. Thanks.
If the VAHAN website states does not clarify, maybe maruti suzuki will be able to help.
CNG kit can be easily installed in a BS6 cars and there are a huge number of cars in Delhi NCR running on the same. Even if your car comes with 8 injectors there are specific CNG kits ECU's for the same. The advancer mayalso be different ( I think crank based ) which costs slightly higher.

The problem is with RC endorsement since you will not able to endorse aftermarket CNG on any BS6 cars which means you will have trouble claiming insurance.

So in short:
1 Find out if your car is BS6 or BS4
2 If BS4 you are lucky otherwise you will have to take a call between future insurance claims or lower running cost on CNG.
3 Find the best installer in your area. Any branded kit will do. If you select a good installer, he will be able to install the kit in a BS4/ BS6/ turbocharged/ automatic car.
Tip: Do not mind paying upto 10% extra for a good installer. The extra money spent will be recovered in just a 1000 km on CNG.
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Old 29th July 2021, 20:17   #719
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by ManasN95 View Post
No, what I meant was, shabby because of the dirt and dust, the installer was an official Lovato one, so the installation was good & tight.

Thanks, I'll keep in mind about the pressure washes.

That's all right, in reality you do not really need a clean engine bay. If you have CNG, avoid any engine wash. Or else, Stick with a mild cloth or a spray and wipe only.
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Old 4th August 2021, 03:32   #720
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Default Re: Advice on CNG Conversion

Has someone converted Ford cars into CNG in Delhi successfully?
I have a 2016 Ford Figo (4 cylinder), got a Lovato kit installed in 2017 from AA CNG on Karnal Road, Delhi. The kit never worked properly and had stalling issues and low performance in smaller gears. Even burnt a clutch and a few batteries died because of this The clutch also becomes much heavier on CNG.
I am thinking of removing the kit altogether since I have been running my car exclusively on petrol for a few months and N number of trips to the cng fitment centre were of no avail.
Any advice would be much appreciated.
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